Ukraine Protests

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#3,002
#3,002
How does Donetsk hold a "referendum" when its self-appointed government only holds a few buildings, (presumably) doesn't have voter rolls, and not even the support of Putin?
 
#3,003
#3,003
Velo Vol said:
Where?

Guess I should be more specific: would the world allow the mass genocide of white people today?
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Probably not.

Velo Vol said:
How does Donetsk hold a "referendum" when its self-appointed government only holds a few buildings, (presumably) doesn't have voter rolls, and not even the support of Putin?
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You'd be amazed the numerous ways in which one may hold a referendum, especially when it's fake.
 
#3,004
#3,004
Velo Vol said:
How does Donetsk hold a "referendum" when its self-appointed government only holds a few buildings, (presumably) doesn't have voter rolls, and not even the support of Putin?
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It's why Putin had to back off. His lackeys failed here unlike in Crimea.
 
#3,005
#3,005
http://rt.com/news/157736-ukraine-troops-russia-borders/

I think this article, especially due to its mercenary nature, helps explain Putin's recent about face. He's totally trying to portray himself and Russia as victims. He's not actually changing his intentions one bit; he just wants the world, especially his own people, to think he's trying for peace. And regarding his statement that he has pulled his troops from the border, what common man or woman will know? We all just have to take respective govt.s' word for it. Specifically, all he has to say is that they've withdrawn, and your run of the mill Russian will believe it. Meanwhile, the evil Ukrainians are mounting on the border. Just say it, and it becomes true.

Word of caution: read the comments section at the risk of your own brain cells.
 
#3,006
#3,006
All but stopped reading the comments.....not thrilled with the logic used by the tovarishi. I am tempted to start posting the "In Soviet Russia..." jokes on the comment sections though.
 
#3,009
#3,009
CSpindizzy said:
Meh....Muslims and Russian leaning Serbians. Croatians didn't really count. People back then were not too concerned about those groups and waited until it got really out of hand before finally speaking up.
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Which was the point I was making to Velo.

Any single ethnic or religious group is capable of being the victim of genocide.
 
#3,010
#3,010
I think an economic component comes with it. Ukrainians would not be victims because of the value their region holds. The Balkans hold little value. If anything the only issue they had was fear of spillover into neighboring countries and the mass training ground for Muslim groups there.
 
#3,011
#3,011
I don't disagree that it comes with the economic value of the area in question. However, the Holodomor had more to do with the Gosplan of the Soviet Union and the Five Year Plans than anything. The Soviets were rushing headlong into industrialization and didn't let other economic areas catch up. And the fact they did away with most of the private farms didn't help matters.

Plus, I would tend to think it was part of the Russification of the Soviet Union. While Uncle Joe was a Georgian, he was one helluva Russian nationalist. So getting rid of the Ukrainian people so more Russians could move in would have fit his typical MO. Kind of like the Soviet version of Lebensraum. Personal opinion though.
 
#3,012
#3,012
RT currently running the headline that the Ukrainian army has been indiscriminately firing into crowds on V-Day in Mariupol.

Something tells me that some key evidence is probably missing here.
 
#3,013
#3,013
Grand Vol said:
Which was the point I was making to Velo.

Any single ethnic or religious group is capable of being the victim of genocide.
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Yeah, but nowhere near the same scale.

My point, if I have one, is that today it's harder to ignore mass murder, even than it was in the '90s, due to the Internets.

Of course people in Syria probably disagree.
 
#3,014
#3,014
_74739328_hi022189177.jpg
 
#3,015
#3,015
8 reported dead in Mariupol in fighting at the police headquarters.

Leader of People's Republic of Donestk is claiming that Ukrainians used chemical weapons earlier in the week.
 
#3,016
#3,016
Grand Vol said:
I don't disagree that it comes with the economic value of the area in question. However, the Holodomor had more to do with the Gosplan of the Soviet Union and the Five Year Plans than anything. The Soviets were rushing headlong into industrialization and didn't let other economic areas catch up. And the fact they did away with most of the private farms didn't help matters.

Plus, I would tend to think it was part of the Russification of the Soviet Union. While Uncle Joe was a Georgian, he was one helluva Russian nationalist. So getting rid of the Ukrainian people so more Russians could move in would have fit his typical MO. Kind of like the Soviet version of Lebensraum. Personal opinion though.
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The Ukrainians clung to their nationalism AND their religion. They were content with being poor religious peasants. Stalin could not have that mindset in the USSR. You can talk to many Ukrainians who will tell you Stalin was all about killing off the smartest and the most ignorant in society which included those who were devoutly religious.

And yes Russification was part as well. He would kill off or deport mass amounts of ethnic nationals in various regions and then bus in Russians. As soon as the USSR walked into the Baltics this strategy was executed there...no pun intended.

Stalin just flat out took the grain that the farmers had and did not give them see to replant - meaning no crops the following year plus no food. He got the grain to sell on the global market and to plant in other area collectives and then starved off the undesirables. He knew these religiously devout people would pray. With no seed they starved - and Stalin was able to say this belief was worthless because it did not save the people.
 
#3,017
#3,017
Ukrainian govt. is now claiming that 20 rebels and 1 Ukrainian serviceman killed in fighting at Mariupol's police headquarters today. Two very bloody Fridays in a row now.
 
#3,018
#3,018
Velo Vol said:
Yeah, but nowhere near the same scale.

My point, if I have one, is that today it's harder to ignore mass murder, even than it was in the '90s, due to the Internets.

Of course people in Syria probably disagree.
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I can't say that you are wrong in any way about this especially in light of the information age and the way things are plastered up within five minutes of happening.

And I think CSpin is correct that there would be a blind eye turned until the world had to do something unless it happens to be in an economically important zone.
 
#3,020
#3,020
#3,024
#3,024
Burhead said:
Crazy footage of what looks to be Ukrainian BMP-2s breaking down barricades in Mariupol.

Новое: Как боевики Национальной Гвардии таранили баррикады в Мариуполе [09/05/2014] - YouTube
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Thank you very much for posting this. I assume this video was from today in Mariupol, where the Ukrainian army was apparently shooting indiscriminately into crowds, according to Russian media. About that:

1. At first I was skeptical about those claims, but I saw a video of a man who was fired upon trying to physically intercept Ukrainian armor. The shot could have come from anywhere. Quite frankly, I think it came from Ukrainians who were passing by, but I think they were trying to shoot at his legs so as to warn him not to stand in the path. Else his ass might have gotten ran over. If you want to see the video I'm talking about, just go to RT. Shouldn't be difficult to find it.

2. After watching this video, I think I appreciate what the Ukrainian army is having to deal with even more. Mother****ers are running all over the place in the roads. You don't know who has a grenade, bomb, or Molotov. If someone is running towards you as you're going full speed, it seems like a natural instinct to be concerned and to possibly fire preemptively.

3. That crowd didn't seem too concerned about being fired upon. I mean, for god's sake, there's women out there who look like they're ready to go on dates just standing there taking photos and recording on their cell phones. I think RT is whistling "Dixie" again.
 
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#3,025
#3,025
Honestly, I might be assuming too much, because I'm not there. But that just looks like a bunch of people who have been spoonfed fear by the Kremlin. And they are reacting as such. Could be wrong though.
 
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