Recruiting Forum Off Topic Thread III

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#2,052
#2,052
Bassmaster_Vol said:
I mean, I don't know what to tell you. This is what the Bible teaches and anticipates objections to it:

"This is now the second letter that I am writing to you, beloved. In both of them I am stirring up your sincere mind by way of reminder, that you should remember the predictions of the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and Savior through your apostles, knowing this first of all, that scoffers will come in the last days with scoffing, following their own sinful desires. They will say, “Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the beginning of creation.” For they deliberately overlook this fact, that the heavens existed long ago, and the earth was formed out of water and through water by the word of God, and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished. But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.
But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed." 2nd Peter 3:1-10
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Wants everyone to reach repentance until he just says nah, Im done. Nice stuff Peter, really nice. Just one more thing that doesn't add up.
 
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#2,054
#2,054
drvenner said:
Do you love homosexuals? Because the Bible also says to hate the sin but love the sinner.
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Absolutely. The Bible does say that, but that doesn't mean you accept the sin. We're told in the New Testament multiple times that homosexuals will not inherit the kingdom of Heaven.
 
#2,055
#2,055
VolunteerVandiver said:
This is a very tough subject, as I know a few gay people, one of which is an uncle I adore.

He is incredibly giving, loving, and has strong moral values. When you talk to him about it, he says that he was born that way, as he has never been attracted to a woman in his life.

He has no reason to lie about this, and in his defense, I have never been attracted to a man before.

I have taught my son that people have genetic predispositions to being homosexual or bisexual, but that doesn't diminish their value as people, and to treat everyone the way you want to be treated.

No, my children haven't grown up in a religious household, but they have been exposed to empathy and unconditional love. They have been taught to be good for the sake of being good. They are not judgemental, as they are very accepting of those that are different from them.

The world needs more love and affective empathy, and less judgement and division.
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Excellent, excellent post. I am a Christian, but I can admire very much what you write here and what you are trying to teach your children.
 
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#2,056
#2,056
drvenner said:
Excellent, excellent post. I am a Christian, but I can admire very much what you write here and what you are trying to teach your children.
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I don't know about a genetic disposition to be homosexual I think it is both nature and nurture that contribute.
 
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#2,057
#2,057
bignewt said:
Is it a sin to leave a steaming pile in a public restroom? Surely there is a passage that is relevant there.
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Haha, I like Bass and all but Chief would seem to be the first pick as my preacher. :lolabove: I can think of no better person to instill objective morals into our society. :eek:lol:
 
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#2,058
#2,058
drvenner said:
You absolutely can say that. You can admire someone without believing everything that they purport. Do you mean that only Christians can truly appreciate and admire Jesus?
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Well, only Christians accept Him for who He claimed to be. The original post was directed at, whatever that guys name was, don't remember, who said on the same page that God was egotistical and sadistic for sending people to hell. Then on the same page said that He admires Jesus, who said over and over again that if people do not believe in Him that they are going to hell. It was a very inconsistent position.

The writer to the Hebrews would not agree that someone who does not accept Christ appreciate and admire Him. Listen at how he describes those who hear of the truth of Christ but reject Him:

"For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries. Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses. How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has trampled underfoot the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?" Hebrews 10:26-29
 
#2,060
#2,060
bignewt said:
Wants everyone to reach repentance until he just says nah, Im done. Nice stuff Peter, really nice. Just one more thing that doesn't add up.
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Don't miss the word "you" in verse 9. That explains who Peter is talking to. "God is patient toward YOU, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance." This is not a blanket promise concerning the whole world, but to the church. The pronoun is directed to God's people as it says in verse 1 of chapter 1. No, the Bible is very consistent, God will judge the world who has rejected His Son. It adds up completely. It has been the same message from beginning to end.
 
#2,061
#2,061
Bassmaster_Vol said:
You like to make these claims a lot, but you never explain them. But you make them and move on. I find that interesting.
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I know several agnostics. They have stated to me that their philosophy is that they simply don't know. They have not stated to me that there is no God. I have no reason to believe that they would be lying. There is more of a stigma attached to being an atheist than there is to being agnostic, but if someone says that is what they are, then I don't tend to question them. What sort of claim are you speaking of exactly?
 
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#2,062
#2,062
Sleegro said:
Haha, I like Bass and all but Chief would seem to be the first pick as my preacher. :lolabove: I can think of no better person to instill objective morals into our society. :eek:lol:
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There's actually a passage in the Old Testamant that talks about Saul covering his feet lol
 
#2,063
#2,063
Chief Vol 13 said:
I'd be very disturbed. I'll still love them and try to point them in the right direction, but they'll know I'm not on board with what they're doing.
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What exactly is the right direction? What if they say they have met someone that they truly love, that they have never been attracted to the opposite gender and that they will never be happy if they cannot continue with the lifestyle that they have now?
 
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#2,064
#2,064
VolunteerVandiver said:
I am an agnostic. I simply don't know for sure, and I likely never will.

I am genuinely open to most any explanation, but I will critically dissect an explanation before accepting it.
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Now this is what I understand agnosticism to be. I could be wrong, but from my studies, the difference between atheism and agnosticism is openness to the possibility of their being a God, correct? My only point to Swanson was that he said that God was made up. That is more atheistic than agnostic to say that.

