Ukraine Protests

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#8,951
#8,951
Pacer92 said:
We all know you are paid by the US govt to spread lies and to help overthrow and fix elections. You have NO basis...
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Guess you missed the part where the Russians do that as well. They are financing Le Pen's National Front electoral campaign.
 
#8,953
#8,953
Pacer92 said:
We all know you are paid by the US govt to spread lies and to help overthrow and fix elections. You have NO basis...
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No, we don't know that.

Stop your nonsense on here. Surely there's some Jews to go intimidate somewhere.
 
#8,956
#8,956
Burhead said:
Guess you missed the part where the Russians do that as well. They are financing Le Pen's National Front electoral campaign.
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I like your style burhead, you're the most rational of all posters on here...

Answer me this tho....why wouldn't Russia seek or endorse support when so many people are attacking and demonizing Russia?!

Why is Russia wrong for defending their interest?! This is all on their doorstep. Would America sit idly by if in the same position?!
 
#8,958
#8,958
Pacer92 said:
We all know you are paid by the US govt to spread lies and to help overthrow and fix elections. You have NO basis...
Click to expand...

The only time I've been paid by the US government is when I served in the Army. Well, full disclosure I do get a small check a month for disability for my injury incurred in service. If you have some proof I am getting paid by the government please don't hold out. I'm clearly missing some money somewhere. As for overthrowing and fixing....you are smoking some very poor crack. A website tracking poll results and an SMS program to remind people to vote is not exactly coup-worthy. Perhaps if I had Putin's payroll dropping $45 million recently for the French election giving money to fascist Le Pen.....if only. But Russians don't fix or meddle in elections right?
 
#8,959
#8,959
Pacer92 said:
I like your style burhead, you're the most rational of all posters on here...

Answer me this tho....why wouldn't Russia seek or endorse support when so many people are attacking and demonizing Russia?!

Why is Russia wrong for defending their interest?! This is all on their doorstep. Would America sit idly by if in the same position?!
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Creating war and instability against a neighbor is something you think OK? Blackmailing your neighbors with heating fuel is defending their interests? Kidnapping government employees in neighboring countries is defending their interests? Floodgates of men and weapons into your neighbor to incite internal conflict is defending your interests?

I have never faulted a nation in defending their interests. But like a libertarian standpoint, you defend all you want until it keeps me from defending myself. When your "defending" crosses that line....Estonia, Georgia, Ukraine are not Russia's pets. They are NOT Russia's interests. While they can be a concern, this is not their right to "meddle" as you so frequently like to use in terminology. You argue against meddling. Then you go down a path saying Russia can meddle because it is on their border. You are all over the place even in your own arguments. If meddling is wrong, it is wrong. If Russia can claim another sovereign nation as an interest, what is your problem with the EU doing the same? Ukraine is on their border and this whole issue was about economics. Russia turned it into military with their actions.

Lay off the double standards. Russia needs to as well. And before you accuse the US of doing so, think on the logic of is it mature to do they wrong you accuse others of doing?
 
#8,960
#8,960
Pacer92 said:
I like your style burhead, you're the most rational of all posters on here...

Answer me this tho....why wouldn't Russia seek or endorse support when so many people are attacking and demonizing Russia?!

Why is Russia wrong for defending their interest?! This is all on their doorstep. Would America sit idly by if in the same position?!
Click to expand...

I don't think any government or person is attacking Russia. I have respect for the Russian people but I don't respect nor support an authoritarian ex-KGB dictator.

What Putin needs to understand is that NATO nor America is a threat to them. No one here wants war with Russia which would end mankind. Russia does have a right to defend themselves but intervening in other sovereign countries is not something I support. The Kremlin needs to understand that the former USSR has been gone for 24 years almost and Russia no longer has the right to overrule the affairs of the former republics. Time and again Russia has been known to stir up separatist movements in the former USSR to reassert dominance or to divide the population of it's former territory.

I don't see what right or privilege Russia has to tell Georgia they can't join NATO or that Ukraine couldn't pursue a more European alignment. Had they not invaded and annexed Crimea and didn't stir unrest in the east and south that brotherly connection between Ukraine and Russia would still be there. In a matter months Putin managed to destroy a family bond that existed for centuries between nations for his own perverse gain.

There was no need to occupy Crimea by the Russian Federation. Even if Ukraine had joined NATO down the road the Russians would never lose the Black Sea port due to treaty obligations. I'm very concerned for the safety and security of Europe and America if Putin isn't stopped. I firmly believe that if the Western world fails to do something serious about supporting the Ukrainian state Putin will see this as a victory and the death of Western culture. He than will be embolden to try special war in countries that we have treaty obligations with.

