The Official Rick Barnes discussion thread

#503
#503
I’ve seen some guys take some really bad hills to die on here, but this may be the worst ever. Just take the loss and move on. Not a big deal as we all have incorrect reads sometimes and this is one of yours.
 
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#504
#504
therickbol said:
So Punter averages 10ppg the season before Barnes gets here and then 22ppg in Barnes first year. But yeah Barnes didn't develop him on offense at all. 🤔
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Punter didnt develop anything he went from being the third option to the only option in Barnes first year. Punter was playing hero ball on a terrible team (sidenote: this was also barnes only season with a losing record here). Punter stepped into the role vacated by Josh Richardson and had no competition for shots. Did you actually watch that team? The next year he started bringing in his guys and developing them. Schofield and Alexander are the only members of that inaugural team that played significant roles later. The rest mostly transfered out or graduated.

I've said it plainly all players on a recently coached team are going to get better overall each year. Experience and opportunity are what drives most improvement. As far as developing if you mean rolling out the ball and giving the green light yeah he developed the hell out of Punter. He saw he was a shooter and told him to go shoot the ball. He was a shooter the year before but the offense went through Richardson under Tyndalls watch.
 
#505
#505
pimo1 said:
Punter didnt develop anything he went from being the third option to the only option in Barnes first year. Punter was playing hero ball on a terrible team (sidenote: this was also barnes only season with a losing record here). Punter stepped into the role vacated by Josh Richardson and had no competition for shots. Did you actually watch that team? The next year he started bringing in his guys and developing them. Schofield and Alexander are the only members of that inaugural team that played significant roles later. The rest mostly transfered out or graduated.

I've said it plainly all players on a recently coached team are going to get better overall each year. Experience and opportunity are what drives most improvement. As far as developing if you mean rolling out the ball and giving the green light yeah he developed the hell out of Punter. He saw he was a shooter and told him to go shoot the ball. He was a shooter the year before but the offense went through Richardson under Tyndalls watch.
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Punter became a better shooter under Barnes, the whole story of that off season was how Barnes changed the Punters shoots and how much improved his shot was because of it. TV announcer's would even mention during televised Tennessee games.
 
#506
#506
cncchris33 said:
Even as ridiculous as this idea is, your own words seem to oppose your entire premise.
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No it does not. Any basketball player is going to improve year to year period. If tou get playing time you get better. Thats not developing. An example of developing would be someone like Santi who developed asca defensive player over his time. Itdidnt always show in the box score but if you look at games his first year and his last year here as a defender Santi was night and day. Grant, JJJ, Admiral and so on all developed greatly under Barnes as defenders. Offense was something they already had an yes it improved but it was their defense that made them. Grant williams is not on an NBA roster to score points. In fact outside of one all of Barnes VFLs in the nba are defenders first.

I am not saying Barnes cant coach his is a hall of famer and has a great staff year in year out. The point is offense is not his strength or calling card. His blueprint has been recruit kids from HS develop them as defenders get some offense from the portal. Its bee like that every year...it just with DK and now Lanier it worked. People forgot we did this same thing before with Justin Powell (didnt pan out) and then Gainey which has paid dividends.
 
#507
#507
pimo1 said:
No it does not. Any basketball player is going to improve year to year period. If tou get playing time you get better. Thats not developing. An example of developing would be someone like Santi who developed asca defensive player over his time. Itdidnt always show in the box score but if you look at games his first year and his last year here as a defender Santi was night and day. Grant, JJJ, Admiral and so on all developed greatly under Barnes as defenders. Offense was something they already had an yes it improved but it was their defense that made them. Grant williams is not on an NBA roster to score points. In fact outside of one all of Barnes VFLs in the nba are defenders first.

I am not saying Barnes cant coach his is a hall of famer and has a great staff year in year out. The point is offense is not his strength or calling card. His blueprint has been recruit kids from HS develop them as defenders get some offense from the portal. Its bee like that every year...it just with DK and now Lanier it worked. People forgot we did this same thing before with Justin Powell (didnt pan out) and then Gainey which has paid dividends.
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Your profile of his "blueprint" covers 3 or 4 years of his 10-yr tenure. What about the other 6-7? Just stop with this charade. You're wrong, plain and simple. No one is calling him an offensive coaching savant, but you're trying to take it so far to the other extreme while ignoring every example as to how you're wrong.
 
