The Radical Islamic Terrorism Catch-All Thread

So we should ban people from talking honestly about Islam because it may motivate radical rednecks to the point of committing hate crimes against Muslims? How about we ban Islam since the Quran may motivate radical Jihadists to behead unbelievers?

That's a lot of straw man. Did I say that we should ban anything at all?

No, you are not speaking honestly about Islam. Honesty relies on discussing the entire scope of the situation. You can't point out that there are flaws and radicals without acknowledging that their are millions of normal and non radicalized Muslims within our border. People say that Muslims need to be louder in condemning ISIS attacks, yet those same people think all of Islam is evil and should be eliminated entirely. When we generalize the entire religion and continue to alienate the "normal", we would be absolutely naive to not expect Muslims to prioritize defense toward their religion from the millions around them in this country.
 
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Care to expound on what positives there are about ME Islamic religion and culture? It's cute you try and make them victims.

music, food, artwork, women. anything that gives other cultures any positives they have too. you just aren't willing to look past the negatives.
 
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my point is as advanced society we have better options than random killings. Look at warfare. what separates us from the sand monkeys? Precision. We don't carpet bomb a whole city to blow up one building. we shouldn't target a whole mosque to get a radicalized individual.

you can't enact total war when its on your own citizens. We have better tools than they do, use them. I am not, nor have I ever argued passivitiy. there is a better method than they use.

Never said random killings as retribution was good or logical.

PS. Sand monkeys? Really?
 
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That's a lot of straw man. Did I say that we should ban anything at all?

No, you are not speaking honestly about Islam. Honesty relies on discussing the entire scope of the situation. You can't point out that there are flaws and radicals without acknowledging that their are millions of normal and non radicalized Muslims within our border. People say that Muslims need to be louder in condemning ISIS attacks, yet those same people think all of Islam is evil and should be eliminated entirely. When we generalize the entire religion and continue to alienate the "normal", we would be absolutely naive to not expect Muslims to prioritize defense toward their religion from the millions around them in this country.

Oh I'm sorry! Did I not interpret your argument charitably? Gee I would absolutely hate it if somebody did that exact same thing to me multiple times in the same thread. Oh wait...
 
The problem I have is the moderate community, while speaking out, still is quite on other issues that they should speak out on. Honestly answer for me, what would happen to you if you lived in Saudi or Iran and you were gay? Where is the vocal outrage for this? Women are eviscerated in these cultures and there is not a word spoken about it. The response to the Danish cartoons was embassies burning. This wasn't done by Isis, but by less radical Islamic communities who were pissed at being offended. When journalist are beheaded, it is condemned by the mainstream community, but nobody comes out and says there is absolutely no justification for it in any Islamic text, Qu'ran or Hadith.

My problem is a disproportionate amount of effort is spent condemning those doing the offending as opposed to those taking retribution. I furthermore think that while the primary obligation to speak out falls on the Muslim community, the progressive PC crowd on the left needs needs to stop providing cover and speak out honestly. There is a problem with Islam itself, and we need to be honest about it. As an atheist, I can burn a Bible on national television and not worry about my life from radical Christians. Can I honestly say the same about a Qu'ran and radical Muslims? There is a special problem with Islam, and it should be clear to everybody.

To see what I'm really talking about, listen to what Maajid Nawaz has to say about this. He is one of the very few moderates that is talking bout this in a very open and honest manner. In return, he has been called a talking monkey and other deplorable things from other moderates and those on the left for simply acknowledging the problem.

I can't speak for Saudi Arabia, although I am certain that Iran treats their women 100x better than the KSA, but there is plenty of criticism toward the Iranian government from their people, and there has been unrest in Iran for a while now. Iran is far more civilized and modernized than a good bit of their neighbors, and a good portion of the educated populace is aware that their government is an abomination. If Iranians were vocal about the government, what do you expect to happen to them? It's not America. They're government is awful and can be ruthless at times. Ironically if not for US intervention back in the day, Iran would have a democracy. But that's a seperate issue.

No one is denying that specific text in the Quran and a combination of a lack of education and instability has led to the formation of these terrorist organizations. But generalizing the entire religion as evil from the west is doing nothing but polarizing the ingroup/outgroup mentality. How can anyone expect normal Muslims to combat extremism if their alleged allies in the west think of their entire religion as scum? How can they put their attention on extremism when they have to worry about the millions of voices around them telling them how much their religion sucks.


If I have a little cousin who beats up Tums little cousin, I would surely punish my cousin. But if I have a cousin who beats up Tums cousin, and Tums and all of Tums relatives tell me that my entire culture and race is evil and has no place in the world, and that my entire family should just get nuked off the earth for the betterment of civilization, it becomes hard to solely punish your cousin and not defend yourself from Tums entire family.
 
