Why does it matter if we fire him now?

You're asking a lot of questions but giving no answers.

The early signing period has changed. Explain how an assistant interim works to our advantage with said rule changes.

I see now. So you think we've hired a big name coach and are just not announcing it early? If that's the case, I'd sit back and enjoy the ride instead of worrying about the next few weeks of recruiting. Recruiting shouldn't be an issue with a home run hire.

You said you didn't understand the thinking.

I condensed a book of thinking into 7 short questions.

I'm not considering the interim coach unless he is the new hire.

Do you know we did not or will not hire a big name Coach or a home rune hire? Is that why you are questioning why it matters or how we gain?
 
There is no point in firing a head coach right now. Coaches will not interview for jobs until after the regular season is done. An AD can communicate with agents to get a level of interest while still having a head coach in place.

LSU fans thought firing Les Miles would get them a jump on any openings that would happen and they ended up hiring a guy already on the staff.

Florida fans are going nuts over wanting Scott Frost but it never ends up being the guy that fans are desperate for. Instead of Scott Frost it will be Mullen or Mike Norvell.
 
And if Butch is fired after this coming Saturday, which is likely, what difference would it make if it were this coming Sunday or two weeks ago? None. Why? Communicate can still be had in back channels. The only difference is that people will understand why the AD is calling/emailing them when the conversation starts.

Firing Butch this coming Sunday will result in the same exact coaching pool being available and still plenty of time before the end of the season to know what the interest level is for candidates.
 
I don't know anything, of course. But there are two unicorn coaches out there who aren't currently employed, and with all due respect to the Grudenites, I'm highly skeptical that we have an agreement in place with either of them. Everyone else already has a job, and we're not going to start telling recruits we have an agreement with any of them until their current season is over. In other words, firing Butch (as satisfying as it would be) won't do anything to stop the bleeding in recruiting.

Assuming the Unicorns are Gruden and Kelly, have you considered that Unicorns may be employed?

It sounds like you believe we don't have a big hire coming, unless you believe a big hire won't do anything to stop the bleeding in recruiting.
 
Assuming the Unicorns are Gruden and Kelly, have you considered that Unicorns may be employed?

It sounds like you believe we don't have a big hire coming, unless you believe a big hire won't do anything to stop the bleeding in recruiting.

A big hire will stop the bleeding once we announce it. But we're not going to announce it until his season is over, regardless of when we come to an understanding with his agent. So until then recruiting is going to suffer whether Jones is still here or not.
 
Sure you can. Are you really gonna say our running game isn’t strong enough to run through Southern Miss, Vandy, and Mizzou?

Vandy and Mizzou can’t stop anyone running the ball.

They can when we pass 3 times on the 1 yard line 1rst & Goal :eek:lol:
 
Which in the end is going to end up being the wrong move for LSU.

True story. Coach Orgeron is going to set this program back in the long run. They made a spectacle firing Les and then were left at the altar when Herman went to Texas and Jimbo stayed at Florida St. It was an embarrassment for the program.
 
True story. Coach Orgeron is going to set this program back in the long run. They made a spectacle firing Les and then were left at the altar when Herman went to Texas and Jimbo stayed at Florida St. It was an embarrassment for the program.

Yep...going after one of the biggest names at the P5 level and the biggest G5 name without another person lined up as a back up was a failed search process.

IMO, it was a panic hire.
 
Yeah. We are not going to hire a guy for a position that is already filled. If we were stupid enough to have an MOA or contract signed while Butch is still the coach, Butch would have one heck of a Labor lawsuit vs UTK.

Yes, Jetgate is one reason. Bobby Petrino, Tuberville Auburn and a whole lotta fallout.

See, you gotta fire a guy to truly start looking for his replacement.

I thought that was pretty well known and if grumors are true, we could be in trouble already, although doubtful any of those are true.

But if we got nothing to do I'll tell ya'll a story about loser Lyle's father, just so we see that the nut doesnt fall too far from the tree...