I agree with that America does need to stop intervening abroad so much (see Mid-East). At first I was against providing support to the Ukraine but as this crisis has unfolded it has tugged at my heart for some reason. I saw a people wanting freedom and died to bring about a revolution to throw out a corrupt Russian puppet who stole from the state treasury and beat it's own people. Then I saw that country's more powerful older brother use the paralysis of the Ukrainian state to come like a thief in the night to annex land and start rebellion in the east. I see a people and a nation standing alone as they desperately fight to preserve their freedom and sovereign land against a technologically superior military without any support. The Ukraine story is an American/Western story and it pains me to see spineless leaders fail to give firm support to such patriotic people. I fully believe that as a nation if we say we are going to do something and give another our word we will follow through. That is why I support American assistance to Ukraine, we gave them our word and to this point haven't done much of anything to show that.
 
#8,961
#8,961
Pacer92 said:
I like your style burhead, you're the most rational of all posters on here...

Answer me this tho....why wouldn't Russia seek or endorse support when so many people are attacking and demonizing Russia?!

Why is Russia wrong for defending their interest?! This is all on their doorstep. Would America sit idly by if in the same position?!
Click to expand...

Thats what I'm saying. These people want to act brand new and actlike if the shoe wasn't on the other foot, the the US wouldn't react the exact same way as Russia... Or worse. Hell, its not about being pro-US or pro-Russian. Its about people being intellectually honest and not showing their Anglo-American biases.
 
#8,963
#8,963
Burhead said:
I don't think any government or person is attacking Russia. I have respect for the Russian people but I don't respect nor support an authoritarian ex-KGB dictator.

What Putin needs to understand is that NATO nor America is a threat to them. No one here wants war with Russia which would end mankind. Russia does have a right to defend themselves but intervening in other sovereign countries is not something I support. The Kremlin needs to understand that the former USSR has been gone for 24 years almost and Russia no longer has the right to overrule the affairs of the former republics. Time and again Russia has been known to stir up separatist movements in the former USSR to reassert dominance or to divide the population of it's former territory.

I don't see what right or privilege Russia has to tell Georgia they can't join NATO or that Ukraine couldn't pursue a more European alignment. Had they not invaded and annexed Crimea and didn't stir unrest in the east and south that brotherly connection between Ukraine and Russia would still be there. In a matter months Putin managed to destroy a family bond that existed for centuries between nations for his own perverse gain.

There was no need to occupy Crimea by the Russian Federation. Even if Ukraine had joined NATO down the road the Russians would never lose the Black Sea port due to treaty obligations. I'm very concerned for the safety and security of Europe and America if Putin isn't stopped. I firmly believe that if the Western world fails to do something serious about supporting the Ukrainian state Putin will see this as a victory and the death of Western culture. He than will be embolden to try special war in countries that we have treaty obligations with.

I agree with that America does need to stop intervening abroad so much (see Mid-East). At first I was against providing support to the Ukraine but as this crisis has unfolded it has tugged at my heart for some reason. I saw a people wanting freedom and died to bring about a revolution to throw out a corrupt Russian puppet who stole from the state treasury and beat it's own people. Then I saw that country's more powerful older brother use the paralysis of the Ukrainian state to come like a thief in the night to annex land and start rebellion in the east. I see a people and a nation standing alone as they desperately fight to preserve their freedom and sovereign land against a technologically superior military without any support. The Ukraine story is an American/Western story and it pains me to see spineless leaders fail to give firm support to such patriotic people. I fully believe that as a nation if we say we are going to do something and give another our word we will follow through. That is why I support American assistance to Ukraine, we gave them our word and to this point haven't done much of anything to show that.
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Seems like you are the one having a hard time understanding that the the USSR was finished 25 years ago because you still refer to thhe leader of Russia as a KGB dictator. Russia and Putin are fully aware of the evils and terrors of the Soviet era. The problem with Russia today is that the west continues to treat Russia as a communist, evil menace and wants to continue to fight the Cold War. And, at the same time, Russia is treated like a fangless bear that the wwest thinks they are now able to push around like one of these banan republics they are used to controlling and colonizing. The US might be able to push around one of these African or Latin countries, but if Russia has a feeling that they are being threatened in their regio, they are going to growl. The US needs to show some respect.
 
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#8,965
#8,965
Rasputin_Vol said:
Seems like you are the one having a hard time understanding that the the USSR was finished 25 years ago because you still refer to thhe leader of Russia as a KGB dictator. Russia and Putin are fully aware of the evils and terrors of the Soviet era. The problem with Russia today is that the west continues to treat Russia as a communist, evil menace and wants to continue to fight the Cold War. And, at the same time, Russia is treated like a fangless bear that the wwest thinks they are now able to push around like one of these banan republics they are used to controlling and colonizing. The US might be able to push around one of these African or Latin countries, but if Russia has a feeling that they are being threatened in their regio, they are going to growl. The US needs to show some respect.
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And then he said, "Russia and Putin are fully aware of the evils and terrors of the Soviet era."

No, no they're not.
 
