WWE Thread II

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#5,326
#5,326
Depends on how big your list is. Samartino, Hogan, Flair, Sting, Rock, Taker and Austin are the icons. Bret Hart, Michaels and Cena round out the top ten. HHH falls just behind in the insert wherever you want list of stars like Steamboat, Savage, Piper and Andre.
 
#5,327
#5,327
volfanbill said:
Depends on how big your list is. Samartino, Hogan, Flair, Sting, Rock, Taker and Austin are the icons. Bret Hart, Michaels and Cena round out the top ten. HHH falls just behind in the insert wherever you want list of stars like Steamboat, Savage, Piper and Andre.
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Undertaker is undefeated at wrestlmania. If Triple H was the greatest he would have that on his resume.
 
#5,328
#5,328
firestorm said:
Undertaker is undefeated at wrestlmania. If Triple H was the greatest he would have that on his resume.
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Undertaker isn't undefeated at WrestleMania.

Also, there's a difference in saying all time greatest and one of the greatest. As for significance and meaning tot he sport, Hogan and Flair both surpass Taker imo.
 
#5,329
#5,329
firestorm said:
:salute:

Yes triple h is overrated he's a great wrestler but far from the greatest which I don't doubt he believes with his whole king of kings alias.

On top of that he's a sore loser that couldn't accept he lost to John cena.
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After this post, i think i know who the "it's still real to me dammit!" guy is.
 
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#5,331
#5,331
I really don't think there's anyone more tired of HHH and ready for him to hang up his boots than I am. But he's possibly the best heel of all time and the DX stuff is as important to the Attitude Era and Monday Night Wars as anything. Trips is clearly a legend. I question saying one of the all time greatest. It's tough when you never once got to be the absolute superstar. Austin and Rock were light years ahead of him and I think Michaels had him beat too. Not to mention Taker. Then they all faded away and all of sudden every kid that watched wrestling loved Cena and he skyrocketed off the charts.
 
#5,332
#5,332
volfanbill said:
I really don't think there's anyone more tired of HHH and ready for him to hang up his boots than I am. But he's possibly the best heel of all time and the DX stuff is as important to the Attitude Era and Monday Night Wars as anything. Trips is clearly a legend. I question saying one of the all time greatest. It's tough when you never once got to be the absolute superstar. Austin and Rock were light years ahead of him and I think Michaels had him beat too. Not to mention Taker. Then they all faded away and all of sudden every kid that watched wrestling loved Cena and he skyrocketed off the charts.
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All of those you named are faces, easier to be there most popular guy as a face. I agree that me may be one of the best heels of all time. I hated him so much, he rarely ever lost a big match. He was so good at getting heat. Id put him in my top 15 at least.
 
#5,333
#5,333
Notorious B.E.N said:
All of those you named are faces, easier to be there most popular guy as a face. I agree that me may be one of the best heels of all time. I hated him so much, he rarely ever lost a big match. He was so good at getting heat. Id put him in my top 15 at least.
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I think the ten I named previously all outrank him, regardless of face/heel. There's probably ten stars you could name after that and put in any order you want and HHH belongs somewhere there. If top 15/20 can be considered all time greatest, then he gets the bill. I'd put the cut off at greatest all time at 10 personally.
 
#5,334
#5,334
HHH has the noteriety of being the only guy to successfully make me stop watch wrestling for several years. Not even Cena has been able to do that. In all fairness tho, HHH is better than Cena by a country mile. I think I've just been conditioned to accept that Cena sucks and move on. And it may not be all HHH's fault. He had the misfortune of trying to carry the torch after Hart/HBK/Austin/Rock. It was a culture shock.

That being said...

HHH is the greatest icon in WWE history.

If you don't believe me, ask him.
 
#5,335
#5,335
Even in a list containing only more) "modern era" wrestlers, I can leave off Triple H, and sure as hell the face of the decline John Cena.

Not ranking order:
1. Hulk Hogan
2 Steve Austin
3. Ric Flair
4. Shawn Michaels
5. Randy Savage
6. Bret Hart
7. The Undertaker
8. Sting
9. The Ultimate Warrior
10. Roddy Piper


Triple H can have an argument to be in towards the bottom. "Mr. 45% loss of the viewership" cannot.
 
#5,336
#5,336
*With all that said, I have more of an issue with Triple H cutting 20+ minute promos every week than I do him laying down clean once or twice a year for guys like Daniel Bryan, Brock Lesnar, 'The Shield', and (eventually) Sting.

He never was a great (offensive) worker, but his rub / under to DB at WM30 was a good match and a good thing for someone other than him (rare in the past).
 
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#5,337
#5,337
Volwark said:
HHH has the noteriety of being the only guy to successfully make me stop watch wrestling for several years. Not even Cena has been able to do that. In all fairness tho, HHH is better than Cena by a country mile. I think I've just been conditioned to accept that Cena sucks and move on. And it may not be all HHH's fault. He had the misfortune of trying to carry the torch after Hart/HBK/Austin/Rock. It was a culture shock.

That being said...

