Confederate monuments

[OHvol40]

In what way has the prospect of generational advancement been rendered moot?

Who is talking about generational advancement?

 

[85SugarVol]

Who is talking about generational advancement?

I am. That’s the basic promise of the American Dream - generational upward mobility.

The promise that you can leave your children in a better position than you inherited.
There is no guarantee. There never was.

 

[OHvol40]

I am. That’s the basic promise of the American Dream - generational upward mobility.

The promise that you can leave your children in a better position than you inherited.
There is no guarantee. There never was.

That’s a fairly narrow definition and not what how I would personally choose to define it… but maybe a more comprehensive context is required to dispute the quote.

 

[85SugarVol]

That’s a fairly narrow definition and not what how I would personally choose to define it… but maybe a more comprehensive context is required to dispute the quote.

There are contemporary visions of it that are much more exhaustive and inclusive of all manner of things:

Right to Housing
Guarantee of Income
Access to Healthcare
Happiness and Fulfillment
Justice and Equity
Meaning and Purpose

But the basic premise was always that through hard work and determination, everyone had the opportunity to improve their condition and that of their family.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

 

[GroverCleveland]

The older I get, the more I realize he was telling the truth with comedic delivery.

Meh. I like Carlin as well, but he was no different than anyone else in being right about some things and wrong about others.

 

[dalton_vol]

That’s a fairly narrow definition and not what how I would personally choose to define it… but maybe a more comprehensive context is required to dispute the quote.

If he was alive today, he'd be pushing that weekly covid shot.

 

[OHvol40]

There are contemporary visions of it that are much more exhaustive and inclusive of all manner of things:

Right to Housing
Guarantee of Income
Access to Healthcare
Happiness and Fulfillment
Justice and Equity
Meaning and Purpose

But the basic premise was always that through hard work and determination, everyone had the opportunity to improve their condition and that of their family.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

Meh, I think people get to define it for themselves. That’s liberty.

 

[OHvol40]

Meh. I like Carlin as well, but he was no different than anyone else in being right about some things and wrong about others.

Well of course he was not super-human. My point is he was a truth-teller that happened to have a gift of delivering his truth in an often hilarious and clever way.

 

[OHvol40]

If he was alive today, he'd be pushing that weekly covid shot.

I don’t think it’s your place to assume what a dead man might or might not do, but if you must, have at it.

 

[85SugarVol]

Meh, I think people get to define it for themselves. That’s liberty.

Sure, people can certainly redefine it. Plenty of ideals throughout history have evolved, reformed, shifted over time.

How would you define it now?

 

[GordonC]

There are contemporary visions of it that are much more exhaustive and inclusive of all manner of things:

Right to Housing
Guarantee of Income
Access to Healthcare
Happiness and Fulfillment
Justice and Equity
Meaning and Purpose

But the basic premise was always that through hard work and determination, everyone had the opportunity to improve their condition and that of their family.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

Yep. Rooted in Crevecoeur, Franklin, and Ragged Dick.

 

[volfanhill]

I don’t think it’s your place to assume what a dead man might or might not do, but if you must, have at it.

I actually suspect he would rage about “mandatory”

 

[85SugarVol]

I actually suspect he would rage about “mandatory”

Yea, no way George Carlin would be in favor of forced medical procedures.

 

[OHvol40]

I actually suspect he would rage about “mandatory”

I think we all love to imagine him raging about what we want to rage about ourselves.

 

[OHvol40]

Sure, people can certainly redefine it. Plenty of ideals throughout history have evolved, reformed, shifted over time.

How would you define it now?

It’s difficult for me to define specifically how I envision it in terms of achievement. I can tell you that monetary value would only comprise a small portion of what would be my American dream. I think Teddy Roosevelt was probably one of my favorite “American Dream” champions. When I go out and enjoy national parks or public land hunting, I think of his fight and drive often. It’s empowering to truly embrace the mindset that all of that is your own while still being able to share it with others. An important piece of the puzzle that has been lost, in my mind, is the sense of community. Uplifting strangers, a sense of duty, planting the seeds of trees who’s shade you’ll never sit under… that sort of thing has gone by the wayside.

