The QB Debate - post South Carolina (merged)

[k-town_king]

When coaches and experts like Danielson say JG lacks the intangibles to be a top SEC QB what part of the word “intangibles” is unclear? By definition “intangibles” can’t be measured in “stats”. Therefore “stats” in JG’s case are meaningless. Stats are only meaningful in comparing QBs who already possess all the “intangibles” necessary to succeed. If you can’t see the field and take 40 sacks and get pancaked on almost every single throw whether complete or incomplete the stats tell you nothing.

KC is the better QB but not the better athlete. His only problem is a longevity / eligibility problem. He won’t be here next year so starting and winning with KC builds nothing for the future in the eyes of our coaches. That’s the bottom line

Needs to improve doesn't mean "lacks." He didn't say he lacks those but needs to improve.

KC is in no way better. He doesn't start because he isn't as good.

2 sacks per game is not pace for 40.

 

[Volsfaninva917]

2 sacks per game this year for JG. Let's stop trying to find some new agenda driven narrative to bash JG. Yes he had a ton last year. 2 per game this year.

Lmao. Y'all are funny. It's sad really.

But let's act like he hasn't improved a ton this year.

So, last year he was sacked 26 times through 9 games. Thats 2.8 per game, this year he's on pace to be sacked 26 times through 12 games that's 2 per game. While an improvement from last year is it really that significant you can point to and say he's arrived? What is your agenda for hating Keller Chryst, asking for a friend.

 

[beneVOLence]

I don't know how to look at that article. My eyes see JG getting sacked a lot. So if it is not that he is hanging onto the ball longer, then he either doesn't recognize the blitz pre-snap and doesn't adjust the blocking scheme or the OL doesn't adjust and misses blocks. It could be a little of both, but it needs to get fixed before he is seriously hurt.

KC did well and got the ball out quickly and I'm glad he is our backup for this year, but he not the future. The huge question is JG the future. I believe he is, but CJP may like Strout or he could be recruiting someone else he likes better. Who knows. I believe JG, if healthy, will be our starter the rest of our games this year. If not, then KC is a serviceable backup.

 

[MiramarVol]

The dogs were called off at 28-0. That's when he came in. He saw a very vanilla base defensive front. He was still pressured cause our OL as we all know is pourous. Big difference playing in the 1st qtr than in the late 2nd-4th.

 

[volfan411]

Two sacks per game. Big time improvements over last year.

Most and qbs in college aren't calling audibles. KC isn't.

Stop acting like y'all are in the coaches room and know who has what responsibility and who called what at the line.

Pruitt said after the Alabama game "if JG doesn't like to get hit he needs to learn to change the play at the line". Go back and listen for yourself. I am not defending either QB but until we start picking up the blitz at the LOS JG is going to be blitzed every down.

 

[MiramarVol]

That was a sweet blitz Bama dialed up though. He should have seen the Safety over the top and slid way over as a key read, but he didn't. But, man 75 missed that block and he got clocked.

 

[ShoalCreekVol]

JG is a DUAL threat qb much better passing when running 25 % of the time. KC is more of the drop back passer. We have to get JG back to what he is good at or move on.

Dual threat? Running? Like, with the football? Haven’t seen it.

I recall that when he was being recruited, his family made a fairly public push to have home classified as a “dual threat” by the recruiting services to help his ranking. He was not then, nor has he been since arriving on campus here, a dual threat QB. That was the recruiting faux hype machine at work.

If he had running ability, some of his other issues would be less impactful.

 

[ShoalCreekVol]

The dogs were called off at 28-0. That's when he came in. He saw a very vanilla base defensive front. He was still pressured cause our OL as we all know is pourous. Big difference playing in the 1st qtr than in the late 2nd-4th.

That is a storyline that some seem to hang on to, but you can’t overlook that Bama still had starters in the game while KC was throwing TDs. The article linked by the OP in this thread stated that KC was blitzed twice and handled it both times, getting rid of the ball in 1.7 seconds or less and completing 1 of 2.

 

[ShoalCreekVol]

What? JG is no threat, let alone dual threat. 60% of the time his running is terrible 100% of the time.

So we put in a run package for him called “Sex Panther”, see what happens?

 

[PulaskiVolFan]

Do you guy realize why they blitz JG all the time ? He can't read it and will stand in there and take the SACK or fumble. JG is just as mediocre as Chryst but the eyes say Chryst can run an offense and seems to know what he is doing whether blitzed or not.

