Ukraine Protests

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#4,901
#4,901
Pacer92 said:
Why frame Russia? Because we want to eventually cause revolution and destabilize Russia like the Ukranian mess now. That way we break it up into many states(easier to control that way....ie..United states, canada, and now EU) while our corrupt ass govt and the mega-rich make trillions exploiting it's natural resources.

Media and propaganda is our war with Russia. China is on deck...
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So the U.S. is trying to break Ukraine up into smaller states?
 
#4,902
#4,902
Pacer92 said:
The big picture is it's not a European thing at all. Ukrainians heritage is much deeper rooted in the Russian values, traditions and culture.

After the fall of the Soviet Union NATO agreed to leave some old soviet nations as buffer states between Russia and NATO. They have infringed upon this time and time again in order to with the so called missile defense systems. Make no bones about it, NATO, who is run by the US and it's hand chosen puppet rulers are all aligning to move closer to Russia in order to provoke war and revolution.

You guys need to see that we are not spreading democracy and ousting evil regimes. We, in fact, are destroying democratically elected govts and their leaders. Wake the hell up people....
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really curious what NATO agreement and who with?

*EDIT nvm looked it up.

as far as I can tell it was an agreement that said foreign troops and nukes couldn't move east past Germany.
 
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#4,903
#4,903
And about the promise not to expand NATO, I've said it once but I'll say it again: we never made any kind of formal agreement with Russia not to expand NATO eastward. The thinking that we did stems from comments made by James Baker before the new Russian national parliament.

Now, if you value a "gentleman's agreement," as I certainly do myself, then that's fine. But, the fact of the matter is that it was never a formal agreement written into treaty.

However, what was written as a formal agreement was the Budapest Memorandum. I'll give you two guesses to determine who's violated that, and the first guess doesn't count.
 
#4,905
#4,905
volprof said:
That's-a-bingo!
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on a tarantino high prof?

and yeah as much as I have skimmed through the document nothing about NATO not expanding past Germany. there is some fuziness with this though, dealing with the 1994 deadline to gtfo of Germany, but beyond that nothing.
 
#4,906
#4,906
LouderVol said:
really curious what NATO agreement and who with?

*EDIT nvm looked it up.

as far as I can tell it was an agreement that said foreign troops and nukes couldn't move east past Germany.
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This is correct along with not expanding NATO which we have reneged on several times...
 
#4,907
#4,907
We eventually want NATO missiles on the front porch of Russia and will stop at nothing until this is reality.
 
#4,908
#4,908
The NATO expansion "agreement" was discussed a number of pages ago. There's scarce evidence that it was anything more than an oral assurance, if that.
 
#4,911
#4,911
Velo Vol said:
The NATO expansion "agreement" was discussed a number of pages ago. There's scarce evidence that it was anything more than an oral assurance, if that.
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This is true, however, it still doesn't take away the fact we broke our pledges to not expand..

Where is the American Indian thread at? :)
 
#4,913
#4,913
Pacer92 said:
This is correct along with not expanding NATO which we have reneged on several times...
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I read the treaty, not just a wiki page of it, it doesn't say anything about any territory outside of Germany, except that Germany gives up any claims to those lands and had to ratify the German/Polish border. The only thing about foreign troops went out of effect 10 years ago in 1994, and unless we stationed nukes in Germany I don't see any possible violations, on either side.
 
#4,915
#4,915
Velo Vol said:
So the fact that Poland wanted to join NATO justifies Russia invading Ukraine?
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Invaded Ukraine? Omg! Lol! An INVASION of Ukraine by Russia would've been over in a week, if that!

Secondly, and again, it's futile arguing with people that only see the propaganda they are force-fed. Poland is a different story but it's really not.

If what is happening in Ukraine, or Poland for that matter, was happening in Canada or Mexico, you'd be whistling a different tune.
 
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#4,916
#4,916
I remember Russian-US relations were actually pretty good until Putin came to power and the US citizenry was more than happy to welcome free Russians with open arms, so this hogwash about the American people being brainwashed to hate Russians is laughable.

Putin comes to power with the eye of restoring the old USSR. He's bullied neighboring countries, former parts of the USSR, and is currently bullying the Ukraine by proxy war. Incite the ethnic Russians in a foreign country, arm them, and clandestinely throw some of your own troops in there too. It's been done before with the Sudetenland and with Poland. He's not overtly declaring war as Hitler once did, but working to fracture the Ukraine so it can appear he acquired new territories through the will of those territories' citizenry.

I'm really curious what unbiased news source Pacers92 gets his news from.
 
#4,917
#4,917
Godfatha said:
I remember Russian-US relations were actually pretty good until Putin came to power and the US citizenry was more than happy to welcome free Russians with open arms, so this hogwash about the American people being brainwashed to hate Russians is laughable.

Putin comes to power with the eye of restoring the old USSR. He's bullied neighboring countries, former parts of the USSR, and is currently bullying the Ukraine by proxy war. Incite the ethnic Russians in a foreign country, arm them, and clandestinely throw some of your own troops in there too. It's been done before with the Sudetenland and with Poland. He's not overtly declaring war as Hitler once did, but working to fracture the Ukraine so it can appear he acquired new territories through the will of those territories' citizenry.

I'm really curious what unbiased news source Pacers92 gets his news from.
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You know why you remember this? Because Putin isn't a US **** sucking puppet like before him in Yeltsin...

And obviously you know nothing about this subject unless you hear it from Anderson Cooper, am I correct??
 
#4,918
#4,918
Pacer92 said:
You know why you remember this? Because Putin isn't a US **** sucking puppet like before him in Yeltsin...

And obviously you know nothing about this subject unless you hear it from Anderson Cooper, am I correct??
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Lol. So the guy wanting friendly relations with the US makes him a **** sucking puppet?

I prefer to get my news from a lot of sources and not all of them in alignment with each other because I figure somewhere in the middle of the BS lies the truth.

So keep reading about Skull and Bones, the Illuminati, Council of Foreign Relations, Trilateral Commission, Free Masons, and aliens are planning to take over the world, I'll deal in reality.
 
#4,919
#4,919
Godfatha said:
Lol. So the guy wanting friendly relations with the US makes him a **** sucking puppet?

I prefer to get my news from a lot of sources and not all of them in alignment with each other because I figure somewhere in the middle of the BS lies the truth.

So keep reading about Skull and Bones, the Illuminati, Council of Foreign Relations, Trilateral Commission, Free Masons, and aliens are planning to take over the world, I'll deal in reality.
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Haha! You show me country that doesn't blow America and I'll show you one that is constantly criticized and has propaganda used against it by western media..
 
#4,920
#4,920
Pacer92 said:
Invaded Ukraine? Omg! Lol! An INVASION of Ukraine by Russia would've been over in a week, if that!

You haven't quite grasped the concept of "special warfare" yet, but that's okay.

Secondly, and again, it's futile arguing with people that only see the propaganda they are force-fed. Poland is a different story but it's really not.

If what is happening in Ukraine, or Poland for that matter, was happening in Canada or Mexico, you'd be whistling a different tune.

Indeed, we would. That, however, wouldn't make us any less wrong. And, unlike Russia, we have established fairly peaceful relations with our neighbors since the 1920s/30s. Our neighbors don't have to worry about their borders potentially changing anymore, although I, for one, still want Canada.
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.
 
#4,922
#4,922
Godfatha said:
I remember Russian-US relations were actually pretty good until Putin came to power and the US citizenry was more than happy to welcome free Russians with open arms, so this hogwash about the American people being brainwashed to hate Russians is laughable.
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You've been brainwashed by revisionist history, obviously.
 
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