Ukraine Protests

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#4,026
#4,026
Burhead said:
Lol, Obama is the loose cannon? I didn't know we were funneling men, supplies, and weapons into the Ukrainian side like a certain man in the Kremlin is. :crazy:
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BTW, there is no doubt that we are doing this in Syria and have been for the last 2+ years. You know things have gotten out of control with a loose cannon like Obama when even the UK can't even back us going into Syria a year ago. The UK has sided with the US on just about every military mission we've had since the Civil War.
 
#4,027
#4,027
Burhead said:
A government that was a puppet of the Kremlin that went against the people's wishes.
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How was that any of our business? That was an internal matter and it did not require for us to send in State Department jackals to overthrow the govt. Really?
 
#4,032
#4,032
This is my late night, near drunken post.

Russia, like al-Qaeda before them, and like ISIS now, thinks we're a decadent country. A playboy lot.

Since 1812, we've never been threatened by a foreign invader.

And given our success, economically, I can't blame them for thinking this.

But, if there's one thing I've learned in my relatively meaningless life, it's that you don't mess with a people who have a particular affection and connection with their land.

Historically, agrarian societies are the most violent. And I do believe this is because their individuals garner an intimate relationship with the land itself. It becomes something sacred. Something more than just crops. Something that you hand down to your children and their children and their children.

America may have moved beyond the era of agriculture, but, make no mistake, its agrarian roots run deep. And they run strong.

Maybe it's just the stupid farm boy in me, who's drunk one too many tonight, but I do believe that if this country is ever attacked, you'll see a response like you've never seen in your life.

I know I'll be there. You can take the boy out of the country, but you won't ever take the country out of the boy.
 
#4,033
#4,033
volprof said:
This is my late night, near drunken post.

Russia, like al-Qaeda before them, and like ISIS now, thinks we're a decadent country. A playboy lot.

Since 1812, we've never been threatened by a foreign invader.

And given our success, economically, I can't blame them for thinking this.

But, if there's one thing I've learned in my relatively meaningless life, it's that you don't mess with a people who have a particular affection and connection with their land.

Historically, agrarian societies are the most violent. And I do believe this is because their individuals garner an intimate relationship with the land itself. It becomes something sacred. Something more than just crops. Something that you hand down to your children and their children and their children.

America may have moved beyond the era of agriculture, but, make no mistake, its agrarian roots run deep. And they run strong.

Maybe it's just the stupid farm boy in me, who's drunk one too many tonight, but I do believe that if this country is ever attacked, you'll see a response like you've never seen in your life.

I know I'll be there. You can take the boy out of the country, but you won't ever take the country out of the boy.
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I would agree with you on everything you just said save one added condition.

The politicians need to get out of the way.
 
#4,035
#4,035
As you can tell, I probably just need to sleep this one off. But I still stand by my farm boy post.
 
#4,036
#4,036
volprof said:
This is my late night, near drunken post.

Russia, like al-Qaeda before them, and like ISIS now, thinks we're a decadent country. A playboy lot.

Since 1812, we've never been threatened by a foreign invader.

And given our success, economically, I can't blame them for thinking this.

But, if there's one thing I've learned in my relatively meaningless life, it's that you don't mess with a people who have a particular affection and connection with their land.

Historically, agrarian societies are the most violent. And I do believe this is because their individuals garner an intimate relationship with the land itself. It becomes something sacred. Something more than just crops. Something that you hand down to your children and their children and their children.

America may have moved beyond the era of agriculture, but, make no mistake, its agrarian roots run deep. And they run strong.

Maybe it's just the stupid farm boy in me, who's drunk one too many tonight, but I do believe that if this country is ever attacked, you'll see a response like you've never seen in your life.

I know I'll be there. You can take the boy out of the country, but you won't ever take the country out of the boy.
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Yeah... you've had too much to drink. The overwhelming majority of Americans get their food from a supermarket and not from their home garden... its been like that for decades. I would say the Great Depression/Dust Bowl/industrialization killed the agrarian America you talking about.
 
#4,038
#4,038
But, you know what I'm talking about, Grand. If we're thrown into it, here on our own soil, our asses will buckle down. Won't be no playboy **** then.

We just haven't been tested. That's all.

But, in due time. We will be. Historically, the odds are favorable for an invasion of our land.
 
#4,039
#4,039
Rasputin_Vol said:
Yeah... you've had too much to drink. The overwhelming majority of Americans get their food from a supermarket and not from their home garden... its been like that for decades. I would say the Great Depression/Dust Bowl/industrialization killed the agrarian America you talking about.
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Rasputin_Vol said:
If you would have asked me 18 months ago, I would have said definitely not. Right now... I'm about 60-70% certain we did.
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Yeah, that's what I figured. Not about Americans, but about you. Thanks.
 
