152 - 52

#254
#254
whobethis16 said:
But there's more to it, stuff Gruden hasn't done.
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So hire people who have. It's dumb to act like this is some gigantic dealbreaker. Dude is a rockstar with a ton of energy, it's not going to be hard to find high school kids who want to play for him.
 
#255
#255
whobethis16 said:
Bull****, it's a constant "he had 2 losingq seasons in 4 years!"
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And was getting dominated by his rivals, and had a losing record against every good coach, and hadn't won the conference this century, and hadn't had a nationally relevant team since 2001, and kept losing games he shouldn't. But feel free to act like it's just that one thing
 
#256
#256
NashVol11 said:
And was getting dominated by his rivals, and had a losing record against every good coach, and hadn't won the conference this century, and hadn't had a nationally relevant team since 2001, and kept losing games he shouldn't. But feel free to act like it's just that one thing
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We're 10 years removed from even playing for a conference title, something Fulmer did every 3 years. Every player he had for 3+ years played for conference championship.
 
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#258
#258
whobethis16 said:
We're 10 years removed from even playing for a conference title, something Fulmer did every 3 years. Every player he had for 3+ years played for conference championship.
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Because we've been making crappy hires. That doesn't make Fulmer any more desirable.
 
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#259
#259
NashVol11 said:
Because we've been making crappy hires. That doesn't make Fulmer any more desirable.
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Very few are saying hire him now, I'm not. I'm saying the firing was a mistake. But I'm not wanting to hire him now. I'm also not wanting to hire a guy who has not been at minimum a coordinator at the college level, hasn't been at the college level in 30 years, and hasn't coached any level in 10.

You're slurping his name and nothing else.
 
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#260
#260
NashVol11 said:
Fulmer was begging for jobs, including South Florida and Louisville, and no one was interested. Gruden can have damn near any job he wants. Those are far from "the same."
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those are your words. How do you know Gruden hasnt "begged" for jobs too? How do you know that Fulmer didnt say no to any job?

Answer: you dont

In the end, both dont have HC jobs and havent in quite some time.
 
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#262
#262
GreveHaller said:
And what does Saban, Spurrier, Kelly, etc.... have that Gruden doesnt?

College Head Coaching experience


You're trying to make comparisons when there's flagrant variable. Grudens next win as a CFB HC will be his first.

Just remember if you say there's a reason Fulmer isnt a HC somewhere, the same can be said about Gruden.

If you say the game passed Fulmer by, then the same can be said about the guy that

1. Has never been a CFB HC

2. Hasnt been a HC in 9 years

3. Hasnt been part of a college football program in 28 years

Yeah, dont quit your lithium:crazy:
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But you are completely hypocritical. You have to realize that. You can't use Gruden's NFLHC record as evidence he isn't a good coach when other good NCAA HC have had even worse careers in the NFL.

No one knows how Gruden will do. But odds are, he'd do very well, considering his performance in the NFL. To suggest otherwise is pretty foolish.
 
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#263
#263
GreveHaller said:
those are your words. How do you know Gruden hasnt "begged" for jobs too? How do you know that Fulmer didnt say no to any job?

Answer: you dont

In the end, both dont have HC jobs and havent in quite some time.
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Jon Gruden has reportedly turned down three offers to return to the NFL coaching ranks.

ESPN reported Saturday that the Colts talked with Gruden about the position. There have been conflicting reports in recent weeks on whether current coach Chuck Pagano will be retained after the Colts' 8-8 season.


Gruden denies the two sides have talked, telling ESPN, “I know nothing. I’ve told people, I’m not coaching. I’m a broadcaster, I’m not a coach.”

ESPN's Adam Schefter says the other two teams that Gruden rejected were the Rams and 49ers.
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Jon Gruden reportedly rejected three offers to become head coach | NFL | Sporting News
 
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#264
#264
Carp said:
But you are completely hypocritical. You have to realize that. You can't use Gruden's NFLHC record as evidence he isn't a good coach when other good NCAA HC have had even worse careers in the NFL.

No one knows how Gruden will do. But odds are, he'd do very well, considering his performance in the NFL. To suggest otherwise is pretty foolish.
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Not really. NFL coaches deal with adults doing a job and are more of managers. They don't recruit, they don't have to motivate, they don't have to juggle NCAA, aren't working 70+ hours a week, aren't having to get back from a road trip and immediately go to a high schooler's house, aren't having to make sure players go to class and all that. It's a huge difference, and not an easier one.
 
