Ukraine Protests

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#3,426
#3,426
Rasputin_Vol said:
Some of you people are going to going to have reality shock once all the dominos fall and you're left with the realization that the US has been the aggressors and agitators in Ukraine, Syria and anywhere else that is advantageous for the Anglo-American cartel.
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Book me a stall in the funny farm now.
 
#3,427
#3,427
Velo Vol said:
Book me a stall in the funny farm now.
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I advise you to get your laughs in right now if it will make you feel better. When you realize that you are on the wrong side of history, you will at least have these memories of a few cheap chuckles you could be having right now.
 
#3,429
#3,429
Rasputin_Vol said:
When you realize that you are on the wrong side of history, you will at least have these memories of a few cheap chuckles you could be having right now.
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How am I on the "wrong side of history," understanding, as I do, that the West is exerting limited influence to sway the country toward its sphere?

Both sides are doing it, the West in a more peaceful manner than Russia.

I predict that at least a majority of Ukraine, if left to its own devices, will eventually become more Europeanized.

Are you predicting otherwise?
 
#3,430
#3,430
Velo Vol said:
How am I on the "wrong side of history," understanding, as I do, that the West is exerting limited influence to sway the country toward its sphere?

Both sides are doing it, the West in a more peaceful manner than Russia.

I predict that at least a majority of Ukraine, if left to its own devices, will eventually become more Europeanized.

Are you predicting otherwise?
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Speaking of Russia, "Helloooo, boys! I'mm BAAACCCCKKKK!!!"

Russia Is Moving Thousands of Troops Back to Ukraine Border, NATO Says
 
#3,432
#3,432
Rasputin_Vol said:
I advise you to get your laughs in right now if it will make you feel better. When you realize that you are on the wrong side of history, you will at least have these memories of a few cheap chuckles you could be having right now.
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Trust me; I'll always stand on the right side of history when I oppose a government that killed and beat it's citizens for exercising their right to protest. I'll also know that I'll be on the right side of history when I stand opposed to a foreign government illegally annexing sovereign territory of another country.
 
#3,433
#3,433
@myroslavapetsa 9m

#Poroshenko's peace plan includes amnesty, disarmament, release of hostages, buffer zone at Rus border, protection of Rus lang, local elex

Sounds more like capitulation than a peace plan.
 
#3,434
#3,434
Capitulation would be rewriting the Constitution to provide for "federalization."

Not sure what the "buffer zone" is, but the other items don't seem unreasonable if they would truly end the fighting.
 
#3,435
#3,435
Burhead said:
@myroslavapetsa 9m

#Poroshenko's peace plan includes amnesty, disarmament, release of hostages, buffer zone at Rus border, protection of Rus lang, local elex

Sounds more like capitulation than a peace plan.
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None of this matters. There are fascists in the West, and they are coming for blood. The noble soldiers and citizenry of the East must not capitulate. Where have you been?

Honestly, I get the impression that Poroshenko could offer each of the citizens of eastern Ukraine lots of his candy along with a small fortune, and it wouldn't make any difference what their reaction would be. None of this would get the 75 to 80% of their "self-defense" forces to get their asses back in Russia where they belong.
 
#3,437
#3,437
Burhead said:
Trust me; I'll always stand on the right side of history when I oppose a government that killed and beat it's citizens for exercising their right to protest. I'll also know that I'll be on the right side of history when I stand opposed to a foreign government illegally annexing sovereign territory of another country.
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When did this happen? If you are still referring to the Feb. 20th shootings, that has been proven to be the so-called opposition firing on Ukrainians.

As far as this so-called illegal annexation, over the last 300 years, Crimea has been under Russian control for probably 280 of those years. So lets not act like this is Iraq invading Kuwait.
 
#3,438
#3,438
Rasputin_Vol said:
When did this happen? If you are still referring to the Feb. 20th shootings, that has been proven to be the so-called opposition firing on Ukrainians.
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You mean a YouTube video? I mean, I could create a YouTube video that says 9/11 was an inside job. Doesn't make it any more factual.

