Will this finally settle the Manning - Brady debate?

#326
#326
WiseOlVol said:
You're on an island.

When Manning retired, only Unitas, JBrown and Favre had 3 NFL MVPs.
Nobody had 4.
Manning had 5.
That is, in 5 of his 16 years, he was the Most Valuable Player (GOAT) in the league.
An untouchable record.
Brady got 3rd AFTER Manning retired.

And it's accentuated by 7 times All-Pro.
That is, in 7 of his 16 years, he was the Greatest QB in the league.
Unitas and Luckman had 5.
Brady got 3rd AFTER Manning retired.
7 is untouchable too.

If much of the Pats success was attributable to Brady, he'd have more than only 3 of each.
The lack of more tells you what everyone knows: he's a good QB on a great team but not in Manning's class.
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Elway only had one. Garbage popularity contest and really a sad hill for you to die on. Barry Sanders only had one also...garbage.
 
#327
#327
butchna said:
Good one. Peyton flopped major in that one. And his defense was very good that year.
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Yeah.....so even though he put up MVP and single-season record numbers during the regular season, he couldn't get it done against that Ravens defense outside in the cold on that day.
 
#328
#328
WiseOlVol said:
Dink and dunk. This is why nobody takes him seriously as GOAT.

And he was busted for cheating.
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I do and I count as much or more than you. Everybody cheats when they can. Anything else?
 
#330
#330
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#331
#331
PhoenixAZVol said:
Yes. All of these new rules that don’t allow the defense to actually play defense have led to this rldiculous dinking and dunking that Brady thrives on.
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Patriots won a lot of their early championships by being allowed to maul opposing receivers. Especially when they pulled down Marcus Pollard down to the turf with the ball still in the air. That offseason they tightened the rules to current levels and Brady had to completely shoulder the load of winning championships...and he did.
 
#332
#332
butchna said:
Elway only had one. Garbage popularity contest and really a sad hill for you to die on. Barry Sanders only had one also...garbage.
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Associated Press awards.
Not a popularity contest any more than are college football and basketball rankings.
It's about talent, production and individual impact.
This is the essence of GOAT.
Unitas, Jim Brown and Favre were the only one w 3 when Manning retired.
He had 5.
 
#334
#334
WiseOlVol said:
Associated Press awards.
Not a popularity contest any more than are college football and basketball rankings.
It's about talent, production and individual impact.
This is the essence of GOAT.
Unitas, Jim Brown and Favre were the only one w 3 when Manning retired.
He had 5.
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It’s voted on...not science. Popularity contest. 😎
 
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#335
#335
MikeVol44 said:
Yeah.....so even though he put up MVP and single-season record numbers during the regular season, he couldn't get it done against that Ravens defense outside in the cold on that day.
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Inform yourself. He had the game salted away till SS playing prevent got beat deep.
That same Ravens team beat the Pats and won the SB.
 
#336
#336
WiseOlVol said:
Inform yourself. He had the game salted away till SS playing prevent got beat deep.
That same Ravens team beat the Pats and won the SB.
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If it was salted away it would’ve been salted away and they would’ve won. They didn’t salt it away. 😎
 
#339
#339
BigOrangeTrain said:
Asinine argument. The rules are also vastly different today. Thats why the "GOAT" argument is merely an opinion and cannot be truly stated.
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Dude was saying that competition today is less intense and less competitive than it was back in Otto Graham's time.

Comparing RECORDS during ERAS renders the RULES of the game irrelevant as the records are established within their own time frame and UNDER THE SAME RULES. If you can't understand that fact--please go away.

For example--the 1950 Cleveland Browns (Otto Graham's team) went 10-2 in the regular season and won the NFL championship.
ALL of their regular season wins came against teams with 6-6 or WORSE records. They lost to the NY Giants (9-3) TWICE in the regular season. But they BEAT the NY Giants to get into the NFL Championship, where they barely beat the Rams 30-28.

So saying that Otto Graham's 7-3 championship record is better than Brady's championship record is absolutely stupid.

Graham's Cleveland Browns only beat 2 teams with WINNING RECORDS in 1950.

That NEVER happens in today's NFL.....NOT EVER!

Even the 1972 Miami Dolphins had to beat 5 teams with winning records to win the SB that year and remain undefeated.
 
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#344
#344
WiseOlVol said:
Winning the NFL MVP is the highest honor the League bestows on a player.
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And the Oscar is the highest honor an actor can receive. Best performance doesn’t always win. Elway only had one MVP. He suck?
 
#345
#345
PhoenixAZVol said:
Yeah meant the guy who you referenced. Sorry.
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Yeah...it was me.....I had Sam Huff on the brain.....but it doesn't change the point I was making....

Take a quick tour through the 1950s and see just how many teams finished each season above 0.500...then look at the team who won the NFL championship that year and see how many teams with winning records they had to beat to win the championship.
It's clear as Tennessee moonshine that the competition in the NFL back in the '50s was NO WHERE NEAR as tough as it is today. NO EVEN CLOSE!
 
#347
#347
WiseOlVol said:
Winning the NFL MVP is the highest honor the League bestows on a player.
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The LEAGUE doesn't bestow the award....please get a grip on REALITY... It's voted on by SPORTSWRITERS, not owners or players!

That's why Butchna says it's a popularity contest...
 
#348
#348
butchna said:
Couldn’t drag them enough for a playoff win in his first several tries. Got bested by NFL greats Chad Pennington, Mark Sanchez, Jay Fiedler and Billy Volek along the way.
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Just getting perennial also-ran Colts to playoffs a major achievement, which is why he won MVPs in 03 and 04 and All-Pro 03, 04, 05.
 
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