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I can't speak for Saudi Arabia, although I am certain that Iran treats their women 100x better than the KSA, but there is plenty of criticism toward the Iranian government from their people, and there has been unrest in Iran for a while now. Iran is far more civilized and modernized than a good bit of their neighbors, and a good portion of the educated populace is aware that their government is an abomination. If Iranians were vocal about the government, what do you expect to happen to them? It's not America. They're government is awful and can be ruthless at times. Ironically if not for US intervention back in the day, Iran would have a democracy. But that's a seperate issue.

No one is denying that specific text in the Quran and a combination of a lack of education and instability has led to the formation of these terrorist organizations. But generalizing the entire religion as evil from the west is doing nothing but polarizing the ingroup/outgroup mentality. How can anyone expect normal Muslims to combat extremism if their alleged allies in the west think of their entire religion as scum? How can they put their attention on extremism when they have to worry about the millions of voices around them telling them how much their religion sucks.


If I have a little cousin who beats up Tums little cousin, I would surely punish my cousin. But if I have a cousin who beats up Tums cousin, and Tums and all of Tums relatives tell me that my entire culture and race is evil and has no place in the world, and that my entire family should just get nuked off the earth for the betterment of civilization, it becomes hard to solely punish your cousin and not defend yourself from Tums entire family.

If I'm not mistaken, Iranians for the most part are Persian and not Arab. Right?
 
No one is denying that specific text in the Quran and a combination of a lack of education and instability has led to the formation of these terrorist organizations. But generalizing the entire religion as evil from the west is doing nothing but polarizing the ingroup/outgroup mentality. How can anyone expect normal Muslims to combat extremism if their alleged allies in the west think of their entire religion as scum? How can they put their attention on extremism when they have to worry about the millions of voices around them telling them how much their religion sucks.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Nobody is denying certain people are bigoted against Islam. But simply pointing out the issues on how certain perceived slights are handled by the Islamic community is a problem is not bigoted or calling the religion or even culture "scum". It's acknowledging there is a problem. When 78% of British Muslims believe cartoonists should be prosecuted, or journalists have to fear for their safety because they wrote criticism of Islam then that is a serious issue. That is a problem moderates need to be speaking up against.

I'm not talking about condemning ISIS and regressing it out as a problem to the rest of Islam. I know, and everybody with a brain knows, that is not mainstream. I'm talking about the actual problem with mainstream Islam and how it is addressed by the more moderate factions.
 
I can't speak for Saudi Arabia, although I am certain that Iran treats their women 100x better than the KSA, but there is plenty of criticism toward the Iranian government from their people, and there has been unrest in Iran for a while now. Iran is far more civilized and modernized than a good bit of their neighbors, and a good portion of the educated populace is aware that their government is an abomination. If Iranians were vocal about the government, what do you expect to happen to them? It's not America. They're government is awful and can be ruthless at times. Ironically if not for US intervention back in the day, Iran would have a democracy. But that's a seperate issue.

No one is denying that specific text in the Quran and a combination of a lack of education and instability has led to the formation of these terrorist organizations. But generalizing the entire religion as evil from the west is doing nothing but polarizing the ingroup/outgroup mentality. How can anyone expect normal Muslims to combat extremism if their alleged allies in the west think of their entire religion as scum? How can they put their attention on extremism when they have to worry about the millions of voices around them telling them how much their religion sucks.


If I have a little cousin who beats up Tums little cousin, I would surely punish my cousin. But if I have a cousin who beats up Tums cousin, and Tums and all of Tums relatives tell me that my entire culture and race is evil and has no place in the world, and that my entire family should just get nuked off the earth for the betterment of civilization, it becomes hard to solely punish your cousin and not defend yourself from Tums entire family.

Islam isn't people. People aren't Islam. Stop talking about Islam as if it is anything other than codified religious dogma. Stop bringing up this absurd idea of wholesale destruction of people. Nobody is saying we should exterminate Islam by exterminating all the Muslims. Exterminate bad ideas by subjecting them to scrutiny and honest debate. Can you really sit there and tell me we are having a truthful dialog in the media, town halls, and social media about Islam? You're delusional or flat out lying if you suggest we are currently having honest public debates about this subject. The moment you bring up Islam truthfully, you are labeled an "Islamophobe" (as if that is actually a thing) and sacrificed at the alter of political correctness. That sh!t has to stop if we want to publicly defeat the bad idea known as Islam.
 
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I can't speak for Saudi Arabia, although I am certain that Iran treats their women 100x better than the KSA, but there is plenty of criticism toward the Iranian government from their people, and there has been unrest in Iran for a while now. Iran is far more civilized and modernized than a good bit of their neighbors, and a good portion of the educated populace is aware that their government is an abomination. If Iranians were vocal about the government, what do you expect to happen to them? It's not America. They're government is awful and can be ruthless at times. Ironically if not for US intervention back in the day, Iran would have a democracy. But that's a seperate issue.

No one is denying that specific text in the Quran and a combination of a lack of education and instability has led to the formation of these terrorist organizations. But generalizing the entire religion as evil from the west is doing nothing but polarizing the ingroup/outgroup mentality. How can anyone expect normal Muslims to combat extremism if their alleged allies in the west think of their entire religion as scum? How can they put their attention on extremism when they have to worry about the millions of voices around them telling them how much their religion sucks.


