The Section 103 Postgame Report

#52
#52
My Thoughts (also from 103).

Perimeter defense is pitiful. Awful.
Inside defense it commendable, although it seems Negedu and Williams still get called for cheap fouls.

The team never really got off to any ind of run to get the crowd into the game. I realized its UNC-A, a crappy, horrible team, but a nice 15-2 or 20-3 run against this team is very doable and it would have ignited the crowd a bit more. However, nice attendance for this game.

However, there were slight cheers from a couple of the dunks and the Hopson 3s. The biggest cheer of the night was when Hubert nailed a 3 with under a minute to go to bring the score to 87. The cheer was for the Free Chicken Sandwich that one more three would have got all ticket holders. kinda funny, but rather sad at the same time.

Woolridge needs to penetrate ALOT more. Stop launching horrible looking three's.
 
#53
#53
hatvol96 said:
1. Lackluster effort, which is to expected after the big weekend in Orlando.
2. Asheville is awful.
3. Brian Williams is a go to scoring move away from being a big time offensive force. Chism could take lessons from him on how to pass out of the double.
4. Good crowd for a bad opponent on a Wednesday night.
5. Whoever impressed upon Renaldo Woolridge to attack the rim off the dribble in the second half deserves kudos. He had been totally one dimensional the last couple of games.
6. Nobody does less work to get his points than JP Prince. I'm just waiting for a teammate to refuse to throw him the ball on one of his snowbird forays.
7. If what we're seeing now is all UT is going to get out of Wayne Chism, this team is going to fall well short of expectations.
8. It's becoming readily apparent that Tyler Smith is going to be the primary ballhandler in UT's halfcourt offense.
9. Josh Tabb showed more offensive aggressiveness tonight. He needs to keep coming with that.
10. I bet there was a point in his career when Bruce figured win #400 would come at Southern Indiana.
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hey Hat
Where are your seats in 103?
 
#54
#54
The bigs really need to learn a finish move inside besides wildly throwing the ball up at the basket and hoping it goes in.
 
#55
#55
hatvol96 said:
I'm really impressed with Greg Monroe and Kemba Walker. I haven't seen Luke Babbit yet, but everyone I talk to raves about him.
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What do you think of Ed Davis at UNC?

He seems to be fitting right in on a team that was already loaded...of course it doesn't hurt him that UNC is thin in the post with Hansbrough's issues and losing Zeller for the year

I remember watching Davis is the McD's game and I wasn't impressed...but watching his play at UNC has changed my opinion...

He has nice moves down low, nice touch on his shots, rebounds well, gives UNC a shot blocking presense(which was non existent for them w/o him) and runs the floor extremely well for a big guy...

I know he won't be anywhere near FOY...but he's alot more polished than I expected him to be
 
#56
#56
blamie said:
What do you think of Ed Davis at UNC?

He seems to be fitting right in on a team that was already loaded...of course it doesn't hurt him that UNC is thin in the post with Hansbrough's issues and losing Zeller for the year

I remember watching Davis is the McD's game and I wasn't impressed...but watching his play at UNC has changed my opinion...

He has nice moves down low, nice touch on his shots, rebounds well, gives UNC a shot blocking presense(which was non existent for them w/o him) and runs the floor extremely well for a big guy...

I know he won't be anywhere near FOY...but he's alot more polished than I expected him to be
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I think he has been reasonably solid, but has yet to see a double team because you can't afford it with UNC.

Monroe is a dramatically better player.
 
#57
#57
BigPapaVol said:
I think he has been reasonably solid, but has yet to see a double team because you can't afford it with UNC.

Monroe is a dramatically better player.
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I haven't seen Monroe but I've heard he's awesome...I was Xmas shopping while we were playing G'Town(not my choice :banghead2: )...

I see Davis as a more naturally-gifted version of Deon Thompson...if he sticks around he will develop into the best post player UNC has...

When you look at what they lose after this year and the fact that Zeller and Henson(class of 10') are more the Dirk Nowitzski(sp) type of PF...Davis may end up being the only true post player they have
 
#58
#58
The ROY this year will be Al Farouq Amino from Wake Forest, Greg Monroe, or kemba walker..

Ed Davis isn't even in this discussion

Aminu IMO is the best one so far.. he's doing great on a stacked WFU team.. and his stats are getting better every game.
 
#59
#59
blamie said:
What do you think of Ed Davis at UNC?