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#508
#508
pimo1 said:
Punter didnt develop anything he went from being the third option to the only option in Barnes first year. Punter was playing hero ball on a terrible team (sidenote: this was also barnes only season with a losing record here). Punter stepped into the role vacated by Josh Richardson and had no competition for shots. Did you actually watch that team? The next year he started bringing in his guys and developing them. Schofield and Alexander are the only members of that inaugural team that played significant roles later. The rest mostly transfered out or graduated.

I've said it plainly all players on a recently coached team are going to get better overall each year. Experience and opportunity are what drives most improvement. As far as developing if you mean rolling out the ball and giving the green light yeah he developed the hell out of Punter. He saw he was a shooter and told him to go shoot the ball. He was a shooter the year before but the offense went through Richardson under Tyndalls watch.
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Factually wrong.

It was well known and reported that CRB had him alter his shot during the summer which clearly paid off.
 
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#509
#509
pimo1 said:
No it does not. Any basketball player is going to improve year to year period. If tou get playing time you get better. Thats not developing. An example of developing would be someone like Santi who developed asca defensive player over his time. Itdidnt always show in the box score but if you look at games his first year and his last year here as a defender Santi was night and day. Grant, JJJ, Admiral and so on all developed greatly under Barnes as defenders. Offense was something they already had an yes it improved but it was their defense that made them. Grant williams is not on an NBA roster to score points. In fact outside of one all of Barnes VFLs in the nba are defenders first.

I am not saying Barnes cant coach his is a hall of famer and has a great staff year in year out. The point is offense is not his strength or calling card. His blueprint has been recruit kids from HS develop them as defenders get some offense from the portal. Its bee like that every year...it just with DK and now Lanier it worked. People forgot we did this same thing before with Justin Powell (didnt pan out) and then Gainey which has paid dividends.
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The more you post trying to defend this ridiculous opinion, the less credibility you have in regard to understanding the game of basketball. Friendly advice - admit you may have gone too far, move on and maybe you can restore some credibility.
 
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#510
#510
pimo1 said:
Punter didnt develop anything he went from being the third option to the only option in Barnes first year. Punter was playing hero ball on a terrible team (sidenote: this was also barnes only season with a losing record here). Punter stepped into the role vacated by Josh Richardson and had no competition for shots. Did you actually watch that team? The next year he started bringing in his guys and developing them. Schofield and Alexander are the only members of that inaugural team that played significant roles later. The rest mostly transfered out or graduated.

I've said it plainly all players on a recently coached team are going to get better overall each year. Experience and opportunity are what drives most improvement. As far as developing if you mean rolling out the ball and giving the green light yeah he developed the hell out of Punter. He saw he was a shooter and told him to go shoot the ball. He was a shooter the year before but the offense went through Richardson under Tyndalls watch.
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Now it is abundantly clear you are a troll or completely ignorant.
 
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#511
#511
Kas232323 said:
The more you post trying to defend this ridiculous opinion, the less credibility you have in regard to understanding the game of basketball. Friendly advice - admit you may have gone too far, move on and maybe you can restore some credibility.
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He proved long ago that he is either a troll or is ignorant to the game of basketball.
 
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#512
#512
cncchris33 said:
Your profile of his "blueprint" covers 3 or 4 years of his 10-yr tenure. What about the other 6-7? Just stop with this charade. You're wrong, plain and simple. No one is calling him an offensive coaching savant, but you're trying to take it so far to the other extreme while ignoring every example as to how you're wrong.
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The portal and NIL didn't work the way it does not in his first few years.. but nice try. The blueprint exists because it can. It didn't work that way back then. I am not my premise was expecting him to make some terrible offensive player good is silly. GO back to the beginning of the conversation. My original reply.
 
#513
#513
therickbol said:
Now it is abundantly clear you are a troll or completely ignorant.
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how is it apparent? I love how you guys do the whole thing where you claim a thing with no backup. Kevin punter was always a shooter...came in a shooter/scorer.... His first year under Tyndal Josh Richardson was the guy.... His second year under Barnes he was the guy. There was no mystery there. Its not like he was some raw guy that averaged 4 points a game the year before he was tied for second on the team in scoring. Almost all the undercalssmen on that team with the exception of Admiral and Alexander transferred out. Punter scored more points because he put up more shots.. because there was literally no one else to shoot. Admiral and Alexander were true freshmen and the rest of the team is the reason Tyndall was not the coach anymore.

