Tom Herman thread [merged]

#401
#401
gemlek said:
Do you think current Tennessee players are giving recruits a resounding thumbs up on the situation here? The stampede to the door of the transfer portal and NFL give some indication of the environment behind closed doors. There are disgruntled players everywhere.....coaches oversold their role, playtime, etc (as the article says). Herman would be a HUGE upgrade over the current HC...IMO.
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Tom Herman is a looney toons like San Antonio Spurs head coach Gregg Popovich

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#403
#403
Hawkeye4588 said:
I have watched every name thrown around here and yawned. A bunch of Jones and Pruitt equivalents that somehow desperate UT fans view as the next Saban. And then Hugh Freeze. We really want to risk everything on that guy? His record is murky to say the least. And then I see the other UT fires Tom Herman. Personally I think Herman was heading the right direction. 7-6 his first season. 10-3 season two with a Big 12 championship berth and great win over Georgia in the Sugar. 8-5 season three with a win over Utah in the bowl game. 7-3 in the weird 2020 season with another bowl win vs Colorado. 33-17 overall. Definitely a record Pruitt would envy. This is a coach I could get fired up about and might be worth the risk of yet another coaching change.
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Texas was definitely heading in a much better direction under Herman compared to Tennessee under Pruitt. Herman would be the second best or potentially best head coach in the east. John Adams seems to love the idea of him here.
 
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#404
#404
Texas talent availability or abudance is deceptive in my opinion. What was Tom Herman really having to deal with recruiting to Austin. Most people think recruiting to Austin should be a cake walk. Well...lets look at the numbers

Of the 50 states it produces the most or one of the most top football prospects in the entire country
For the sake of this argument I will use number of 4 and 5 star players per state.

In 2021 class:
Texas- 52 (Herman)
Georgia- 28 (Pruitt)
Tennessee- 12 (Pruitt)
North Carolina- 19 ( Pruitt)

Name in () means the coach's recruiting territory more or less.

So it looks like Herman has the advantage.
Pruitt has to recruit 3 states in order to have the same amount of talent as Herman does in his "backyard ".
59 for 3 states. 52 for 1 BIG state.

But there in lies the deception. Texas is BIG. Herman's backyard was mostly an empty lot that didn't have a property line into the wheat fields.

Geography is real. Especially in recruiting. Kids want their family's to be there in person if all possible to see then perform.

Texas- 269,000 sq miles
Total sq miles ----

Georgia- 60,000 sq miles
North Carolina- 51,000 sq miles
Tennessee - 42,000 sq miles
Total- 153,000 sq miles

# OF Blue Chip Recruit per area
Pruitt has 1 per 2,593 sq miles
Herman had 1 per 5,170 sq miles


If you made one whole state out of North Carolina, Georgia and Tennessee. You would get a T shape state, with Knoxville being snap dab in the middle.

What am I saying?
Pruitt has a better recruiting ground than Herman.

The University of Tennessee has a superior recruiting footprint than The University of Texas.
I didn't even count Alabama or South Carolina, which area wise still fits inside Texas...
 
#405
#405
It has been a very long time since I have posted.

Regarding Tom Herman, if you look at this season Texas went 7-3. That's not bad.

Look further, the three loses were by a total of 13 points.

TCU vs Texas L 31-33
Okla vs Texas L 45-53(OT)
Iowa State vs Texas L 20-23

All of these games were at Texas, though the Oklahoma game was in Dallas.

TCU won in the last 2.5 minutes
Iowa State won in the last couple minutes.
Okla won in overtime.

This was his fourth year at Texas, and he is minutes, and points away from 9-1 or 10-0. I don't know about the difficulty that Texas experienced due to COVID, but the pandemic has affected everyone. Texas was not blown out in any of these losses.

If you look merely at the fact that he was fired at Texas, then you can presume a great deal, but when more closely inspected, it seems that he may have angered some boosters, because his 2020 record, and more specifically the margins, of loss, show that they were on the cusp of something.

And to assume that any difficulties with boosters there would equate to the same at Tennessee is not a very good argument, in my mind.