HHH is the greatest icon in WWE history.

If you don't believe me, ask him.
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Cena doesn't suck. Ask any ALL TIME GREAT and they all love Cena and say he's a hell of a worker. Jericho asked Bret if he could face any superstar he never got to face, who would it be, he said John Cena. Anything Austin talks about Cena he says how much of a fan he is and that he's a hell of a worker.
 
#5,339
#5,339
Volwark said:
What are they gonna say? That he sucks?
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They could name any other wrestler they want to and they name Cena. The product caused the drawdown in viewership, not Cena. Cena's merchandise sales are through the roof. Don't kid yourself.
 
#5,341
#5,341
volfanbill said:
They could name any other wrestler they want to and they name Cena. The product caused the drawdown in viewership, not Cena. Cena's merchandise sales are through the roof. Don't kid yourself.
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Because he had 4-5x the amount of products anyone else does. He come out with a new shirt, towel, armband, hat, and sometimes holding a totally different shirt every week.

Being able to sell merchandise with a company like WWE behind you more than anyone else with marketing and booking doesn't have a damn thing to do with how you execute and perform as a professional wrestler.

They could decide to get behind Damien Sandow tomorrow, give him 1A Superman booking for two years, much less than, and he could top merchandise sales.

Why isn't DB in the top 5 in sales despite being over more than anyone in the company? His shirts designed by the company have goats on them.... Literally.

It's all who Vince wants. This time next year, approaching WM32 Roman Reigns will be atop the sales number for merchandise. Is that going to make him the best in this business because of that? Give me a break.
 
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#5,342
#5,342
Mr_Henley said:
Because he had 4-5x the amount of products anyone else does. He come out with a new shirt, towel, armband, hat, and sometimes holding a totally different shirt every week.

Being able to sell merchandise with a company like WWE behind you more than anyone else with marketing and booking doesn't have a damn thing to do with how you execute and perform as a professional wrestler.
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lol. My oh my how you let your bias get in the way. If he wasn't any good, fans wouldn't like him and he wouldn't sell. It's kinda funny watching you get worked up about a superstar that just about every legend praises endlessly even when not asked.
 
#5,343
#5,343
attachment.php
 
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#5,344
#5,344
volfanbill said:
lol. My oh my how you let your bias get in the way. If he wasn't any good, fans wouldn't like him and he wouldn't sell. It's kinda funny watching you get worked up about a superstar that just about every legend praises endlessly even when not asked.
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I am bias. It's an entertainment company and I'm not entertained by him. I don't need Martin Lawrence to tell me which movies to like or Eminiem to tell me which albums to like.

Children and their mothers like Cena. And if they do that's fine, there are a ton of people of mentally buy in to his kayfabe character and it means something to them, that's fine.

It doesn't mean he is a GOAT in this company. The guy cannot wrestle.

He can lift weights. He can elicit cheap pops. He can legitimately do great things for kids and other organizations. He seems to be a god representative away from the ring. But he cannot wrestle.

Any legend that lobbies to work with Cena is simply towing a company line of keeping the bridge in tact with Vince.
 
#5,345
#5,345
*They could decide to get behind Damien Sandow tomorrow, give him 1A Superman booking for two years, much less than ten years, and he could top merchandise sales.

Why isn't DB in the top 5 in sales despite being over more than anyone in the company? His shirts designed by the company have goats on them.... Literally.

It's all who Vince wants. This time next year, approaching WM32 Roman Reigns will be atop the sales number for merchandise. Is that going to make him the best in this business because of that? Give me a break.
 
#5,346
#5,346
And to lighten the mood after standing up against the daily blowing of Cena,


Tribute to recent developments.
 

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#5,347
#5,347
Mr_Henley said:
I am bias. It's an entertainment company and I'm not entertained by him. I don't need Martin Lawrence to tell me which movies to like or Eminiem to tell me which albums to like.

Children and their mothers like Cena. And if they do that's fine, there are a ton of people of mentally buy in to his kayfabe character and it means something to them, that's fine.

It doesn't mean he is a GOAT in this company. The guy cannot wrestle.

He can lift weights. He can elicit cheap pops. He can legitimately do great things for kids and other organizations. He seems to be a god representative away from the ring. But he cannot wrestle.

Any legend that lobbies to work with Cena is simply towing a company line of keeping the bridge in tact with Vince.
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Your hate for Cena is blinding you. He can wrestle, you just don't like his 5 moves of doom.
 
#5,350
#5,350
I'm being semi-facetious. Cena is this generation's version of Hogan/Warrior, except he is a better wrestler. When it really counts, he rarely puts on a bad match. But his character is incredibly stale, he undersells, and his attempts at humor fail in large part. The women and the guys wanting to take their kids pay to see him, and the rest of the guys pay to see somebody beat his ass.

All that being said, to this day his position as the top guy in the company is baffling to me because - in the ring - he comes across as a guy who would be a midcarder in the Attitude era at best. I watch the show in spite of him, not because of him. If he wasn't on the show, I wouldn't miss him and I think that's saying something.
 
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