 

[85SugarVol]

It’s difficult for me to define specifically how I envision it in terms of achievement. I can tell you that monetary value would only comprise a small portion of what would be my American dream. I think Teddy Roosevelt was probably one of my favorite “American Dream” champions. When I go out and enjoy national parks or public land hunting, I think of his fight and drive often. It’s empowering to truly embrace the mindset that all of that is your own while still being able to share it with others. An important piece of the puzzle that has been lost, in my mind, is the sense of community. Uplifting strangers, a sense of duty, planting the seeds of trees who’s shade you’ll never sit under… that sort of thing has gone by the wayside.

Yea, monetary value is only part of it - it’s not “a number” to be attained.

More the idea of leaving your children in a better position.

 

[OHvol40]

Yea, monetary value is only part of it - it’s not “a number” to be attained.

More the idea of leaving your children in a better position.

I agree, that’s part of it, but that’s a duty you’re charged with as a parent no matter where you happen to reside. I guess my American dream is less individualistic. I want to leave my home, my community, and my country better than what I found it.

 

[marcusluvsvols]

I agree, that’s part of it, but that’s a duty you’re charged with as a parent no matter where you happen to reside. I guess my American dream is less individualistic. I want to leave my home, my community, and my country better than what I found it.

I actually discussed this with my daughter who is 17 and my favorite human quite recently. We discussed how a parents number 1 desire is to give their children a better start and better life than they had themselves. I told her that while we likely would have little to leave our kids as far as an inheritance, we were building "generational wealth" in our family through knowledge and education.

We dont have a lot of money compared to some folks, but we made sacrifices as parents to put both of my kids through Christian school and Lord willing my youngest will have a college degree in a couple years like her older brother who was valedictorian in HS and got his Masters degree at 23yo. She attended C.S. up until highschool and now is in dual enrollment HS/college at Liberty University online. Neither of us parents ever attended college and we got poor educations in overcrowded ghetto public schools on the wrong side of the tracks. So while we will not be able to leave them much financially (especially if inflation keeps killing my 401k purchasing power) we hopefully have better prepared them to succeed in life and eventually give their children an even better life than we gave them.

I would like to say that we also raised our kids to be better people, and better citizens than we are by keeping them in church every time the doors are open etc...but that's just not true. We have kept them in church and tried to be good examples etc as many parents do but honestly we just really got blessed far more than we ever deserved. I was not a good teenager and my wife wasnt great either. I drank heavily and partied using drugs and barfighting etc into my early 20s when I started dating her and got in church. We didnt do anything to deserve my kids...any more than good people deserve the "bad kids" they sometimes have. Neither of my kids has ever been any trouble, at home, school or elsewhere. They have been obedient and respectful and both are/were straight A students. I promise you nothing I have ever done deserves them, and I am very thankful. I have posted here several times that if I was to drop dead the day my daughter graduates college then I was still blessed 1000x more than I ever deserved. That statement is as true today as its ever been, I've got a couple more years til then.

Anyway...didnt intend to ramble forever. I agree that the American Dream is definitely more than financial/material things though. To me its about giving your kids more and better than what we had. Building "generational wealth" in more ways than one. I am very thankful that so far we have been able to do so.

 

[85SugarVol]

I agree, that’s part of it, but that’s a duty you’re charged with as a parent no matter where you happen to reside. I guess my American dream is less individualistic. I want to leave my home, my community, and my country better than what I found it.

Sure, your duty as a parent is to provide for your children. But in many parts of the world (especially at the time the ideal began to crystallize) good parents could “provide” for their children and still have no opportunity to raise their station.

India’s caste system, which would have been as strong as ever, is a good example.

In America, anything was possible. You could “advance”. And yes, that certainly was individualistic in nature. Individualism being another preeminent American ideal.