Evidently the eyes that see Chryst every day don't see it. He may get rid of it quicker but it also takes longer for the ball to get there. Chryst doesn't have the arm strength to stretch a defense, Stanford knew it and CJP knows it, as would every DC in the league if he was our starter. Great backup because he can manage a game but can't really help this current team win because he has deficiencies that our talent and scheme can't make up for.

 

[BeecherVol]

Evidently the eyes that see Chryst every day don't see it. He may get rid of it quicker but it also takes longer for the ball to get there. Chryst doesn't have the arm strength to stretch a defense, Stanford knew it and CJP knows it, as would every DC in the league if he was our starter. Great backup because he can manage a game but can't really help this current team win because he has deficiencies that our talent and scheme can't make up for.

Id factor in the idea that JG has eligibility left after this year where Chryst doesn't. I don't think there is some massive divide between what the 2 can do, even tho their strengths and weaknesses are different.

 

[PulaskiVolFan]

Id factor in the idea that JG has eligibility left after this year where Chryst doesn't. I don't think there is some massive divide between what the 2 can do, even tho their strengths and weaknesses are different.

Why do fans continue to disregard Chryst arm strength? The ball looks like a marshmallow when it leaves his hand. In this league if you don't have arm strength then you get chewed up. Just think how rough our offense would look without JGs threat of throwing the deep ball. Chryst lacks it and everyone with a clue about player evaluation sees it. He's not playing because half of this board can throw it as far as he. It's the reason QBs named Worley, McBride, Dormandy, middle Clausen and others have never and will likely never produce effectively in this league. It's not a knock on them as very few people in the world have the arm strength as well as all the intangibles to go with it!

 

[BeecherVol]

Why do fans continue to disregard Chryst arm strength? The ball looks like a marshmallow when it leaves his hand. In this league if you don't have arm strength then you get chewed up. Just think how rough our offense would look without JGs threat of throwing the deep ball. Chryst lacks it and everyone with a clue about player evaluation sees it. He's not playing because half of this board can throw it as far as he. It's the reason QBs named Worley, McBride, Dormandy, middle Clausen and others have never and will likely never produce effectively in this league. It's not a knock on them as very few people in the world have the arm strength as well as all the intangibles to go with it!

You lost me at JG and deep threat and VN talent evaluators.

JG started stretching the field 2 weeks ago with well thrown back shoulder throws and jump balls. I'm not altogether sure the staff shared your expert opinion prior to that.

I take it that you believe the staff must know what their doing since JG is the starter?

 

[BeecherVol]

Evidently the eyes that see Chryst every day don't see it. He may get rid of it quicker but it also takes longer for the ball to get there. Chryst doesn't have the arm strength to stretch a defense, Stanford knew it and CJP knows it, as would every DC in the league if he was our starter. Great backup because he can manage a game but can't really help this current team win because he has deficiencies that our talent and scheme can't make up for.

Given your description of him he should have never made it past middle school.

The deficiencies are what they are. And they would hold back a lot of QB regardless of ability. It's not like JG has been an eraser the way Dobbs was.

 

[PulaskiVolFan]

You lost me at JG and deep threat and VN talent evaluators.

JG started stretching the field 2 weeks ago with well thrown back shoulder throws and jump balls. I'm not altogether sure the staff shared your expert opinion prior to that.

I take it that you believe the staff must know what their doing since JG is the starter?

I'm a big fan of CJP and the staff. Not sold on our OC yet but we're young on that side so he gets a bit of a pass. Next year with an experienced QB, Jr/Sr laden offense vs a weak schedule will tell the tale of our current staff. Look for the 2020 class to produce our next great QB if Pruitt turns out to be a successful coach. Look for Chryst to be a coach or salesman after this season.

 

[PulaskiVolFan]

Given your description of him he should have never made it past middle school.

The deficiencies are what they are. And they would hold back a lot of QB regardless of ability. It's not like JG has been an eraser the way Dobbs was.

So you believe that what's best for our current offense is a big slow qb that can only throw it consistently 35 yards on a line is what is best for THIS offense? How does he help the run game? How does he help spread the field and open up the middle for us? How does he improve our big play threats that have happened way more this year than last? Where does Chryst improve our current offense?

 

[BeecherVol]

I'm a big fan of CJP and the staff. Not sold on our OC yet but we're young on that side so he gets a bit of a pass. Next year with an experienced QB, Jr/Sr laden offense vs a weak schedule will tell the tale of our current staff. Look for the 2020 class to produce our next great QB if Pruitt turns out to be a successful coach. Look for Chryst to be a coach or salesman after this season.

Did you question how JP missed so obviously on Chryst abilities given how anyone with one eye and have sense could see it? Or why hes on the field early in the season when JG obviously needed and still does need the time and reps?

