War in Ukraine

#33,827
#33,827
NorthDallas40 said:
But you don’t want to have a debate. You do just as I said you spew whataboutism and non sequiturs. And we rightly call you on it. That isn’t a debate it’s deflection and that’s on you Curly. Womp womp.

On and welcome back again to Curly Danth
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LMAO. You and your womp womp.

I posted plenty of debate material last Friday and your fellow hens came out of the hen house that afternoon with their usual deflections. You guys aren't interested in debates. Just finger pointing, insults and staying on repeat.
 
#33,828
#33,828
AM64 said:
Russia looks to be winding down and Ukraine is building up. Ukraine started out with a lot of ragtag volunteers using anything they had - and held Kiev. Now Ukraine is picking up new and far more lethal weapons, and those volunteers are being trained to use them. You could be right or you could be very wrong in your analysis, but it's too early to start counting chickens before the eggs hatch.
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While it was a nice attempt at fictional writing, I wouldn't give up your day job.
 
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#33,830
#33,830
DonjoVol said:
LMAO. You and your womp womp.

I posted plenty of debate material last Friday and your fellow hens came out of the hen house that afternoon with their usual deflections. You guys aren't interested in debates. Just finger pointing, insults and staying on repeat.
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Your great debate material isn’t any where near the quality you think it is Curly as judged by the posters who see it. Outside of the stooge trio your dog 💩 arguments gain no traction. Clearly that’s all of our failing and we just can’t comprehend or counter your sheer genius right? LMAO
 
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#33,831
#33,831
NorthDallas40 said:
Your great debate material isn’t any where near the quality you think it is Curly as judged by the posters who see it. Outside of the stooge trio your dog 💩 arguments gain no traction. Clearly that’s our failing and we just can’t comprehend or counter your sheer genius right? LMAO
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Judging by what posters? Septic and Hill? LMAO. Like I respect the opinions of those "moderates".
 
#33,834
#33,834
DonjoVol said:
I've actually been mocking your buddies as they are the ones constantly using the terms "strawman", "Non sequitur", and "Whataboutism" because they can't defend the arguments they've made. While a few posts later throwing out non sequiturs and whataboutisms themselves LMAO. So point number 2 definitely applies to your crew here.
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Oh I agree. It's a popular method. But your side is the one arguing that you are the real truth, so I would expect better.

So you going to go back and address my post since your straw man post was a joke?
 
#33,835
#33,835
LouderVol said:
It is. You just dont apply it equally.

You believe it is wrong Ukraine used force to retake its eastern provinces going back 2014. But you dont believe it's wrong that Russia is now using force to kill, in your opinion, hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians, based on your believed K : D ratio.

You believe it's wrong that the west is propping up Ukraine in their losing fight to remain independent. But you had no problem with Russia backing the rebels in a losing fight to be independent. Even though that backing going back 8 years is what to this larger conflict now. If the rebels had just rolled over this would be over.

The slant continues.
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No, actually I don't believe it was wrong for Ukraine to use force to try and retake eastern provinces. I do think the atrocities they committed in doing so were wrong.

However, their use of force (and atrocities) ended up causing a greater power to then use force on them. This is the real world. There are few absolutes.

Also, I don't believe it to be "wrong" for the west to prop up Ukraine, but believe it to be bad policy because there is nothing to gain from it for the average American citizen (however there is plenty for our elite to gain...as usual). If you can't see the difference in America propping up Ukraine and Russia propping up ethnic Russians in Ukraine, then there is no helping you.
 
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#33,836
#33,836
volgr said:
No, Russia went in and put an end to it.
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Instead of letting a small local intra-national event end in 4 months back in 2014, Russia made it a world wide international event event that has kept on for more than 8 years.

Dont ever complain about the US propping up Ukraine while Russia poured enough gasoline on the fire where it was even possible for the US to get to the point of directly propping up Ukraine.
 
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#33,838
#33,838
LouderVol said:
Oh I agree. It's a popular method. But your side is the one arguing that you are the real truth, so I would expect better.

So you going to go back and address my post since your straw man post was a joke?
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Your post has absolutely nothing to do with what I was talking about. I mentioned nothing about nukes.
 
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#33,839
#33,839
NorthDallas40 said:
Great. Then when the rest of the world decides to make Ukraine more mightier and they kick Pootin’s balls out of your sweet caress you shouldn’t complain.
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I'm not complaining nor would I complain. I said from the start if the West puts boots on the ground in Ukraine, Russia is toast. In the same way, if Russia were to start striking western targets outside of Ukraine I wouldn't complain. They have every right to do so at this point. We have foolishly become an enemy combatant. Welcome to the real world.
 
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#33,840
#33,840
volgr said:
I'm not complaining nor would I complain. I said from the start if the West puts boots on the ground in Ukraine, Russia is toast. In the same way, if Russia were to start striking western targets outside of Ukraine I wouldn't complain. They have every right to do so at this point. We have foolishly become an enemy combatant. Welcome to the real world.
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Oh we’ve been in the real world Larry. The only difference is we’ve correctly identified the actual aggressor and cause of this whole situation.
 
#33,841
#33,841
LouderVol said:
Instead of letting a small local intra-national event end in 4 months back in 2014, Russia made it a world wide international event event that has kept on for more than 8 years.
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World wide incident? Crimea and Donbas, 2 places 99% of the world's population couldn't find on a map or know one damn thing about? Get outta here with that non-sense. This was a regional conflict at best until the WEST decided to get involved and turn it into an international event. There are regional conflicts all over the globe and the majority of the world doesn't know or notice most of them. So, why was this one special? Why are YOU so worked up and concerned about Crimea and Donbas? What does it matter to you?
 
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#33,845
#33,845
LouderVol said:
They use a couple methods to avoid ever actually address the arguments.

1." I already answered that." But never can link to the response, or copy it, or give the cliff notes.
2. Use of the terms "straw man", "non sequitur", or "whataboutism". While never explaining how the original comment is actually any of those. And usually it's right after their own red herring or whataboutism.
3. "That's western propaganda" aka shooting the messenger to avoid the message.
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They really are pretty simple
 
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#33,846
#33,846
volgr said:
I have seen no evidence of that being true.
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LOL. You straight up do a killer Baghdad Bob impersonation.

97df728b84b2dee4c1ce6c707d8d6652.jpeg
 
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#33,850
#33,850
volgr said:
I have seen no evidence of that being true.
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Really? Then where was the liberators welcome Russia was expecting? I dont even see the pro Russian sites pushing any media showing people waving the tri colors in occupied Ukraine.

Again there are three separate, or heck even four different, categories people could fall in that dont overlap, of what people are for. There is also the flip in what they are against.

1. Pro Ukraine.
2. Pro Independence.
3. Pro Russia.
4. Pro West.

We havent seen any evidence for the last two.
We saw some Little Green Men evidence of the second one 8 years ago, but nothing sense.
And then we have seen civilians spill their blood for the first.

Then we also have.

5. Anti Ukraine
6. Anti Independence
7. Anti Russia
8. Anti West.

The only evidence of 5 was russia gobbling up ukraine territory.
We saw ukraine express some pretty heavy support of number 6.
We are seeing a whole metric eff ton of number 7.
And again the only evidence we have seen of number 8 is a russian bought off politician, and occupied independence movement at the beginning 8 years ago.

Those eight stances are made up of plenty of variable groups that overlap some areas, but not others. Some people may have been accepting of independence until the Russians got involved. Some may have been anti independence but not if it involved fighting the russians, just two of the examples on any one stance.
 
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