I'll take you back to Saugatuck Michigan, and its Chief of Police, Lyle Jones. Now Mr. Jones wasn't a very good policeman, just like his son isn't a very good coach, they both been known to get outschemed, in their own clueless way.

As far as police work goes, Saugatuck Michigan is a pretty easy beat. Its a resort and tourist town on Lake Michigan. 1,000 permanent residents and swells to 3,000 every summer as wealthy lakehouse owners from chicago, detroit and grand rapids metropolitan areas take up residence. Thats as good as it gets as far as policework goes, but that didnt stop Lyle senior from mucking things up. Not at all. You see, in Lyle Jones final year as police chief, Saugatuck was hit with the largest bank robbery in the united states.

Saugatuck only had one bank. Policeman Jones had one bank to watch over, and it didnt end well.

No joke, it was a famous robbery, and not the last time a man named Lyle Jones would be out schemed and made to look like a fool.

The 1991 Saugatuck MI bank heist, nicknamed the "Point Break robbery", as the robbers wore masks of former presidents. It was a professional job, planned for months, the gang responsible was led by Francis Mazza, included Robert Siegel, nephew of Bugsy Siegel and in their infamous career got away with an estimated total of $25,000,000, in cash gold and jewels.

Lyle Sr. was just as overmatched as his doofus son when Saban comes to town. Some locals say he was in on it, they claim the bank manager was too, a post robbery weeklong vegas trip seemed to confirm those rumors. And that wouldnt surprise me as stealing millions seems to be a Lyle Jones specialty.

The FBI agent who worked the case:

"They hit the mother lode, and they executed a plan perfectly," said Eugene Debbaudt, who worked only on the robbery for nearly 10 months. "It was the most sophisticated, professional and most fascinating bank robbery I've ever worked on. They planned it for months. They did dry runs to make sure they had it right. I have nothing but disdain for criminals who put people's lives at risk, but there were some who admired the work they did."

But how did they outscheme Butch's wily father? The FBI agent explains...

"The robbers called in a fake car crash on the other side of Saugatuck and watched as the police chief and only cop on duty, Lyle Jones, drove out. The robbers had timed it. It was at least an eight-minute drive for Jones to get across the Blue Star Highway bridge and back."

So Lyle went out to check on the car crash that didnt exist while the largest bank robbery in the United States went down on his watch. He had failed to notice anything strange, nothing to cause concern while a gang of famous hardened criminals with mob ties lived in his sleepy town of 1000, scouting the bank and watching his movements for months.

Good Job Botch Sr.

Maybe I'm weird but I find this hilarious.
 
A big hire will stop the bleeding once we announce it. But we're not going to announce it until his season is over, regardless of when we come to an understanding with his agent. So until then recruiting is going to suffer whether Jones is still here or not.

Finally a voice of reason. Whether we fire Jones now or at the end of the season we are still going to owe him his buyout. Recruiting is going to take a hit either way until we hire a permanent replacement. Like you said most of our options are currently coaching and won’t negotiate until the end of the season.

Lastly our schedule is front loaded every year. I don’t want an interim coach like Hoke to take over and we manage to beat up on weaker teams. Our fickle fan base will believe he is a good head coach and we will be stuck with him for a long time. Let’s call this the Ed Orgeron effect.
 
In your opinion, why is it imperative that we fire Butch immediately (during the season) as opposed to the end of the year? In other words, what does Tennessee gain in that scenario?

Let's just say I'm curious for research purposes.

Discuss.

It's not imperative. Firing him now gains us nothing in recruiting or on the field. The only thing the AD gains is assuring the fans that they do indeed know a change is needed and in the works. Despite all the rumors, we have no idea if we're stuck with Butch not only for the rest of this season, but possibly another season. As a fan, it's totally disheartening. I have no motivation to go to a game at all. I barely have motivation to watch a game. I'm most likely to just catch the final score. Waiting won't hurt the program in the long run as long as Currie does fire Butch and makes a home run hire. What it will do is rip the heart out of Vol fans as we continue to face the unknown, again. We've suffered through Kiffin, then Dooley, and now Butch. Is it any wonder that we're desperate for hope? And right now, for many of us, hope begins with Butch being relieved of his coaching duties. Otherwise, we have no idea if change is coming or not. I mean, it should be, but I'm not Currie, so I have no idea what his thinking is.