As far as this so-called illegal annexation, over the last 300 years, Crimea has been under Russian control for probably 280 of those years. So lets not act like this is Iraq invading Kuwait.
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That excuse is weak and you know it. For the last 60 years it's been under Ukrainian control and was stolen from them at their moment of weakness.
 
#3,439
#3,439
Think this has already been discussed, but it's good to keep in mind when following the conflict.

More Evidence Russian Intelligence is Waging Special War Against Ukraine | The XX Committee

The SBU has severed all ties with Russian intelligence – under Yanukovych, Ukraine’s spies functioned as an extension of the FSB – but it will be some time before this massive penetration is undone; it is no longer mysterious why so many recent Ukrainian military operations to root out separatists in the Donetsk area have fallen short of expectations, since the pro-Russian paramilitaries know they are coming. The first task at hand must be detecting and neutralizing Russian spies and provocateurs inside Ukraine’s defense and security system, and that is now underway, though it will take years to get this problem under control, given the daunting extent of Kremlin penetration.
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#3,440
#3,440
Burhead said:
That excuse is weak and you know it. For the last 60 years it's been under Ukrainian control and was stolen from them at their moment of weakness.
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60 years? I'm speaking of the last 20 or so years since the Soviet Union crumbled. Certainly you aren't suggesting that between WWII and the early 90's that Ukraine was an autonomous state from from Russian/Soviet control.
 
#3,442
#3,442
Velo Vol said:
Address of President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko - Official web-site of President of Ukraine

Outlines peace plan.
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In the coming days, the Verkhovna Rada will be offered to adopt the law on amnesty to those members of illegal armed formations who didn’t kill civilians and Ukrainian soldiers, who will lay down their weapons in a short time. Everyone who illegally took weapons must do so.
In the coming days, the Verkhovna Rada will be offered to adopt the law on amnesty to those members of illegal armed formations who didn’t kill civilians and Ukrainian soldiers, who will lay down their weapons in a short time. Everyone who illegally took weapons must do so.

Hostages must be immediately liberated. I mean all hostages – from international observers to Ukrainian teachers, doctors, journalists and law enforcers.

Corridor for the escape of Russian mercenaries to their motherland will be opened. But there is a condition to leave machine guns, tanks and armored vehicles here.
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That's the best peace deal he can come up with? Let me ask you 2nd Amendment beatniks a question. If Obama or for that matter Bush asked you to surrender your weapons as part of a peace deal, would you do it?
 
#3,445
#3,445
Still not sure what the government is doing to secure the border. They're not going to resolve the situation as long as mercenaries and weapons continue to stream in.
 
#3,446
#3,446
Rasputin_Vol said:
That's the best peace deal he can come up with? Let me ask you 2nd Amendment beatniks a question. If Obama or for that matter Bush asked you to surrender your weapons as part of a peace deal, would you do it?
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Dumb question, since none of us "2nd Amendment beatniks" have invaded Canada and terrorized the populace.
 
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#3,447
#3,447
Burhead said:
Except the situations are totally different....
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MG1968 said:
Dumb question, since none of us "2nd Amendment beatniks" have invaded Canada and terrorized the populace.
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If Burhead, MG, and me all decided we were going to do something about the current state of America by taking over a federal or state building armed, then, no matter how noble or ignoble our cause, I would fully expect the govt. to demand a confiscation of our weapons.
 
#3,448
#3,448
volprof said:
If Burhead, MG, and me all decided we were going to do something about the current state of America by taking over a federal or state building armed, then, no matter how noble or ignoble our cause, I would fully expect the govt. to demand a confiscation of our weapons.
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Some call for the confiscation of your weapons as it is.

Might as well make it worth their while :p
 
#3,449
#3,449
volprof said:
If Burhead, MG, and me all decided we were going to do something about the current state of America by taking over a federal or state building armed, then, no matter how noble or ignoble our cause, I would fully expect the govt. to demand a confiscation of our weapons.
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Do it. Form the People's Republic of Knoxville.
 
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