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#4,043
#4,043
volprof said:
But, you know what I'm talking about, Grand. If we're thrown into it, here on our own soil, our asses will buckle down. Won't be no playboy **** then.

We just haven't been tested. That's all.

But, in due time. We will be. Historically, the odds are favorable for an invasion of our land.
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They're not going to or need to put boots on the ground. Obama can let them outnumber and outvote you, or they can slip a terrorist or weapon over the open borders, or they can crash our economy.

Why bother with putting boots on the ground and fighting Appalachians?
 
#4,045
#4,045
Rasputin_Vol said:
:crazy:
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No matter how you break it down, personally, that's at least 100 million Americans ready to fight for you. Not to mention the at least 100 million damn, annoying as hell city guys and gals who have attitude streaks running out their rear holes. So, as I calculate it, we have at least 200 million Americans ready to fight for this nation, should it be invaded.

Out of the other 100 million or so will be fighters (mostly fighters), loungers, pacifists, traitors, etc. The same bizarre, odd-man-out concoction that every country has.
 
#4,046
#4,046
volprof said:
No matter how you break it down, personally, that's at least 100 million Americans ready to fight for you. Not to mention the at least 100 million damn, annoying as hell city guys and gals who have attitude streaks running out their rear holes. So, as I calculate it, we have at least 200 million Americans ready to fight for this nation, should it be invaded.

Out of the other 100 million or so will be fighters (mostly fighters), loungers, pacifists, traitors, etc. The same bizarre, odd-man-out concoction that every country has.
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The problem you run into is one of control. Too many of the citizens, regardless of their patriotism, are dependent on government assistance. If an "invader" was to come in and offer them a better deal or one equal to what was being replaced, the chances of them fighting? Not as much as you would thing.

Remember, only 30% or so of the population actively supported or fought in our own revolution. Provided with today's numbers that's still 100,000,000 folks, but it will largely be regional specific. The southern areas for the most part would fight back. The central States and Texas surely would. Northern States...maybe smaller bands, but no large scale movement. West coast and Florida? Could swing either way. But the larger the cities, the more dependent the citizens are on someone to supply food, water, power and essential items. And if an occupation force is providing those things, the chances of a full scale resistance goes down.

There are many different variables here to take into account. But occupying the US in its entirety? Not an easy task for any standing army today.
 
#4,047
#4,047
Grand Vol said:
The problem you run into is one of control. Too many of the citizens, regardless of their patriotism, are dependent on government assistance. If an "invader" was to come in and offer them a better deal or one equal to what was being replaced, the chances of them fighting? Not as much as you would thing.

Remember, only 30% or so of the population actively supported or fought in our own revolution. Provided with today's numbers that's still 100,000,000 folks, but it will largely be regional specific. The southern areas for the most part would fight back. The central States and Texas surely would. Northern States...maybe smaller bands, but no large scale movement. West coast and Florida? Could swing either way. But the larger the cities, the more dependent the citizens are on someone to supply food, water, power and essential items. And if an occupation force is providing those things, the chances of a full scale resistance goes down.

There are many different variables here to take into account. But occupying the US in its entirety? Not an easy task for any standing army today.
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Ah, the cynical scenario even, and still bad odds for anyone not named "USA." Give me the reins of our radio and video networks in such a case, and I'll convert 800 million of them instantly.

And there aren't even 800 million of them in the first place. But, by God, I'll do it. If I have to.
 
#4,048
#4,048
volprof said:
And Velo, who would have ever have thought that when you started this thread back in early December that we would still be talking about this some 4,000 posts in now! Unbelievable.
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I didn't imagine it would take the Cold War redux character that it has.
 
#4,049
#4,049
Burhead said:
How is it any business of Russia's if Ukraine wants to join the EU and NATO?
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Lol. We almost destroyed the world because Cuba wanted nuclear missiles from Russia to defend themselves. And before you say we'd never put missiles in Ukraine, the reason Russia wanted missiles in Cuba is because we put nukes in NATO member Turkey. And you can't really say Cuba had nothing to fear from us. Is Russia supposed to let NATO encircle it?
 
#4,050
#4,050
red butler said:
Lol. We almost destroyed the world because Cuba wanted nuclear missiles from Russia to defend themselves. And before you say we'd never put missiles in Ukraine, the reason Russia wanted missiles in Cuba is because we put nukes in NATO member Turkey. And you can't really say Cuba had nothing to fear from us. Is Russia supposed to let NATO encircle it?
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We wouldn't put missiles in the Ukraine because it would violate the INF Treaty.

Don't base a bad argument on something that happened over 50 years ago.
 
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