Ukraine Protests

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#501
#501
Kingston Vol said:
Sorry for my ignorance on this subject, but what are the possible/likely US ramifications?
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That's been the elusive question throughout this thread. Far as anyone can tell, none. Doesn't mean something else will crop up down the road.

Way I see it long term? US loses even more face in the diplomatic community by doing nothing (which is personally what I feel is our best course of action) and you see Europe start to deal with future problems more on their own.

Russia takes a huge step forward towards becoming a player in the world theater again and we end up with a geopolitical foe much like the Soviets were during the Cold War.

But overall, the rest of Europe might give up on the Ukraine in the same manner that Western Europe gave up on Czechoslovakia in 1968 after the Prague Spring. They could have offered assistance back then, but doing so with a traditional Warsaw Pact nation would have increased tensions in Europe to unacceptable levels. Same situation now as well.
 
#502
#502
volprof said:
Burhead, you've been giving us great information on this subject throughout the thread. I take it you really have an interest in Eastern European culture/politics. I do as well, but you kick my ass in this department.
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Thanks.

I guess being a political/history nerd you live for these type of situations even though that is messed up. I also love watching the intricacies of foreign policy being played out.
 
#503
#503
Grand Vol said:
That's been the elusive question throughout this thread. Far as anyone can tell, none. Doesn't mean something else will crop up down the road.

Way I see it long term? US loses even more face in the diplomatic community by doing nothing (which is personally what I feel is our best course of action) and you see Europe start to deal with future problems more on their own.

Russia takes a huge step forward towards becoming a player in the world theater again and we end up with a geopolitical foe much like the Soviets were during the Cold War.

But overall, the rest of Europe might give up on the Ukraine in the same manner that Western Europe gave up on Czechoslovakia in 1968 after the Prague Spring. They could have offered assistance back then, but doing so with a traditional Warsaw Pact nation would have increased tensions in Europe to unacceptable levels. Same situation now as well.
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Any interference by the US is pointless.
 
#504
#504
lawgator1 said:
Any interference by the US is pointless.
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Which I pointed out is our best course of action.

But you also underestimate the ego portion here that Barry thinks he still wears the big boy pants and has clout on the world stage.
 
#507
#507
Grand Vol said:
But overall, the rest of Europe might give up on the Ukraine in the same manner that Western Europe gave up on Czechoslovakia in 1968 after the Prague Spring. They could have offered assistance back then, but doing so with a traditional Warsaw Pact nation would have increased tensions in Europe to unacceptable levels. Same situation now as well.
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We left Hungary on it's own in '56 as well.
 
#508
#508
Burhead said:
We left Hungary on it's own in '56 as well.
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This is true and the west stood a better chance of getting a foothold there. But being that it didn't border a traditional NATO country, it would have been harder to get troops in plus the fact there were already Soviets involved in the fighting.

Both historical examples are somewhat of a lesson for the Ukraine today in steps that can be taken.
 
#509
#509
Burhead said:
Thanks.

I guess being a political/history nerd you live for these type of situations even though that is messed up. I also love watching the intricacies of foreign policy being played out.
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I agree. It is messed up, but something about international disputes (especially when troops are involved) really sparks our interests. We are but humans after all.
 
#510
#510
Grand Vol said:
This is true and the west stood a better chance of getting a foothold there. But being that it didn't border a traditional NATO country, it would have been harder to get troops in plus the fact there were already Soviets involved in the fighting.

Both historical examples are somewhat of a lesson for the Ukraine today in steps that can be taken.
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You think the Sudetenland parallel fits better?
 
#511
#511
Just some crazy talk & thinking here. What happens if the US and also the UN do nothing and Putin decides to go ahead and take Ukraine? Then what? Nothing? If its nothing what if decides to see just what he can get away with and decides to take another of the former Soviet territories?
 
#512
#512
Burhead said:
You think the Sudetenland parallel fits better?
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Maybe a mix, but the Russians haven't made demands of the Ukraine for territory like Hitler did with the Czechoslovakians.

No, for the moment I'd say the Hungarian situation fits more although the future isn't set yet. And I'm not certain the Europeans would placate the Russians by giving up Ukrainian territory. Much less the Ukrainians acquiescing to such a demand.
 
#513
#513
CagleMtnVol said:
Just some crazy talk & thinking here. What happens if the US and also the UN do nothing and Putin decides to go ahead and take Ukraine? Then what? Nothing? If its nothing what if decides to see just what he can get away with and decides to take another of the former Soviet territories?
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Just leave it alone. Nothing to be gained by intervening.
 
#514
#514
CagleMtnVol said:
Just some crazy talk & thinking here. What happens if the US and also the UN do nothing and Putin decides to go ahead and take Ukraine? Then what? Nothing?
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Ask the Ukrainians what will happen. They are the ones with the biggest stake in the outcome.
 
#517
#517
CNN reporting Russia has 3 Ukraine military bases surrounded demanding the Ukrainian forces surrender

Ukraine has deployed troops across country.
 
#520
#520
Kingston Vol said:
Sorry for my ignorance on this subject, but what are the possible/likely US ramifications?
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Ukraine isn't a NATO member. They are up for consideration but are currently under "Partnership" status. If they were a NATO ally, we would have to defend them. Ukraine has helped us in both Iraq and Afghanistan

Half of the country wants to join the EU and adopt the euro, the other half wants to become part of Russia
 
#522
#522
VolsNSkinsFan said:
Guess who skipped the National Security meeting yesterday?
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Obama went to one of his brats BB game I think...hes already warned Putin so it will be OK!


Hussein obamar is all tough guy when it’s Libya or Syria.

I guess this isn’t a war on behalf of the muslim brotherhood so this isn’t of interest to him.
 
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#524
#524
Warnings are meaningless when you fail to follow through with any of of your prior warnings...if he really wanted to scare the Russians he should threaten imposing obamacare or some of his failed fiscal policies.
 
#525
#525
FLVOL69 said:
Warnings are meaningless when you fail to follow through with any of of your prior warnings...if he really wanted to scare the Russians he should threaten imposing obamacare or some of his failed fiscal policies.
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Obama always backs up the threats he throws out there with his line in the sand. He consistently moves the line back a little farther.
 
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