Rick Barnes discussion [merged]

[VolsSportsFan]

If you think Pearl inherited a roster similar to what Barnes inherited then there is no reasoning with you.

I've long said that while Pearl deserves all the credit for the turnaround in Year 1 compared to the year before, it also showed how utterly incompetent Buzz Peterson was as a coach. He had basically the same team the year before with Brandon Crump and went 14-17. Part of what makes Pearl look even better is he followed a terrible basketball coach. Look back at the talent Peterson had his 4 years and he should have at least had 2 NCAAT teams if not 3.

 

[VOLnVANDYland]

I’m sorry it’s year 6... why are we arguing about who inherited less talent? Let’s focus on the fact that we have been a huge disappointment this year despite 2 freshman future first rounders,an athletic as hell future second rounder, and a veteran roster. Everyone should agree that If this team can’t make it past the first weekend it’s a colossal failure.

 

[vols 30]

I've enjoyed the success of Pearl and Barnes. It's UT basketball. I don't have a level in the NCAA's they have to reach to be considered successful. Just get to the tournament. From there, it's all about match ups with some luck.

It still blows my mind the number of UT fans that are in denial of the success of Pearl and his teams. Same with Barnes TBH

 

[VolFreakJosh]

If Pearl never lied over something so stupid and got everyone else involved, he would still be our coach and we wouldn’t be discussing whether Barnes is the answer or not.

Pearl is not above criticism either if you want to play that game.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

I've enjoyed the success of Pearl and Barnes. It's UT basketball. I don't have a level in the NCAA's they have to reach to be considered successful. Just get to the tournament. From there, it's all about match ups with some luck.

It still blows my mind the number of UT fans that are in denial of the success of Pearl and his teams. Same with Barnes TBH

For me it's the revisionist history of Pearl's time here and used to somehow bash Barnes. Pearl is constantly praised because he made the NCAAT every year, but now we have people saying even if Barnes did that from now on it wouldn't be good enough. Granted some of the same ones saying it were probably the same ones that were ready to run off Pearl before the Elite 8 run that was very unexpected.

And the ones that claim that Pearl would have had mulitple FFs and probably a National title by now if he hadn't have been fired......based on what? That's up there with the people that say if Fulmer hadn't been fired he would have had us back to winning SEC Championships again.

I celebrate what Pearl did here, but some here need to be honest about it and stop inflating it just to try to bash Barnes. It's silly, especially when we have plenty of crappy coaches to bash in our history.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Another example of how terrible Peterson is, he was the coach of UNC Wilmington from 2010 to 2014. In his 4 seasons, he went 13-17, 10-20, 10-20, and 9-23. He was then fired, and Kevin Keatts took over.

Keatts went 18-14 and won the regular season shared CAA Championship, lost in the CAA Semis and lost in the CIT. The next year Keatts went 25-8, were again regular season co-champs, won the CAA Tourney and made the NCAAT losing by 8 to #4 seed Duke. Keatts' third year they were 29-6, outright CAA regular season champs, won the CAAT and again made the NCAAT losing by 5 to #5 Virginia. Keatts would then leave for NC St.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

Agreed. Barnes is probably 10 arrests short.

Lest not forget the cluster of a roster Barnes inherited.

We know Martin left Tyndall a shameful roster. Martin knew it so he had a convenient excuse for leaving with the racism cries after a group of crazies signed some letter if I recall correctly. I don't really care because I thought it was all pretty stupid. Cuonzo knew the season he was about to have.

Then Tyndall has to band aid the roster with JUCO's and transfers. Surprising he had any success after what Martin left. Was fired for recruiting violations at Southern Miss. At this point the UT program was in the dumps of embarrassment.

The embarrassment chain Pearl violations=> Martin racism => Tyndall violations and one year and out.

Then Barnes inherited a roster no one would want in a Power 5. Just going off memory he had like 1 returning contributor. Kevin Pointer. We will give him 3 returning contributors just to throw in some bones. So the 1st year or two was going to be a wash. He still overachieved by most standards. I will conduct some research if needed but I think we generally agree.

Also, Barnes would have had a very good chance of making the NCAAT in his first year had Punter not been injured and missed the last 8 games of the season.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

I’m sorry it’s year 6... why are we arguing about who inherited less talent? Let’s focus on the fact that we have been a huge disappointment this year despite 2 freshman future first rounders,an athletic as hell future second rounder, and a veteran roster. Everyone should agree that If this team can’t make it past the first weekend it’s a colossal failure.