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#266
#266
NashVol11 said:
Fulmer was begging for jobs, including South Florida and Louisville, and no one was interested. Gruden can have damn near any job he wants. Those are far from "the same."
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Just curious, but do you know this for a fact? He had a pretty hefty buyout we had to pay. Given that (and his age) I find it hard to believe he would have seriously considered going to a smaller school with less funding.
 
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#267
#267
NashVol11 said:
Fulmer was begging for jobs, including South Florida and Louisville, and no one was interested. Gruden can have damn near any job he wants. Those are far from "the same."
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How do you know he didn't talk and determine "hey, this situation is not what I thought it would, I no longer want to try to coach here". You don't.
 
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#268
#268
whobethis16 said:
Gruden's own quote says they didn't talk. Not sure what your point is.
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I wouldn't be surprised if Gruden didn't talk to anyone himself. His agent though?

If Adam Schefter says he turned down offers to coach, I'll believe it.

My point is Gruden probably could have gotten back into coaching in the NFL if he really wanted to.
 
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#269
#269
TheDeeble said:
I wouldn't be surprised if Gruden didn't talk to anyone himself. His agent though?

If Adam Schefter says he turned down offers to coach, I'll believe it.

My point is Gruden probably could have gotten back into coaching in the NFL if he really wanted to.
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You believe a 3rd party and not the guy himself who, in the article you posted, said he did not talk to anyone?
 
#270
#270
whobethis16 said:
Not really. NFL coaches deal with adults doing a job and are more of managers. They don't recruit, they don't have to motivate, they don't have to juggle NCAA, aren't working 70+ hours a week, aren't having to get back from a road trip and immediately go to a high schooler's house, aren't having to make sure players go to class and all that. It's a huge difference, and not an easier one.
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LOL what?

Gruden engineered some of the best offenses in the NFL with no name QB's. But that's "being a manager" Low, whatever dude.


Gruden won't need to physically recruit as much as the average college coach. He has brand recognition. And I can guarantee Gruden was working well over 70+ hours a week as HC of an NFL team. Well may be not in the offseason, but neither do college coaches in the offseason.
 
#271
#271
Carp said:
LOL what?

Gruden engineered some of the best offenses in the NFL with no name QB's. But that's "being a manager" Low, whatever dude.


Gruden won't need to physically recruit as much as the average college coach. He has brand recognition. And I can guarantee Gruden was working well over 70+ hours a week as HC of an NFL team. Well may be not in the offseason, but neither do college coaches in the offseason.
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The minute you bank on "brand recognition" as your primary way to succeed is the minute you fail.
 
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#272
#272
whobethis16 said:
You believe a 3rd party and not the guy himself who, in the article you posted, said he did not talk to anyone?
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Yes. It's a game that coaches, and ADs, play. Their agent talks to people. The coaching search firm talks to agents.

The coach can say they haven't talked to "team x". The AD can say he hasn't talked to "coach x". And it's all true.

I don't think Schefter will make up a story.
 
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#273
#273
Carp said:
But you are completely hypocritical. You have to realize that. You can't use Gruden's NFLHC record as evidence he isn't a good coach when other good NCAA HC have had even worse careers in the NFL.

No one knows how Gruden will do. But odds are, he'd do very well, considering his performance in the NFL. To suggest otherwise is pretty foolish.
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to suggest a guy that's never been and CFB HC and out of college ball for that long is even more foolish

we can play this "you're wrong. No, you're wrong" all day long. In the end I'd rather have someone guiding out program that has recent experience with recruiting in today's era as well as recent coaching experience. Rolling the dice on hoping the guy might work or might bring in players sets us up for more years of sub mediocrity
 
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#274
#274
whobethis16 said:
The minute you bank on "brand recognition" as your primary way to succeed is the minute you fail.
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Pretty much every single recruit knows who Gruden is. He has one of the most popular QB camps around. Yet you don't think brand recognition will matter with him?

You think Saban himself makes first contact with all these 4-5 star recruits from every state in the continental US?
 
#275
#275
GreveHaller said:
to suggest a guy that's never been and CFB HC and out of college ball for that long is even more foolish

we can play this "you're wrong. No, you're wrong" all day long. In the end I'd rather have someone guiding out program that has recent experience with recruiting in today's era as well as recent coaching experience. Rolling the dice on hoping the guy might work or might bring in players sets us up for more years of sub mediocrity
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Its fine if that's your preference. We don't have to agree. It's entirely possible Gruden could fall flat on his face (as it is possible with basically any coach we hire). But if we're using his NFL record as an argument to not hire him, well that's a piss poor evaluation. To criticize his record when other college coaches have had far less success at the same level is hypocritical and also wrong seeing as heralded coaches like Brian Billick and Bill Parcells have similar winning percantages.
 
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