The Deportation of Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia

[C-south]

Who is required to answer that when asked? My answer to that question would be "Qué?"

Then the next word you should hear is “adios”.

 

[Majors]

That's the same mindset that believes the Clintons really did have 56 "friends" that committed suicide.

Underrated post

 

[norrislakevol]

I am wondering if the dems will still continue to defend this "Maryland man" as more and more things continue to come out.

 

[joevol33]

I am wondering if the dems will still continue to defend this "Maryland man" as more and more things continue to come out.

With theur dying breath

 

[n_huffhines]

Well, well, well. State rights may win out in the WI judge case.

There is also a constitutional argument that may cut in the judge's favor. In Printz v. United States (1997), the U.S. Supreme Court overruled a provision of the 1993 Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act that required local police to help the feds enforce federal gun control laws. "The Federal Government may neither issue directives requiring the States to address particular problems," declared the majority opinion of Justice Antonin Scalia, "nor command the States' officers, or those of their political subdivisions, to administer or enforce a federal regulatory program." Scalia's opinion was rooted in principles of federalism and the 10th Amendment.

Those same principles, which make it unconstitutional for the feds to commandeer state officials into enforcing federal gun control laws, also make it unconstitutional for the feds to commandeer state officials into enforcing federal immigration laws. And Dugan, as a Milwaukee Circuit Court judge, is a state official.

Why the FBI arrested Judge Hannah Dugan

The Wisconsin judge is charged with obstruction of justice and concealing an undocumented alien to prevent his arrest.

reason.com

 

[SuzyVol]

Without bothering to read your linked article, there is a difference between failure to assist and obstruction.

 

[BeardedVol]

Without bothering to read your linked article, there is a difference between failure to assist and obstruction.

I look forward to the DOJ attorney attempting to make the case for the 'obstruction' charge, given the fact that DEA agents rode down in the same elevator with Ruiz. It's always fun to watch a federal judge destroy an attorney.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.wied.111629/gov.uscourts.wied.111629.1.0.pdf

 

[Orangeslice13]

Without bothering to read your linked article, there is a difference between failure to assist and obstruction.

Exactly what I was about to say

 

[MontyPython]

I am wondering if the dems will still continue to defend this "Maryland man" as more and more things continue to come out.

So you’re good with the Executive Branch defying a Legislative Branch Court Order preventing Garcia’s deportation to El Salvador?

The Trump Administration is currently in contempt of Court.

That is the issue here.

You *do* understand the consequences if your answer is yes?

 

[Ritzwatch]

So you’re good with the Executive Branch defying a Legislative Branch Court Order preventing Garcia’s deportation to El Salvador?

The Trump Administration is currently in contempt of Court.

That is the issue here.

You *do* understand the consequences if your answer is yes?

Nope. Not goo with it. He should NOT have been deported to ES.

He should also never set foot in the US again.

Are you good with ignoring a lawful deportation order to bring him back here?

 

[Orangeslice13]

Nope. Not goo with it. He should NOT have been deported to ES.

He should also never set foot in the US again.

Are you good with ignoring a lawful deportation order to bring him back here?

Hold on.
The order not to deport was issued after he was in the air. The order to tern the plane around was verbal so I’m not sure “should not be deported “ applies but as to the ES part his safety in an ES prison isn’t our problem…but that order, saying he can’t be deported to his home, should have been challenged before shipping him home. Maybe he should have been held in Cuba while that was worked out. Either way there’s a lawful deportation order so he isn’t coming back here. Maybe bring him to Cuba. Then everyone will be happy

 

[MontyPython]

Nope. Not goo with it. He should NOT have been deported to ES.

He should also never set foot in the US again.

Are you good with ignoring a lawful deportation order to bring him back here?

It was not a lawful deportation order. Don’t you understand?

Garcia is in prison for what… tell me.

And yes, absolutely bring him back here. Let’s see your boy idiot Trump put him up to trial.

 

[Ritzwatch]

Hold on.
The order not to deport was issued after he was in the air. The order to tern the plane around was verbal so I’m not sure “should not be deported “ applies but as to the ES part his safety in an ES prison isn’t our problem…but that order, saying he can’t be deported to his home, should have been challenged before shipping him home. Maybe he should have been held in Cuba while that was worked out. Either way there’s a lawful deportation order so he isn’t coming back here. Maybe bring him to Cuba. Then everyone will be happy

I am referencing the October 2019 “withholding of removal” Order that barred his removal to El Salvador. If that order was still in effect, and have not seen that it was not, we shouldn’t have sent him there. Sending him elsewhere, I am fine with.