Because the argument continues to be regurgitated that Pearl went to the NCAAT every year he was here. 2 of his final 3 TN teams finished the season out of the top 25 rankings.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Because the argument continues to be regurgitated that Pearl went to the NCAAT every year he was here. 2 of his final 3 TN teams finished the season out of the top 25 rankings.

And those people don't bring up that of the 6 NCAAT appearances, 4 of them you can say we underachieved in the NCAAT.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

And those people don't bring up that of the 6 NCAAT appearances, 4 of them you can say we underachieved in the NCAAT.

Really the only thing significant that Pearl accomplished in the tournament was beating Ohio State one year in the Sweet 16. Most of his NCAAT wins were versus mid-majors or worse. His 31 win team ended their season with a 19 point blow out by Louisville in that NCAAT. He did beat Memphis and was number 1 for a week but choked versus Vandy in the first game with that ranking. In his first year he got a #2 seed and made an early exit from the NCAAT. His teams finished unranked in his 4th and 6th seasons. Without CJ, Lofton, and JaJuan he wouldn’t have had anywhere close to his early success. Plus he has a very flawed character. It was fun while he was here but I never want him to coach another game as TN’s head coach.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

Really the only thing significant that Pearl accomplished in the tournament was beating Ohio State one year in the Sweet 16. Most of his NCAAT wins were versus mid-majors or worse. His 31 win team ended their season with a 19 point blow out by Louisville in that NCAAT. He did beat Memphis and was number 1 for a week but choked versus Vandy in the first game with that ranking. In his first year he got a #2 seed and made an early exit from the NCAAT. His teams finished unranked in his 4th and 6th seasons. Without CJ, Lofton, and JaJuan he wouldn’t have had anywhere close to his early success. Plus he has a very flawed character. It was fun while he was here but I never want him to coach another game as TN’s head coach.

Also, if regular season success doesn’t mean sh*t according to some folks, then why is Pearl being praised for getting to the tournament every year but under Barnes, that isn’t enough?

 

[zjcvols]

We did have the potential to be a dumpster fire, with what Tyndall left us with. I don't think it was quite that bad but Barnes wasn't working with a lot his first 2 seasons.

No I agree but saying it was amazing we got back to NCAAT in year 3 is such a joke.

If this job was such a dumpster fire and we hired such a great coach as it’s been said...that job isn’t a dumpster fire.

 

[Roustabout]

For me it's the revisionist history of Pearl's time here and used to somehow bash Barnes. Pearl is constantly praised because he made the NCAAT every year, but now we have people saying even if Barnes did that from now on it wouldn't be good enough. Granted some of the same ones saying it were probably the same ones that were ready to run off Pearl before the Elite 8 run that was very unexpected.

And the ones that claim that Pearl would have had mulitple FFs and probably a National title by now if he hadn't have been fired......based on what? That's up there with the people that say if Fulmer hadn't been fired he would have had us back to winning SEC Championships again.

I celebrate what Pearl did here, but some here need to be honest about it and stop inflating it just to try to bash Barnes. It's silly, especially when we have plenty of crappy coaches to bash in our history.

I think it’s more that Pearl is now coaching in the SEC and having better success than he had when here. This gives you two sides. One constantly is compares Barnes to Pearl and the other sits around praying that Pearl gets taken down by the NCAA. They are both pretty miserable, but the latter much more so.

 

[zjcvols]

Also, Barnes would have had a very good chance of making the NCAAT in his first year had Punter not been injured and missed the last 8 games of the season.

LMAO we were 12-14 when he went down. We weren’t making the tourney at all.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

No I agree but saying it was amazing we got back to NCAAT in year 3 is such a joke.

If this job was such a dumpster fire and we hired such a great coach as it’s been said...that job isn’t a dumpster fire.

With the cloud hanging over the program after Bruce’s NCAA troubles, Cuonzo insinuating a racist environment, and Donnie getting a 10 year show cause attached to his exit, recruiting was a disaster. Throw on top of that all of the narrative that Barnes was old, washed up, and just here to cash some paychecks and it absolutely was a huge accomplishment getting TN back on track and into the NCAAT.

Now TN is landing 5 star recruits unlike no other time in program history. It’s never going to be a straight line to the top. At this point of this season it’s been disappointing based on over exaggerated expectations. Our 2 elite freshmen are still teenagers, one of them didn’t play last year due to an injury and the other has a difficult to fully recover from injury. Now our 3rd most talented basketball player just sat out with an injury and one of the two seniors shouldn’t even be playing with his health issues. I’ve always thought that the Sweet 16 was the likely best result, but also considered an EE or FF to be within reach this year if the breaks went in TN’s favor. They clearly haven’t when all of the first 7, other than possibly Bailey, have had health issues.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

No I agree but saying it was amazing we got back to NCAAT in year 3 is such a joke.