There are many fanbases along with boosters that have unreasonable expectations. Texas seems to have an even more unreasonable group than Tennessee.
In his second season at Texas, Herman took them to a 10-4 record. His fourth year was 7-3, but it could have easily been 9-1, or 9-3 if they had played their full schedule, had there been no COVID.

Herman would be a great hire, and he has just dealt with a booster group even worse than ours at Tennessee.

Just some food for thought as we wallow through this quagmire of uncertainty.
 
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#406
#406
tarvol73 said:
It has been a very long time since I have posted.

Regarding Tom Herman, if you look at this season Texas went 7-3. That's not bad.

Look further, the three loses were by a total of 13 points.

TCU vs Texas L 31-33
Okla vs Texas L 45-53(OT)
Iowa State vs Texas L 20-23

All of these games were at Texas, though the Oklahoma game was in Dallas.

TCU won in the last 2.5 minutes
Iowa State won in the last couple minutes.
Okla won in overtime.

This was his fourth year at Texas, and he is minutes, and points away from 9-1 or 10-0. I don't know about the difficulty that Texas experienced due to COVID, but the pandemic has affected everyone. Texas was not blown out in any of these losses.

If you look merely at the fact that he was fired at Texas, then you can presume a great deal, but when more closely inspected, it seems that he may have angered some boosters, because his 2020 record, and more specifically the margins, of loss, show that they were on the cusp of something.

And to assume that any difficulties with boosters there would equate to the same at Tennessee is not a very good argument, in my mind.

There are many fanbases along with boosters that have unreasonable expectations. Texas seems to have an even more unreasonable group than Tennessee.
In his second season at Texas, Herman took them to a 10-4 record. His fourth year was 7-3, but it could have easily been 9-1, or 9-3 if they had played their full schedule, had there been no COVID.

Herman would be a great hire, and he has just dealt with a booster group even worse than ours at Tennessee.

Just some food for thought as we wallow through this quagmire of uncertainty.
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Do you think winning in the SEC is more or less difficult than winning in the Big 12?
 
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#407
#407
I believe that while not apples to oranges, it is not a simple comparison. I do believe that if you gave Herman Pruitt's team the last couple of years, that he does a much better job than JP.

If he can recruit here, then I believe that he can be the best coach here since Fulmer, maybe even Fulmer in his better years.
 
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#409
#409
vmivol00 said:
Do you think winning in the SEC is more or less difficult than winning in the Big 12?
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Valid questions. But look what OU did to UF? Also, Freeze isn’t happening and neither is Malzahan. So if we do get rid of Pruitt, what AVAILABLE HC our there would actually be better than Herman?

You mention the difference in difficulty between winning in the B12 v SEC. what do you think the difference would be between Chadwell, Napier it Fickell would be in the SEC?
 
#412
#412
tarvol73 said:
I believe that while not apples to oranges, it is not a simple comparison. I do believe that if you gave Herman Pruitt's team the last couple of years, that he does a much better job than JP.
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You could have given Pee Wee Herman Pruitt's team last year and he wouldn't have lost to Georgia State....
 
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#415
#415
tarvol73 said:
It has been a very long time since I have posted.

Regarding Tom Herman, if you look at this season Texas went 7-3. That's not bad.

Look further, the three loses were by a total of 13 points.

TCU vs Texas L 31-33
Okla vs Texas L 45-53(OT)
Iowa State vs Texas L 20-23

All of these games were at Texas, though the Oklahoma game was in Dallas.

TCU won in the last 2.5 minutes
Iowa State won in the last couple minutes.
Okla won in overtime.

This was his fourth year at Texas, and he is minutes, and points away from 9-1 or 10-0. I don't know about the difficulty that Texas experienced due to COVID, but the pandemic has affected everyone. Texas was not blown out in any of these losses.

If you look merely at the fact that he was fired at Texas, then you can presume a great deal, but when more closely inspected, it seems that he may have angered some boosters, because his 2020 record, and more specifically the margins, of loss, show that they were on the cusp of something.

And to assume that any difficulties with boosters there would equate to the same at Tennessee is not a very good argument, in my mind.

There are many fanbases along with boosters that have unreasonable expectations. Texas seems to have an even more unreasonable group than Tennessee.
In his second season at Texas, Herman took them to a 10-4 record. His fourth year was 7-3, but it could have easily been 9-1, or 9-3 if they had played their full schedule, had there been no COVID.

