Ukraine Protests

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#4,951
#4,951
alexmanu said:
Viktor Orban is as close to a fascist as any leader in the EU or NATO can get.
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The Hungarian far-right have close ties to Russian intelligence. Schindler of 20 Committee has posted in the past that NATO sources are concerned at how high Russian intelligence has penetrated the Hungarian government, economic, and military sectors.
 
#4,952
#4,952
Velo Vol said:
If Russia and China understood the deadly threat that Washington presents, both governments would operate according to the time honored principle that “the enemy of my enemy is my friend.” Russia and China would arm ISIS with surface to air missiles to bring down the American planes and with military intelligence in order to achieve an American defeat. With defeat would come the overthrow of Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates, Jordan, Egypt and all of the American puppet rulers in the area. Washington would lose control over oil, and the petro-dollar would be history. It is extraordinary that instead Russia and China are working to protect Washington’s control over the Middle East and the petro-dollar.
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Yes, that would be awesome for everyone.
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Now how convoluted would that be. ISIS would be getting weapons from the US and the Sino-Russian Alliance.
 
#4,953
#4,953
CIA operations in Hong Kong are underway.

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#4,954
#4,954
Velo Vol said:
CIA operations in Hong Kong are underway.

Byn4dW5IgAA54_q.jpg
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Wherever people want democracy and closer ties to the West, you'd best bet CIA Man will be there! Wherever the downtrodden masses huddle defenseless and are fired upon in the streets, CIA Man will be there! Wherever a government is toppled by the masses, CIA Man, he was there!

To Democracy and Beyond!
 
#4,955
#4,955
I've seen something of this sort happening for several years now. The first time I traveled to Ukraine was in 2009 which was about the time the United States was planning/breaking ground on a new embassy. When I returned in 2011 I drove by the site to see what progress had been made. What I saw, in spite of a privacy fence a few stories high, was a massive building that seemed excessive for an embassy even to my lay eyes, given that it was in a small Eastern European country. This, combined with economic constraints imposed by Russia on Ukraine and their military presence around the border, it's no surprise these events transpired. All Ukrainians knew that eastern regions were loyal to Russia and would likely defect. I believe the US along with the EU inspired the response from Kiev (more specifically that new "embassy") to retake control and deny Russia another warm-water port.
 
#4,958
#4,958
The "deny Russia a warm water port" is getting old. That would have started a war. Of course, I guess when you think the US actually wants to start a war with the world's second stoutest military and nuclear arms country, then this reasoning falls upon deaf ears.
 
#4,960
#4,960
bcmbvol said:
Well I signed up a couple weeks ago so I could block a few people on the football forum, but had yet to find something worth contributing to.
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Feel free to contribute, even if you take the CIA coup line but, please, no more warm water port stuff. I can buy into the US trying to position itself to control Ukraine so as to negate Russian power, but I can't buy into the denying Russia Sevastopol argument. That would have directly caused a war.
 
#4,961
#4,961
volprof said:
The "deny Russia a warm water port" is getting old. That would have started a war. Of course, I guess when you think the US actually wants to start a war with the world's second stoutest military and nuclear arms country, then this reasoning falls upon deaf ears.
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I admit that there was some speculation on my part; however, I think the things I mentioned initially could support that rationale. I also don't think war is a requisite response. I'd be interested to know what you think, though, just to see it from a different angle.
 
#4,962
#4,962
bcmbvol said:
I've seen something of this sort happening for several years now. The first time I traveled to Ukraine was in 2009 which was about the time the United States was planning/breaking ground on a new embassy. When I returned in 2011 I drove by the site to see what progress had been made. What I saw, in spite of a privacy fence a few stories high, was a massive building that seemed excessive for an embassy even to my lay eyes, given that it was in a small Eastern European country. This, combined with economic constraints imposed by Russia on Ukraine and their military presence around the border, it's no surprise these events transpired. All Ukrainians knew that eastern regions were loyal to Russia and would likely defect. I believe the US along with the EU inspired the response from Kiev (more specifically that new "embassy") to retake control and deny Russia another warm-water port.
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You can't say that here... the sheep on here will roast you for saying we instigated this.
 
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#4,966
#4,966
volprof said:
The "deny Russia a warm water port" is getting old. That would have started a war. Of course, I guess when you think the US actually wants to start a war with the world's second stoutest military and nuclear arms country, then this reasoning falls upon deaf ears.
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Getting old to people that just are in denial. It's like someone ignoring that facts that their spouse is cheating on them. All the signs are there, but their blind faith won't let them believe it because the spouse constantly denies such transgressions. Dig a little deeper and the truth will surface.

The U.S. doesn't want war directly with Russia. It wants to get them involved in small territorial wars like Ukraine where it can propagandize and use sanctions.
 
#4,968
#4,968
bcmbvol said:
I admit that there was some speculation on my part; however, I think the things I mentioned initially could support that rationale. I also don't think war is a requisite response. I'd be interested to know what you think, though, just to see it from a different angle.
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I think the majority of Ukrainians wanted and still want closer ties with the West.

Russia took Crimea. It was an illegal move, but, so be it. I sincerely believe they thought that their port was going to be taken away from them eventually.

The thing you have to understand about Russians, for however full of conspiracy theorists this population of ours may be (and we have our share here in this forum alone), Russians make us look like amateurs in this department.
 
#4,969
#4,969
Pacer92 said:
Getting old to people that just are in denial. It's like someone ignoring that facts that their spouse is cheating on them. All the signs are there, but their blind faith won't let them believe it because the spouse constantly denies such transgressions. Dig a little deeper and the truth will surface.

The U.S. doesn't want war directly with Russia. It wants to get them involved in small territorial wars like Ukraine where it can propagandize and use sanctions.
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Russia wants to divide the US by getting us involved in regions they either currently or formerly supplied with arms/were at war in (see Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan).

Two can play at this ridiculous game.
 
#4,970
#4,970
#4,971
#4,971
volprof said:
See, I love stuff like this. It pretends like there is no such thing as the FSB or the SVR. Just ridiculous.

Hey, by the way, do you know that Putin had 300 of his countrymen blown up to get elected in 1999? I'm serious, he really had 300 of his countrymen blown up to get elected in 1999.
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Pretty radical there prof, he should have done like Barry and hired attorneys to disqualify his opposition. 😝
 
#4,973
#4,973
volprof said:
He's done that as well. He's also seized privately-owned companies.
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If your referring to companies like Yukos, it's pretty disingenuous to call it a private company. A private company infers that people have invested time, sweat and equity to build a business. Most of these companies were taken over by well connected people in the Yeltsin administration making them overnight oligarchs. You also left out The fact that these new oligarchs were possibly doing illegal stuff.
 
#4,974
#4,974
red butler said:
If your referring to companies like Yukos, it's pretty disingenuous to call it a private company. A private company infers that people have invested time, sweat and equity to build a business. Most of these companies were taken over by well connected people in the Yeltsin administration making them overnight oligarchs. You also left out The fact that these new oligarchs were possibly doing illegal stuff.
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By some estimates, Putin's fortune lies somewhere between 40 to 60 billion US dollars.

Pretty damn impressive, if you ask me. Time, sweat, and apartment bombs will do the trick 60% of the time every time.
 
#4,975
#4,975
Out of curiosity, I looked up Putin's top holdings and cross referenced them against the sanctions. For some reason it appears the west has been reluctant to impose meaningful sanctions against the companies that would have the biggest impact on Putin. I didn't do major research or anything, but it does seem strange.
 
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