If I have a little cousin who beats up Tums little cousin, I would surely punish my cousin. But if I have a cousin who beats up Tums cousin, and Tums and all of Tums relatives tell me that my entire culture and race is evil and has no place in the world, and that my entire family should just get nuked off the earth for the betterment of civilization, it becomes hard to solely punish your cousin and not defend yourself from Tums entire family.

Hey man. Curious on your MCAT. Update us when you've got news in the OT thread, ok?
 
Iranian stoning of women

Don't watch this if you think seeing two women wrapped in sheets and buried to their waists and VICIOUSLY stoned to death will bother you.

https://youtu.be/PFfK6TEWLjw

1) Lets not act as if this happen 100 times a day, I never claimed it was ideal in Iran.
2) Regardless, the rights women have in Iran in comparison to Saudi Arabia is beyond noticable.
 
music, food, artwork, women. anything that gives other cultures any positives they have too. you just aren't willing to look past the negatives.

Islamic music? Lol

Islamic art? Lol

Food? I ate at Iranian restaurants in Doha. Nothin special. Not terrible, just nothing special.

Women? The ones society is allowed to see are few and far between.


Next.
 
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I can't speak for Saudi Arabia, although I am certain that Iran treats their women 100x better than the KSA, but there is plenty of criticism toward the Iranian government from their people, and there has been unrest in Iran for a while now. Iran is far more civilized and modernized than a good bit of their neighbors, and a good portion of the educated populace is aware that their government is an abomination. If Iranians were vocal about the government, what do you expect to happen to them? It's not America. They're government is awful and can be ruthless at times. Ironically if not for US intervention back in the day, Iran would have a democracy. But that's a seperate issue.

No one is denying that specific text in the Quran and a combination of a lack of education and instability has led to the formation of these terrorist organizations. But generalizing the entire religion as evil from the west is doing nothing but polarizing the ingroup/outgroup mentality. How can anyone expect normal Muslims to combat extremism if their alleged allies in the west think of their entire religion as scum? How can they put their attention on extremism when they have to worry about the millions of voices around them telling them how much their religion sucks.


If I have a little cousin who beats up Tums little cousin, I would surely punish my cousin. But if I have a cousin who beats up Tums cousin, and Tums and all of Tums relatives tell me that my entire culture and race is evil and has no place in the world, and that my entire family should just get nuked off the earth for the betterment of civilization, it becomes hard to solely punish your cousin and not defend yourself from Tums entire family.

Do you actually believe that such exaggeration is rational discussion?

I
 
Hey man. Curious on your MCAT. Update us when you've got news in the OT thread, ok?

I hear back in about 10 days I believe, I will be sure to let you guys know. Really hoping it went well, longest month of my life.
 
Islamic music? Lol

Islamic art? Lol

Food? I ate at Iranian restaurants in Doha. Nothin special. Not terrible, just nothing special.

Women? The ones society is allowed to see are few and far between.

Next.

You are an Iranian place in Doha, what did you expect. It's like eating Italian food in Germany.

Google hot Persian women and look us in the eye and tell us they aren't attractive.

I've been in the inside of a few famous mosques in Iran and the architecture and design in the interior is phenomenal.
 
You are an Iranian place in Doha, what did you expect. It's like eating Italian food in Germany.

Google hot Persian women and look us in the eye and tell us they aren't attractive.

I've been in the inside of a few famous mosques in Iran and the architecture and design in the interior is phenomenal.

It's all the same food.

Like I said, there are some. Of course we can't see them all due to that amazing Islamic culture.

Cool. Don't give a ****. Though to be fair I don't care about art at all.
 
Islamic music? Lol

Islamic art? Lol

Food? I ate at Iranian restaurants in Doha. Nothin special. Not terrible, just nothing special.

Women? The ones society is allowed to see are few and far between.


Next.

pretty sure a Islam as a religion has no art, don't think they have music either. But Muslims themselves have a wide variety of both. you are lumping the whole religion into one group. We don't group, Italian, French and Spanish cultures together even though they have the same religious back ground. why do you treat Islamic nations and people as one whole?

if you don't like the food, you don't like the food; but you can't deny it exists and makes them unique.

and women was just brought up as a tongue in cheek point. but it has similar results as to their food.
 
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You are an Iranian place in Doha, what did you expect. It's like eating Italian food in Germany.

Google hot Persian women and look us in the eye and tell us they aren't attractive.

I've been in the inside of a few famous mosques in Iran and the architecture and design in the interior is phenomenal.

Don't know about mosque, but I was in Dubai for 4 months and yes, the women are gorgeous. Not fat slobs like we see everyday here in the US.
 
It's all the same food.

Like I said, there are some. Of course we can't see them all due to that amazing Islamic culture.

Cool. Don't give a ****. Though to be fair I don't care about art at all.

Go to LA and you will see plenty of beautiful Persian women.
 

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