Too much ice

#9,827
#9,827
hog88 said:
Just watched that video, he deserved and should have been arrested then. He was 10x more unhinged and aggressive in that altercation.
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I think he should have least been detained and identified and I have no problem with them man handling them after he busted their tail light. Hell they even ignored his gun which they didn’t check his permit for so I’m laughing really hard at the BUt yOu mUSt hAvE yOUR pERmIt crowd 😂
 
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#9,832
#9,832
Delmar said:
I don’t know but that looks like an arrestable offense to me since he caused property damage. Wonder why they didn’t arrest. Not that it has anything to do with the recent encounter. Just sort of odd.
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He absolutely earned getting jacked up a tad bit for that and should have been held liable for damages.
 
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#9,834
#9,834
Orangeslice13 said:
Ok so I’ve watched all the people give their opinions and I’ve watched all the videos of the incident again.
Bottom line.

One agent removed the victim’s firearm and had time to turn his back and start to walk away before another agent shot a held down unarmed man in the back with a clear view of the victims hands. He was not in danger

It’s a murder.
As such nobody seems to be asking….
Was there motive?
Well, it’s been reported that the victim has clashed with ice agents several times. I’d like to know if this agent had directly interacted with the victim before.
Was there opportunity?
A gun was removed and the victim was held down.
Was it excessive?
The third shot into a falling victim and 10 total shots says it is definitely worth the investigation.
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I doubt a prior encounter happened here but you never know I guess. Prior interaction can certainly cause big problems. We had the case here in Memphis a couple of years ago of a guy that was pulled over and beaten to death by 5 cops supposedly because he had been messing with the wife of one of the cops. (Unarmed and definitely on the ground)
 
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#9,835
#9,835
NorthDallas40 said:
I think he should have least been detained and identified and I have no problem with them man handling them after he busted their tail light. Hell they even ignored his gun which they didn’t check his permit for so I’m laughing really hard at the BUt yOu mUSt hAvE yOUR pERmIt crowd 😂
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2nd.
I have no issues with the manhandling right up until he was shot.
There never should have been a single shot fired.
 
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#9,838
#9,838
Orangeslice13 said:
None of this matters.
All that matters is if an unarmed man was shot to death by someone who could clearly see that there was no imminent danger.

This absolutely should go to a grand jury and be judged by citizens.
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I don't think the law is written in such a way to support your second sentence, I agree with the last one.

From my understanding, the law gives great leeway in these matters and puts the burden of proof on proving that the agent should not have reasonably believed there was an imminent danger. I saw video with audio today that showed the agents screaming before the shot/disarm that he had a gun. I'm not sure if it will be shown without a reasonable doubt that the initial shooter should have known he'd been disarmed.

Edit: I will say this, if I were one of the shooting agents, I wouldn't be sleeping well for several reasons. One being that I'd taken a life, another being anxiety that my life as I'd known it may be over.
 
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#9,839
#9,839
Orange_Crush said:
I don't think the law is written in such a way to support your second sentence, I agree with the last one.

From my understanding, the law gives great leeway in these matters and puts the burden of proof on proving that the agent should not have reasonably believed there was an imminent danger. I saw video with audio today that showed the agents screaming before the shot/disarm that he had a gun. I'm not sure if it will be shown without a reasonable doubt that the initial shooter should have known he'd been disarmed.
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Anyone who puts a bullet in a human being because someone said “he has a gun” but can’t see a gun and can’t confirm a threat has no business being in law enforcement.
This absolutely should go to a grand jury.
 
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#9,840
#9,840
utvolpj said:
He was sprayed before they ever knew about the gun. He wasn't initially fighting he was helping the woman who just got assaulted. Getting grabbed from behind by multiple people will trigger a response and it's what the agents count on
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You seem to ignore the fact that the woman chased the officer down and instigated the entire situation. Can’t tell exactly what she does but after she catches him it looks like she blows an air horn in his face leading him to shove her.

As far as “getting grabbed from behind”, he knows what he’s doing. So he knows who is grabbing him and why.
 
#9,841
#9,841
Orangeslice13 said:
Anyone who puts a bullet in a human being because someone said “he has a gun” but can’t see a gun and can’t confirm a threat has no business being in law enforcement.
This absolutely should go to a grand jury.
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I agree. I just know what I've seen per how the law is written and applied. Folks should get ready for it, as I suspect it's likely to happen.
 
#9,842
#9,842
Orangeslice13 said:
None of this matters.
All that matters is if an unarmed man was shot to death by someone who could clearly see that there was no imminent danger.

This absolutely should go to a grand jury and be judged by citizens.
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The other point is what kind of person shoots another lying on the ground apparently dead 9-8 more times. Kind of out of control and overkill.

Next time I go hunting I will remember that tactic to I can make sure I have to dig the bullets out. May use a bow less mess. At some point his body became target practice.

Shows how wired up some of these LE/ICE agents are. Just stupid doing it on Video.
 
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#9,843
#9,843
Sudden Impact said:
The other point is what kind of person shoots another lying on the ground apparently dead 9-8 more times. Kind of out of control and overkill.

Next time I go hunting I will remember that tactic to I can make sure I have to dig the bullets out. May use a bow less mess. At some point his body became target practice.

Shows how wired up some of these LE/ICE agents are. Just stupid doing it on Video.
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Again. They only hit him 3 times out of 10 from 3-5 feet away.


I’m not sure how they missed each other
 
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#9,845
#9,845
Orange_Crush said:
I agree. I just know what I've seen per how the law is written and applied. Folks should get ready for it, as I suspect it's likely to happen.
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Governments looking the other way instead of presenting to the grand jury…… ya that’s what I’m expecting from our increasingly corrupt and tyrannical overlords
 
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#9,846
#9,846
Smokey123 said:
You’re the one who claimed they did, the burden of proof is on you. If there’s not a statue that says they do then what does that mean?

Funny you’re using AI now when it’s convenient but earlier when I used it for a summary of a scotus ruling that was wrong
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I'm not trying to prove anything to you, mate. I have every reason to believe that their actions were legitimate federal LEO activities. You're the one clinging to hopes that maybe, just maybe, ICE is the only law enforcement agency in America that is given the authorities to implement their charter, but not the powers to do so day to day-- i.e the common needs to do things like clear and secure their areas of operations.

If you want to try to prove to me that ICE is the one law enforcement agency that is given authority but not the powers to affect such authority, knock yourself out. I'll be all ears, otherwise all you're doing is clogging the thread.

And again, my criticism of your AI was that even it said that it was giving a partial list.
 
#9,847
#9,847
Orangeslice13 said:
Governments looking the other way instead of presenting to the grand jury…… ya that’s what I’m expecting from our increasingly corrupt and tyrannical overlords
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I desperately hope that it is either investigated by an independent, or goes to a grand jury, or both. This needs to be closed above the table with full transparency, one way or another.
 
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