He seems to be fitting right in on a team that was already loaded...of course it doesn't hurt him that UNC is thin in the post with Hansbrough's issues and losing Zeller for the year

I remember watching Davis is the McD's game and I wasn't impressed...but watching his play at UNC has changed my opinion...

He has nice moves down low, nice touch on his shots, rebounds well, gives UNC a shot blocking presense(which was non existent for them w/o him) and runs the floor extremely well for a big guy...

I know he won't be anywhere near FOY...but he's alot more polished than I expected him to be
Click to expand...

k-sny-vol said:
The ROY this year will be Al Farouq Amino from Wake Forest, Greg Monroe, or kemba walker..

Ed Davis isn't even in this discussion

Aminu IMO is the best one so far.. he's doing great on a stacked WFU team.. and his stats are getting better every game.
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I know he's not...my point is I'm surprised at how polished his play is cause I saw him in two high school All Star games and wasn't impressed at all
 
#60
#60
blamie said:
I know he's not...my point is I'm surprised at how polished his play is cause I saw him in two high school All Star games and wasn't impressed at all
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those all-star games are awful places to try and make any assessments.
 
#61
#61
BigPapaVol said:
those all-star games are awful places to try and make any assessments.
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No doubt...a complete lack of D not to mention the players are usually not in game shape at all...

But I saw a seemingly unathletic beanpole with no discernable post moves...I was wondering "How did this kid get so highly rated...is it an effort thing?"

I thought he would kind of just fade into oblivion at this level but he has been a very solid player for the best team in the country...

But you were right about the double teams...we'll see what happens next year when he's more of a focal point
 
#62
#62
blamie said:
What do you think of Ed Davis at UNC?

He seems to be fitting right in on a team that was already loaded...of course it doesn't hurt him that UNC is thin in the post with Hansbrough's issues and losing Zeller for the year

I remember watching Davis is the McD's game and I wasn't impressed...but watching his play at UNC has changed my opinion...

He has nice moves down low, nice touch on his shots, rebounds well, gives UNC a shot blocking presense(which was non existent for them w/o him) and runs the floor extremely well for a big guy...

I know he won't be anywhere near FOY...but he's alot more polished than I expected him to be
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Davis is good and getting better. He'll be a pro.
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#63
#63
BigPapaVol said:
those all-star games are awful places to try and make any assessments.
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Per one of the best coaches on the West Coast: "I can learn more watching a kid go through layup lines before one of his high school game than I can watching him play in all star games."
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#65
#65
hatvol96 said:
Per one of the best coaches on the West Coast: "I can learn more watching a kid go through layup lines before one of his high school game than I can watching him play in all star games."
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I remember that quote...I forgot who said it though
 
#66
#66
blamie said:
I remember that quote...I forgot who said it though
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I'm gonna take a shot in the light here and guess that it was some coach who is no different than the hoary passe baseball boys that MONEYBALL eviscerates. The sentiment behind the statement is kinda neat, but beyond that it's ridiculous and an attempt to promote one's eyes' value over easily attainable evaluations--like production! like base physical att.s!.

It's a cute hook-line, sure, but it's empty at its core and almost silly in its arrogance.

You know who did a mean lay-up in warm-ups? Dane bradshaw.

You know who slacks? Bobby Maze.

Grit belongs in breakfast.
 
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#67
#67
That's cute lidderer. Wrong as two boys having intercourse, but cute nonetheless.
 
#69
#69
lidderer said:
I'm gonna take a shot in the light here and guess that it was some coach who is no different than the hoary passe baseball boys that MONEYBALL eviscerates. The sentiment behind the statement is kinda neat, but beyond that it's ridiculous and an attempt to promote one's eyes' value over easily attainable evaluations--like production! like base physical att.s!.

It's a cute hook-line, sure, but it's empty at its core and almost silly in its arrogance.

You know who did a mean lay-up in warm-ups? Dane bradshaw.

You know who slacks? Bobby Maze.

Grit belongs in breakfast.
Click to expand...
Moneyball: A book where a bunch of numbers dorks try to tell everyone Nick Swisher and some fatass catcher from Alabama who nobody remembers are going to be great players because "the numbers say so." Yeah, all of Billy Beane's World Series rings really eviscerate the traditional notions of scouting.
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#70
#70
hatvol96 said:
Moneyball: A book where a bunch of numbers dorks try to tell everyone Nick Swisher and some fatass catcher from Alabama who nobody remembers are going to be great players because "the numbers say so." Yeah, all of Billy Beane's World Series rings really eviscerate the traditional notions of scouting.
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Hi Joe Morgan!