A desire to improve your community is commendable. But the ability to improve your community and country was not part of the promise that those who framed the American Dream wrote about. It was an opportunity to improve one’s own position.

Doesn’t mean it can’t be your American Dream.

 

[MemphisVol77]

Sure, your duty as a parent is to provide for your children. But in many parts of the world (especially at the time the ideal began to crystallize) good parents could “provide” for their children and still have no opportunity to raise their station.

India’s caste system, which would have been as strong as ever, is a good example.

In America, anything was possible. You could “advance”. And yes, that certainly was individualistic in nature. Individualism being another preeminent American ideal.

Very well said.

To quote Jefferson from the Declaration...... "all individuals have the right to pursue happiness, alongside life and liberty, as inherent and inalienable rights"

It doesn't guarantee you'll start your pursuit at the same spot as others, or that you'll achieve it, but you have the right to pursue.

A desire to improve your community is commendable. But the ability to improve your community and country was not part of the promise that those who framed the American Dream wrote about. It was an opportunity to improve one’s own position.

Doesn’t mean it can’t be your American Dream.

Equity vs equality..........

If it requires the labor or resources of another individual, it's not a human right.

 

[OHvol40]

I actually discussed this with my daughter who is 17 and my favorite human quite recently. We discussed how a parents number 1 desire is to give their children a better start and better life than they had themselves. I told her that while we likely would have little to leave our kids as far as an inheritance, we were building "generational wealth" in our family through knowledge and education.

We dont have a lot of money compared to some folks, but we made sacrifices as parents to put both of my kids through Christian school and Lord willing my youngest will have a college degree in a couple years like her older brother who was valedictorian in HS and got his Masters degree at 23yo. She attended C.S. up until highschool and now is in dual enrollment HS/college at Liberty University online. Neither of us parents ever attended college and we got poor educations in overcrowded ghetto public schools on the wrong side of the tracks. So while we will not be able to leave them much financially (especially if inflation keeps killing my 401k purchasing power) we hopefully have better prepared them to succeed in life and eventually give their children an even better life than we gave them.

I would like to say that we also raised our kids to be better people, and better citizens than we are by keeping them in church every time the doors are open etc...but that's just not true. We have kept them in church and tried to be good examples etc as many parents do but honestly we just really got blessed far more than we ever deserved. I was not a good teenager and my wife wasnt great either. I drank heavily and partied using drugs and barfighting etc into my early 20s when I started dating her and got in church. We didnt do anything to deserve my kids...any more than good people deserve the "bad kids" they sometimes have. Neither of my kids has ever been any trouble, at home, school or elsewhere. They have been obedient and respectful and both are/were straight A students. I promise you nothing I have ever done deserves them, and I am very thankful. I have posted here several times that if I was to drop dead the day my daughter graduates college then I was still blessed 1000x more than I ever deserved. That statement is as true today as its ever been, I've got a couple more years til then.

Anyway...didnt intend to ramble forever. I agree that the American Dream is definitely more than financial/material things though. To me its about giving your kids more and better than what we had. Building "generational wealth" in more ways than one. I am very thankful that so far we have been able to do so.

Well said

 

[BreatheUT]

View attachment 761292
The National Park Service shared this photo of a worker removing corrosion and paint from the statue of Brigadier General Albert Pike

View attachment 761293
The statue, which was erected in 1901, was defaced during the Black Lives Matter protests of 2020

View attachment 761294
Protesters used ropes to topple the statue, then set it on fire

Controversial statue to be reinstalled under Trump

The National Park Service announced on Monday that its crews are working to restore and reinstall the bronze sculpture of Confederate Brigadier General Albert Pike.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Oh BLM......another fraud hate group of the Democrat Party masquerading as an equality organization. Those get rich million schemes were brilliant elitist moves. They've all but disappeared like other democrat party fraud movements they try to hoist upon the people as nobel. It normally only takes a few years after they've already caused societal disruption and chaos. I wonder all their hats, shirts, bumper stickers and key chains go.