I do find it interesting tho that I have never met an agnostic who lives as though God does exist. The ones I have encountered have always argued against me that He does not exist. I just think that's interesting that the agnostics that I have encountered never say you know, God "probably" does exist. No, they usually say, He "probably" doesn't.
 
#2,065
#2,065
Chief Vol 13 said:
Absolutely. The Bible does say that, but that doesn't mean you accept the sin. We're told in the New Testament multiple times that homosexuals will not inherit the kingdom of Heaven.
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We are also told that WHOSOEVER believes in Jesus shall not perish and will have everlasting life.
 
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#2,066
#2,066
Bassmaster_Vol said:
First, I have never said that you needed God to live a moral life. That is where rooster or whatever his name is was misrepresenting me. Just that you have no reason to because without God morality is simply your opinion and nothing more.
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I was replying to your statement we have "no morality" without God. I gave my reasons for morality (empathy, societal constructs, etc.). I never said that you said that. Good work on moving goal posts then saying I was misrepresenting you.
 
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#2,068
#2,068
drvenner said:
I know several agnostics. They have stated to me that their philosophy is that they simply don't know. They have not stated to me that there is no God. I have no reason to believe that they would be lying. There is more of a stigma attached to being an atheist than there is to being agnostic, but if someone says that is what they are, then I don't tend to question them. What sort of claim are you speaking of exactly?
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This is not the first time you have said something about me having a lazy position or something like that. Not going to look it up, doesn't matter. I explained my point to Vandiver above. I'm not accusing them of lying, but they usually tend to lean towards the negative than the positive is all I was saying. At least the ones I know. I can't say that it is a universal.
 
#2,069
#2,069
Bassmaster_Vol said:
This is not the first time you have said something about me having a lazy position or something like that. Not going to look it up, doesn't matter. I explained my point to Vandiver above. I'm not accusing them of lying, but they usually tend to lean towards the negative than the positive is all I was saying. At least the ones I know. I can't say that it is a universal.
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Good enough. I won't belabor the point further.
 
#2,070
#2,070
drvenner said:
What exactly is the right direction? What if they say they have met someone that they truly love, that they have never been attracted to the opposite gender and that they will never be happy if they cannot continue with the lifestyle that they have now?
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The right direction is to have the traditional marriage we read about in the word. It doesn't really matter what they say, what's right is right and what's wrong is wrong. Thing about it is, we're all given a free will to lead the kind of life we want to lead. I wouldn't be able to stop them from being gay, but make no mistake, they'll know of my displeasure.
 
#2,071
#2,071
drvenner said:
We are also told that WHOSOEVER believes in Jesus shall not perish and will have everlasting life.
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This is true. Whoever believes in Jesus will be saved. That means more than an intellectual assent though, believing in Jesus is a commitment to Him. As Romans says, "If we confess with our mouths that Jesus is LORD, we will be saved." Salvation involves Lordship, not simply claiming we believe in Him and then living as though we don't. Jesus said "If you love Me you will keep My commandments."
 
#2,073
#2,073
Bassmaster_Vol said:
Now this is what I understand agnosticism to be. I could be wrong, but from my studies, the difference between atheism and agnosticism is openness to the possibility of their being a God, correct? My only point to Swanson was that he said that God was made up. That is more atheistic than agnostic to say that.

I do find it interesting tho that I have never met an agnostic who lives as though God does exist. The ones I have encountered have always argued against me that He does not exist. I just think that's interesting that the agnostics that I have encountered never say you know, God "probably" does exist. No, they usually say, He "probably" doesn't.
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Very fair point, as I lean towards the idea that god doesn't exist, at least not in the form described in major religious texts.

I am more open to the idea of a deity or a god that we can't yet comprehend.

I am an agnostic though, because I am ultimately undecided.
 
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#2,074
#2,074
Bassmaster_Vol said:
Now this is what I understand agnosticism to be. I could be wrong, but from my studies, the difference between atheism and agnosticism is openness to the possibility of their being a God, correct? My only point to Swanson was that he said that God was made up. That is more atheistic than agnostic to say that.

I do find it interesting tho that I have never met an agnostic who lives as though God does exist. The ones I have encountered have always argued against me that He does not exist. I just think that's interesting that the agnostics that I have encountered never say you know, God "probably" does exist. No, they usually say, He "probably" doesn't.
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I literally said that very thing earlier today. I beleive in a higher power and a grand design just dont know what it is.
 
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#2,075
#2,075
Bassmaster_Vol said:
This is true. Whoever believes in Jesus will be saved. That means more than an intellectual assent though, believing in Jesus is a commitment to Him. As Romans says, "If we confess with our mouths that Jesus is LORD, we will be saved." Salvation involves Lordship, not simply claiming we believe in Him and then living as though we don't. Jesus said "If you love Me you will keep My commandments."
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True. But we are all sinners and fall short. Every day. Every single day. Do the sins you or I commit on a daily basis carry less weight than someone who leads a homosexual lifestyle?
 
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