Again this was Barnes only losing season at UT. Punter was out there laying hero ball and showing out at home games. He shot like crap on the road. he went from 8 shots a game hist first year to 15 his second year so yeah double he shots double the points. Like I said if developing is saying hey I don't have anyone else so take all the shots... I am the one wrong here.
 
#514
#514
pimo1 said:
The portal and NIL didn't work the way it does not in his first few years.. but nice try. The blueprint exists because it can. It didn't work that way back then. I am not my premise was expecting him to make some terrible offensive player good is silly. GO back to the beginning of the conversation. My original reply.
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You're wrong, plain and simple.

⬆️ This will be my sole reply going forward. I'm not entertaining your attempts to be the smartest person in the room by taking the contrarian view on every subject.
 
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#515
#515
CRB is a great defensive coach. Has won a lot of games at Texas and Tennessee. He will get you in the tourney damn near every year. But win the tourney well he would need a few upsets to take place and a perfect storm scenario.
 
#516
#516
cncchris33 said:
You're wrong, plain and simple.

⬆️ This will be my sole reply going forward. I'm not entertaining your attempts to be the smartest person in the room by taking the contrarian view on every subject.
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You cant correct me? I mean help me learn......give me some knowledge. My premise is Rick Barnes is a hall of fame DEFENSIVE coach and generally all-around great coach. Developing offensive talent is not his forte and there is no evidence its a thing he does. Thats been my premise this whole time. Hell I'll make you cringe more... Proof of what i'm saying Bruce Pearl is a great coach and a terrible developer of talent. He can take talent and win.. but guys don't normally develop under him. I don't know your definition but developing a guy is taking a raw talent and making it something it was not before you had it. MJ putting on muscle, developing a fade away and later a 3 point shot is development. WIth the exception of KD and DK kinda funny how that works out.. All the players Barnes has sent to the NBA were there for their defense. Those guys are who they are and didn't need anyone to teach them to score.
 
#519
#519
calhouns#1 said:
Barnes is an excellent coach all around. Was admiral scheduled drafted for defense? I think not. His outside shot got better every year under barnes. And let's look at his present and past PGs. And what a classy Christian man as role model for these young adults. I'll send my son to play for Barnes anytime
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Admiral Schofield
 
#520
#520
calhouns#1 said:
Barnes is an excellent coach all around. Was admiral scheduled drafted for defense? I think not. His outside shot got better every year under barnes. And let's look at his present and past PGs. And what a classy Christian man as role model for these young adults. I'll send my son to play for Barnes anytime
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This. This. This. As good as a coach and developer that Barnes is, he’s also succeeded without players getting arrested, accused of misconduct, cheating, etc. He runs a clean program and holds these young men to it.
 
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#521
#521
pimo1 said:
You cant correct me? I mean help me learn......give me some knowledge. My premise is Rick Barnes is a hall of fame DEFENSIVE coach and generally all-around great coach. Developing offensive talent is not his forte and there is no evidence its a thing he does. Thats been my premise this whole time. Hell I'll make you cringe more... Proof of what i'm saying Bruce Pearl is a great coach and a terrible developer of talent. He can take talent and win.. but guys don't normally develop under him. I don't know your definition but developing a guy is taking a raw talent and making it something it was not before you had it. MJ putting on muscle, developing a fade away and later a 3 point shot is development. WIth the exception of KD and DK kinda funny how that works out.. All the players Barnes has sent to the NBA were there for their defense. Those guys are who they are and didn't need anyone to teach them to score.
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He's a HOF coach. There's not a caveat to it all. There isn't an asterisk with a note at the bottom.
 
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#522
#522
cncchris33 said:
You're wrong, plain and simple.

⬆️ This will be my sole reply going forward. I'm not entertaining your attempts to be the smartest person in the room by taking the contrarian view on every subject.
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It's a poor attempt by him to be the smartest person in the room. That continuing narrative from him makes him look stupid
 
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#523
#523
TheFlash1971 said:
CRB is a great defensive coach. Has won a lot of games at Texas and Tennessee. He will get you in the tourney damn near every year. But win the tourney well he would need a few upsets to take place and a perfect storm scenario.
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Riddle me this...how are we Top 20 KP for O?
 
#525
#525
pimo1 said:
Pile on or not.. but if you have a stance back it up.

People keep saying all these amazing scorers developed... but out side of Grant, none of them peaked at more than 14 a game. Even with Grant he just improved incrementally over the years. He was never a bad scorer his minutes improved and so did his scoring.
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Wow.
 
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