The only thing gained by firing him now is a fan's piece of mind. Then, at the very least, we can feel competent that our new AD isn't completely oblivious to how the fans feel.
 
A big hire will stop the bleeding once we announce it. But we're not going to announce it until his season is over, regardless of when we come to an understanding with his agent. So until then recruiting is going to suffer whether Jones is still here or not.

"his season"

Sounds like you know or believe he is coaching now.

3.5 weeks isn't much time to flip a recruit.
 
In your opinion, why is it imperative that we fire Butch immediately (during the season) as opposed to the end of the year? In other words, what does Tennessee gain in that scenario?

Let's just say I'm curious for research purposes.

Discuss.

Recruiting! Recruiting!! Recruiting!!!

With National Signing Day in December. I would hope that we can fire him and get the search rolling so that when the last game happens with Vanderbilt the Monday afterward we can hopefully announce our next Head Coach.
 
The early signing day changes everything. Plus, we really need bowl season practice so the young players who have not received adequate attention can get some seasoning and I don't think Butch is going to beat Vandy or Mizzou.
 
In your opinion, why is it imperative that we fire Butch immediately (during the season) as opposed to the end of the year? In other words, what does Tennessee gain in that scenario?

Let's just say I'm curious for research purposes.

Discuss.

If they get the hire right, it doesn't. Unofficially searching for a coach while you officially have one doesn't give a lot of confidence. Fecally speaking UT has stepped into some piles the last three opportunities.
 
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My opinion is we really don't gain anything. However, I want him gone last year after the South Carolina game. I have watched sloppy undisciplined football at Tennessee for to long. I no longer care if I get to watch the game and I no longer record them. I feel like so much talent has been wasted already and that's directly on Butch. My answer is not based on logic it's just emotion, like the rest of the vol fanatics on this board.
 
In your opinion, why is it imperative that we fire Butch immediately (during the season) as opposed to the end of the year? In other words, what does Tennessee gain in that scenario?

Let's just say I'm curious for research purposes.

Discuss.

As of this moment... i dont think its imperative. More money to throw at coaches later if let it play out,which is smart. Also some coaches may find other jobs before then. Hell if it gets any worse butch might just resign.
 
In your opinion, why is it imperative that we fire Butch immediately (during the season) as opposed to the end of the year? In other words, what does Tennessee gain in that scenario?

Let's just say I'm curious for research purposes.

Discuss.

Because he's a terrible coach on Gameday. Why didn't he take his timeouts when Kentucky was driving for a TD. He could had more time to go down and score to
Win the game.
 
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We are a national laughingstock for keeping him. 2 nights in a row national CBS radio was asking the question "why in the hell is Butch Jones still employed?" We are seen nationally and by our own fans as not being serious about football. We are seen that way by recruits.

Butch staying doesn't do one single positive thing for the school or the team at this point. So if Butch staying does one negative thing it's a net negative. He does a lot of negative things. I didn't attend the South Carolina game. I won't attend Saturday if he's still coaching. They've already got my ticket money but I take 4 people with me to each game and usually spend around 200 dollars at the stadium on a given Saturday on food and merchandise. Multiply that by the thousands who won't attend and it starts to add up quickly.


I also think some might be surprised at player reaction. Daniel Hood said out of 100 guys or so in the locker room, he was the only one who cared that Dooley was fired. There might be a few more that care that Butch is going to be fired, but probably not a ton more. Players want to improve and win football games. They do neither under Jones.

So are there positives to keeping Jones? None that I can see. Are there negatives? Yes, quite a few regarding brand and butts in the seats revenue.
 
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Because it shows that we care about the football prorgam and are willing to make a change to become better. Like Florida

Assistants may not be able to do any better finishing the season but they can’t be much worse and it gives fans (and players) hope and better things are coming

Otherwise the crowds will continue to decrease and fans will continue to get pissed and lose hope. Some recruits may as well
 
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