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#8,966
#8,966
Burhead said:
At first I was against providing support to the Ukraine but as this crisis has unfolded it has tugged at my heart for some reason. I saw a people wanting freedom and died to bring about a revolution to throw out a corrupt Russian puppet who stole from the state treasury and beat it's own people. Then I saw that country's more powerful older brother use the paralysis of the Ukrainian state to come like a thief in the night to annex land and start rebellion in the east. I see a people and a nation standing alone as they desperately fight to preserve their freedom and sovereign land against a technologically superior military without any support. The Ukraine story is an American/Western story and it pains me to see spineless leaders fail to give firm support to such patriotic people. I fully believe that as a nation if we say we are going to do something and give another our word we will follow through. That is why I support American assistance to Ukraine, we gave them our word and to this point haven't done much of anything to show that.
Click to expand...

Literary.
 
#8,967
#8,967
Rasputin_Vol said:
Seems like you are the one having a hard time understanding that the the USSR was finished 25 years ago because you still refer to thhe leader of Russia as a KGB dictator. Russia and Putin are fully aware of the evils and terrors of the Soviet era. The problem with Russia today is that the west continues to treat Russia as a communist, evil menace and wants to continue to fight the Cold War. And, at the same time, Russia is treated like a fangless bear that the wwest thinks they are now able to push around like one of these banan republics they are used to controlling and colonizing. The US might be able to push around one of these African or Latin countries, but if Russia has a feeling that they are being threatened in their regio, they are going to growl. The US needs to show some respect.
Click to expand...

Confused.
 
#8,968
#8,968
Pacer92 said:
A great article that I'm sure will go unread because it's not MSM...

http://rt.com/op-edge/235075-russian-threat-jets-defense/
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There’s more chance of Count Dracula being elected Prime Minister of Romania than a Russian invasion of Britain, or indeed Latvia, Lithuania or Estonia.
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qftr

The establishment anti-Russia/anti-Putin campaign went into overdrive last week because of anger that a peace deal was reached in Minsk. The Russophobes want the conflict in Ukraine to continue to justify the sanctions on Russia.
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more wtf-ness

They’ve never forgiven Putin and Lavrov for blocking war against Syria in 2013 and for having the temerity to stand up and defend legitimate Russian national interests.
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in other countries? isn't this what America is being hated for, making other people's business our business?

you see pace this is why 'we don't read' your articles because nearly half of the stuff in there is made opinion passed off as fact, or makes light of serious misadventures because 1. they don't know the seriousness of it 2. know but don't mention because of their agenda 3. are looking for any reason to over blow the reactions.

Pretty sure the English Channel is a no fly zone for non-channel nations. I remember a few years ago the US issued an apology to france and britain for flying 3 kilometers inside the air boundaries. the russian bombers aren't turning around until they get escorted away. if a NATO plain flies with 100 miles of Russia its warmongering if Russian planes violate standing no-fly zones its them standing up for themselves.
 
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#8,970
#8,970
Rasputin_Vol said:
Seems like you are the one having a hard time understanding that the the USSR was finished 25 years ago because you still refer to thhe leader of Russia as a KGB dictator. Russia and Putin are fully aware of the evils and terrors of the Soviet era. The problem with Russia today is that the west continues to treat Russia as a communist, evil menace and wants to continue to fight the Cold War. And, at the same time, Russia is treated like a fangless bear that the wwest thinks they are now able to push around like one of these banan republics they are used to controlling and colonizing. The US might be able to push around one of these African or Latin countries, but if Russia has a feeling that they are being threatened in their regio, they are going to growl. The US needs to show some respect.
Click to expand...

Have you been to Russia? What qualifies you as the Russian expert on who Putin is and how Russia currently is? Have you seen anything within Russia since the fall?
 
#8,971
#8,971
Rasputin_Vol said:
Meanwhile, the Ukrainian hryvnia is collapsing thanks to the Anglo-American carpetbaggers, central bank loan sharks, and lost productivity from 12 months od war and destruction. Still wondering what happened to all of that Ukrainian central bank gold.

Ukraine’s Central Bank Limits Access to Foreign Currency
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The collapse of this economy was due to inept actions on the part of Putin's lapdog Yanukovich. The economy was all but in shambles. Russia's actions in the east are the war and destruction. Perhaps if Yanukovich kept his promise and Russia did not allow complete open borders to this madness Ukraine could recover. All we see now is Russia enabling and cheering on the demise of a neighbor. In the interests of peace Russia is using every tool at their disposal to break down a neighbor they just cannot let go of. If they cannot have Ukraine, apparently their logic is no one else can either.
 
#8,975
#8,975
CSpindizzy said:
In typical Vlad fashion....yesterday he said this sort of move by Ukraine would amount to genocide. So if Ukraine cutting off gas to an area within Donbas is genocide, what is Russia cutting off gas to Europe? That's a little beyond genocide.

Ukraine crisis: Putin will cut gas to Europe unless Russia is paid by the end of the week - Europe - World - The Independent
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remember the double standard going on here. The US once held a double standard against some country 50 years ago so that OKs Russia's actions even though the US was devil for doing it in completely different times and situations.
 
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