I take it you didnt read the book. It's about market inefficiency and finding unearthed talent on a shoestring budget. He claims that if he had the money he'd go after the Pujols and the Arods, but given the financial limitations a small-market team has, he has to settle for swisher and stabs at Youkillis(moneyball's poster-boy, donchaknow). His teams were ridiculously consistent given the funding he had to work with; it seems really strange to knock what he's done as though a WS is the only thing to measure someone's worth by---Bruce Pearl hasn't done this for UT and I'd still consider him a giant success if his career here ended tomorrow.

The traditional notions of scouting arent entirely useless, obviously, but the old schooler's tendency to polarize the debate with lines like that silly 'lay-up' one negate the worth of the other side of the equation(yes, numbers), but both deserve a place.
 
#72
#72
lidderer said:
Hi Joe Morgan!

I take it you didnt read the book. It's about market inefficiency and finding unearthed talent on a shoestring budget. He claims that if he had the money he'd go after the Pujols and the Arods, but given the financial limitations a small-market team has, he has to settle for swisher and stabs at Youkillis(moneyball's poster-boy, donchaknow). His teams were ridiculously consistent given the funding he had to work with; it seems really strange to knock what he's done as though a WS is the only thing to measure someone's worth by---Bruce Pearl hasn't done this for UT and I'd still consider him a giant success if his career here ended tomorrow.

The traditional notions of scouting arent entirely useless, obviously, but the old schooler's tendency to polarize the debate with lines like that silly 'lay-up' one negate the worth of the other side of the equation(yes, numbers), but both deserve a place.
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I'll give you 3 reasons for Billy Beane's credibility:

1. Mulder
2. Hudson
3. Zito

Those guys have nothing to do with OBP or the like. I'll take traditional scouting over Bean, DePodesta, etc. The only guy that has done anything was Epstein, but when you have Manny and Ortiz, plugging Moneyball players into an All-Star lineup ain't that tough.
 
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#73
#73
UTLCA said:
I'll give you 3 reasons for Billy Beane's credibility:

1. Mulder
2. Hudson
3. Zito
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Even if one finds that an effective response or reason for his success(which it isn't), the point still holds re: the book: scouts are outmoded in a lot of ways and the way they dismiss newer methods of evaluation is wrongheaded and silly.

The point, recall, that started this was about the book(written by Michael Lewis, NOT billy) attacking the antique notions of scouting. We can have a conversation about Beane proper, but it's secondary to what started this part of the conversation.
 
#74
#74
UTLCA said:
The only guy that has done anything was Epstein, but when you have Manny and Ortiz, plugging Moneyball players into an All-Star lineup ain't that tough.
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Ya, Youks has nothing to do with OBP. And yes, when you implement the moneyball theory and add payroll you get a perenially disappointing team winning a world series for the first time in eons.

Traditional scouting was shoddy, thankfully the lessons in moneyball have been co-opted by other teams---it isn't too difficult to hear other GMs speak of the moneyball ideas nowadays--and now the market inefficiency is no longer.

Next up: fielding stats, I suppose.

It's funny how that book was championing Beane and yet its widespread attention rendered his innovations useless once the info was known across-the-board.
 
#75
#75
lidderer said:
Hi Joe Morgan!

I take it you didnt read the book. It's about market inefficiency and finding unearthed talent on a shoestring budget. He claims that if he had the money he'd go after the Pujols and the Arods, but given the financial limitations a small-market team has, he has to settle for swisher and stabs at Youkillis(moneyball's poster-boy, donchaknow). His teams were ridiculously consistent given the funding he had to work with; it seems really strange to knock what he's done as though a WS is the only thing to measure someone's worth by---Bruce Pearl hasn't done this for UT and I'd still consider him a giant success if his career here ended tomorrow.

The traditional notions of scouting arent entirely useless, obviously, but the old schooler's tendency to polarize the debate with lines like that silly 'lay-up' one negate the worth of the other side of the equation(yes, numbers), but both deserve a place.
Click to expand...
I read the book because I like Michael Lewis. It simply reinforced what, having spent considerable time in the Bay Area, I already knew. Beane is a self promoter unwilling to admit his "genius" was based on Barry Zito, Mark Mulder, and Tim Hudson.
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