Next years schedule is slightly weaker in one non conference game the SEC is what is.

I dont expect Chryst to play football after this season. JG has a ways to go before he can extend his. I'm not sold yet that he walks into or out of the spring as the cut and dry.

UT wont ve back until they are legit at QB. They re not right now.

 

[BeecherVol]

So you believe that what's best for our current offense is a big slow qb that can only throw it consistently 35 yards on a line is what is best for THIS offense? How does he help the run game? How does he help spread the field and open up the middle for us? How does he improve our big play threats that have happened way more this year than last? Where does Chryst improve our current offense?

No, you havent read much of what I've said apparently.
I believe JG is the starter right now because hes the best option. Part of that reason is his ceiling is higher because he has eligibility left. Not because he has proven himself to be really good yet.
I just find it juvenile to run down the back up that played pretty darn well Sat when called on to feel better about the starter.

If JP had the same opinion of Chryst that some here do hes not wasting the time.

 

[PulaskiVolFan]

Did you question how JP missed so obviously on Chryst abilities given how anyone with one eye and have sense could see it? Or why hes on the field early in the season when JG obviously needed and still does need the time and reps?

Next years schedule is slightly weaker in one non conference game the SEC is what is.

I dont expect Chryst to play football after this season. JG has a ways to go before he can extend his. I'm not sold yet that he walks into or out of the spring as the cut and dry.

UT wont ve back until they are legit at QB. They re not right now.

S Carolina, Mizzou, Miss St and Vandy will all have new QBs next year and Ky loses a ton of production with a weak qb. We should be favored in every game but 3 next season. If Pruitt is a great one, and I think he is, we will find out next year. Next year's schedule other than Fl, Ga and Bama will all be winnable games.

 

[PulaskiVolFan]

No, you havent read much of what I've said apparently.
I believe JG is the starter right now because hes the best option. Part of that reason is his ceiling is higher because he has eligibility left. Not because he has proven himself to be really good yet.
I just find it juvenile to run down the back up that played pretty darn well Sat when called on to feel better about the starter.

If JP had the same opinion of Chryst that some here do hes not wasting the time.

I thought Chryst played great Sat. I also believe that had it been a close game when he entered Saban would have pressed us into oblivion with everyone within 15 yards of the line of scrimmage and Chryst would be exposed. JG gives us a chance because of his arm talent. He's got a lot of improvement to make but it's clear that he is doing so every week. I think he's gonna be a good one before he's finished. People UNDERESTIMATE how bad Jones was at developing QBs and the damage it had on both Dobbs and JG.

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

View attachment 173500

Yup the throw into that tight window was setup by JG... can’t you see his number on the field? Oh and the plays before that where Chryst got us to this portion of the field.... that was setup by JG as well.

Chandler was super, super open on that play. Not a tight window at all. The WR basically took the LB covering him out of the play with a rub. Chryst could have lobbed it over the top but he zipped it in instead.

 

[PulaskiVolFan]

Chandler was super, super open on that play. Not a tight window at all. The WR basically took the LB covering him out of the play with a rub. Chryst could have lobbed it over the top but he zipped it in instead.

Lol, nothing he throws has zip on it!

 

[hUTch2002]

As a former QB and one that understands the position, 0.1 or 0.5(it doesn’t matter) means the difference between a completion or a sack. It means getting the ball out of your hand or tucking and running with it. It means a lot as a QB. Watch the 3 step drop with both QB’s. As soon as Chryst plants his back foot on that 3 step, the ball is being released. JG plants his foot and for some reason is still panning with his eyes. You can’t do that as a QB. Your eyes are panning as your dropping back. That decision has to be made as soon as the 3rd step happens. That is the difference with a veteran college QB and and a newbie. Makes all the difference in the world. I like JG but right now Chryst is much more in tune with the position as far the passing game.

Makes sense but why has Chryst looked so poor outside those 2 drives? No doubt you have a difference in experience though with Chryst as a 5th yr senior and Guarantano as a sophomore. Good insight. Certainly interesting to hear from someone who played the position. Who would you play based on the whole season, not just 2 drives against Bama?

 

[82_VOL_83]

You are 5 yrs old aren't you? And the sports writers are all saying that JG does not have the intangibles and KC does. And KC was a great QB before his injury. And finally why are you so defensive of JG? Are you dating him?

Visit the PF. Much of this love is agenda driven.

 

[KeyVol14]

Really annoying seeing all the hate out for JG. The dude gets pummeled every week and somehow it’s his fault. We don’t win that game at auburn without Garantano.