Herman would be a great hire, and he has just dealt with a booster group even worse than ours at Tennessee.

Just some food for thought as we wallow through this quagmire of uncertainty.
Click to expand...

But he also barely won against Okie State (OT), barely won against T-Tech (OT) and barely beat WV (4 points). He could easily, and probably should have been, 4-6.
Herman had the players. His problem is somewhat the same as our. Player development. How is Herman an upgrade, again?
 
#416
#416
My only concern with Herman is the fact that some of his own players were telling recruits not to come to Texas. We don't need a situation where the players don't trust the coaches. The same thing was happening the last two seasons under Butch. For all of Pruitt's faults, he's honest with his players and backs them up. They don't quit on him and actively recruit FOR him. If we're looking at hiring a new coach, we need someone that has that quality in addition to being much better at managing a football program. I think Napier could be that guy.
 
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#418
#418
utvols83 said:
My only concern with Herman is the fact that some of his own players were telling recruits not to come to Texas. We don't need a situation where the players don't trust the coaches. The same thing was happening the last two seasons under Butch. For all of Pruitt's faults, he's honest with his players and backs them up. They don't quit on him and actively recruit FOR him. If we're looking at hiring a new coach, we need someone that has that quality in addition to being much better at managing a football program. I think Napier could be that guy.
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I've seen this mentioned but where is this info coming from?

Everyone was pretty much out on Jumbo at FSU and he has done well at TAM. Maybe it's an opportunity to learn for Herman?

Napier is a Saban guy... copied Saban's "process" but calls it the "journey". We need to stay far, far away from Saban guys. I know he coached under Dabo, etc but his biggest influence has been Saban. Only Georgia has had any success replicating the Bama model..
 
#419
#419
OriginalCoach said:
But he also barely won against Okie State (OT), barely won against T-Tech (OT) and barely beat WV (4 points). He could easily, and probably should have been, 4-6.
Herman had the players. His problem is somewhat the same as our. Player development. How is Herman an upgrade, again?
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Because he DID win those games.

He also beat no.6 UGA in a Sugar Bowl.

Beat a no.3 Oklahoma team with Baker Mayfield that went to the CFP.

Took over a program that was 15-21 the 3 previous years (Pruitt is 16-19) and went to Big 12 title game in year 2.

Has also won 71% if his games as a HC

In 6yrs as a HC he has more top 10 wins tha TN has had as a program in 12yrs.

So how is he not an upgrade?
 
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#422
#422
I’d take Napier over Campbell and Herman. Napier develops his talent more than Herman, understands having a plan to run a program which includes appearances at booster events, and is a relentless recruiter. All of which Herman failed at Texas.
I like Campbell but he’s not as good a fit as Napier who knows all the SE. Napier also beat Campbell 31-14 this season. So if no Freeze I’d got hard for Kiffin or Napier. Make them say no
 
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#423
#423
griddie said:
I’d take Napier over Campbell and Herman. Napier develops his talent more than Herman, understands having a plan to run a program which includes appearances at booster events, and is a relentless recruiter. All of which Herman failed at Texas.
I like Campbell but he’s not as good a fit as Napier who knows all the SE. Napier also beat Campbell 31-14 this season. So if no Freeze I’d got hard for Kiffin or Napier. Make them say no
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Napier is a Saban guy. Pass. That has failed twice already. Napier, Dooley, Pruitt, and anyone else from his tree is not Nick Saban. They're not going to produce the same results using his same system.

Yes, he coached under Dabo and other people but his primary influence has been Saban. He has copied "The Process" into his own program but calls it "The Journey".
 
#424
#424
Birdie said:
Because he DID win those games.

He also beat no.6 UGA in a Sugar Bowl.

Beat a no.3 Oklahoma team with Baker Mayfield that went to the CFP.

Took over a program that was 15-21 the 3 previous years (Pruitt is 16-19) and went to Big 12 title game in year 2.

Has also won 71% if his games as a HC

In 6yrs as a HC he has more top 10 wins tha TN has had as a program in 12yrs.

So how is he not an upgrade?
Click to expand...

Using this logic, why didn’t Texas keep him?
 
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