If this job was such a dumpster fire and we hired such a great coach as it’s been said...that job isn’t a dumpster fire.

Tennessee is a good job but getting to an elite status would require us to hire an elite HC whenever Barnes decides to retire.

That leaves very few candidates that fit that mold.

Hiring an up & comer is the most realistic option that will happen whether some of you believe it or not.

 

[alvinkamara]

I think our AD has an affinity for up and comers like himself......I have to agree with Josh but will try not to make a habit of that

 

[BreatheUT]

I think it’s more that Pearl is now coaching in the SEC and having better success than he had when here. This gives you two sides. One constantly is compares Barnes to Pearl and the other sits around praying that Pearl gets taken down by the NCAA. They are both pretty miserable, but the latter much more so.

I think he has cheated more. He had a coach arrested. The NCAA has been after him again and Auburn let him give the NCAA the middle finger. They are dirty.

 

[zjcvols]

With the cloud hanging over the program after Bruce’s NCAA troubles, Cuonzo insinuating a racist environment, and Donnie getting a 10 year show cause attached to his exit, recruiting was a disaster. Throw on top of that all of the narrative that Barnes was old, washed up, and just here to cash some paychecks and it absolutely was a huge accomplishment getting TN back on track and into the NCAAT.

Now TN is landing 5 star recruits unlike no other time in program history. It’s never going to be a straight line to the top. At this point of this season it’s been disappointing based on over exaggerated expectations. Our 2 elite freshmen are still teenagers, one of them didn’t play last year due to an injury and the other has a difficult to fully recover from injury. Now our 3rd most talented basketball player just sat out with an injury and one of the two seniors shouldn’t even be playing with his health issues. I’ve always thought that the Sweet 16 was the likely best result, but also considered an EE or FF to be within reach this year if the breaks went in TN’s favor. They clearly haven’t when all of the first 7, other than possibly Bailey, have had health issues.

No it wasn’t a huge accomplishment making the tournament in year 3, that should be a given expectation. Now want to argue about building a top 15 team for two years, yes that was impressive. But this program while not in good shape at the time was not a dumpster fire. It was not an impossible job. It was not on the verge of collapse. Again if this job was so toxic why was Barnes so eager to take it with no previous ties to UT. Hell he had the job lined up when Texas fired him. He could have found another P5 job a year later and waited if this was place so bad.

 

[zjcvols]

Tennessee is a good job but getting to an elite status would require us to hire an elite HC whenever Barnes decides to retire.

That leaves very few candidates that fit that mold.

Hiring an up & comer is the most realistic option that will happen whether some of you believe it or not.

You talk more about firing or replacing Barnes more than anyone on the board. I literally didn’t mention replacing Barnes in any way, shape or form yet here you are playing the “who you gonna get”card when I never even discussed replacing him.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

You talk more about firing or replacing Barnes more than anyone on the board. I literally didn’t mention replacing Barnes in any way, shape or form yet here you are playing the “who you gonna get”card when I never even discussed replacing him.

Oh really?

Guess you’ve missed the “Barnes is washed” “He should give the fans back his 5 million salary.” comments that’s been said over & over again.

 

[zjcvols]

Oh really?

Guess you’ve missed the “Barnes is washed” “He should give the fans back his 5 million salary.” comments that’s been said over & over again.

Yet my post which you quoted literally mentioned none of that

 

[Vols8086]

I think he has cheated more. He had a coach arrested. The NCAA has been after him again and Auburn let him give the NCAA the middle finger. They are dirty.

Pearl has been caught more for sure, but any school fishing in the 5 star waters is dirty.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

Pearl has been caught more for sure, but any school fishing in the 5 star waters is dirty.

Pearl is a bad cheater who doesn’t know how to hide it.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

No it wasn’t a huge accomplishment making the tournament in year 3, that should be a given expectation. Now want to argue about building a top 15 team for two years, yes that was impressive. But this program while not in good shape at the time was not a dumpster fire. It was not an impossible job. It was not on the verge of collapse. Again if this job was so toxic why was Barnes so eager to take it with no previous ties to UT. Hell he had the job lined up when Texas fired him. He could have found another P5 job a year later and waited if this was place so bad.

His mother’s home was two hours from Knoxville. That had a lot to do with Barnes taking the TN job. If it is such a great situation why did TN need to settle for 3 clowns and an average coach with 3 years of experience in Green, Buzz, Cuonzo, and ButterBean?