Am I wrong about the 2019 order? If I am, I’d rather know, so I don’t keep referencing it.

 

[Ritzwatch]

It was not a lawful deportation order. Don’t you understand?

Apparently not.

1. What is unlawful about his deportation?

2. What authority (statute or court order) makes it illegal?

I believe he was deported under AEA. That may turn out to be ruled unlawful by a court, but I am not aware of it having been done so yet. Without that, I don’t see how you can definitively conclude it is unlawful. I agree (see my response to @Orangeslice13, above) that he should not have been sent to ES, but I haven’t seen where he couldn’t be deported, or where he was conclusively due any more process than he has been given.

Show me where it is required, and I would love to see it; I am a process-follower here, not a partisan. I may not like the process, but if it is there, established, it should be followed.

So, show me. Cite authority, not hopes or wishes or preferences, please.

Garcia is in prison for what… tell me.

Have no idea. Not sure why El Salvador put him there/holds him there. Sounds like an El Salvador issue. I am as curious as you. Has he broken any ES laws? I don’t know.

And yes, absolutely bring him back here. Let’s see your boy idiot Trump put him up to trial.

So now you want us to TRY him for something? Dang, you are lost. What do you think he did? I think he was here illegally, and should therefore be deported. That is all.

 

[Orange_Crush]

Well, well, well. State rights may win out in the WI judge case.

There is also a constitutional argument that may cut in the judge's favor. In Printz v. United States (1997), the U.S. Supreme Court overruled a provision of the 1993 Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act that required local police to help the feds enforce federal gun control laws. "The Federal Government may neither issue directives requiring the States to address particular problems," declared the majority opinion of Justice Antonin Scalia, "nor command the States' officers, or those of their political subdivisions, to administer or enforce a federal regulatory program." Scalia's opinion was rooted in principles of federalism and the 10th Amendment.

Those same principles, which make it unconstitutional for the feds to commandeer state officials into enforcing federal gun control laws, also make it unconstitutional for the feds to commandeer state officials into enforcing federal immigration laws. And Dugan, as a Milwaukee Circuit Court judge, is a state official.

Why the FBI arrested Judge Hannah Dugan

The Wisconsin judge is charged with obstruction of justice and concealing an undocumented alien to prevent his arrest.

reason.com

There is a difference in not helping and positively obstructing.

 

[Orangeslice13]

I am referencing the October 2019 “withholding of removal” Order that barred his removal to El Salvador. If that order was still in effect, and have not seen that it was not, we shouldn’t have sent him there. Sending him elsewhere, I am fine with.

Am I wrong about the 2019 order? If I am, I’d rather know, so I don’t keep referencing it.

No. You’re correct and I agreed that he should have been held in Cuba till that order was squashed

His deportation wasn’t illegal just the destination

 

[Ritzwatch]

No. You’re correct and I agreed that he should have been held in Cuba till that order was squashed

Yes, you did say that, I misread that part of your post. I’ve got too many discussions going on in multiple threads right now.

 

[norrislakevol]

So you’re good with the Executive Branch defying a Legislative Branch Court Order preventing Garcia’s deportation to El Salvador?

The Trump Administration is currently in contempt of Court.

That is the issue here.

You *do* understand the consequences if your answer is yes?

I din't care about that guy, I just don't want the piece of garbage in the U.S. anymore. You guys just keep on and keep on wanting to die on this hill; fine with me.

If the administration wants to make El Salvador cough up its citizen, then they can just do the easy thing and make arrangements for another country to take him. Then they can put him on a plane, land in the U.S., and put him on another plane right back out of this country using another deportation statute. That should satisfy the courts.

 

[MontyPython]

Apparently not.

1. What is unlawful about his deportation?

2. What authority (statute or court order) makes it illegal?

I believe he was deported under AEA. That may turn out to be ruled unlawful by a court, but I am not aware of it having been done so yet. Without that, I don’t see how you can definitively conclude it is unlawful. I agree (see my response to @Orangeslice13, above) that he should not have been sent to ES, but I haven’t seen where he couldn’t be deported, or where he was conclusively due any more process than he has been given.

Show me where it is required, and I would love to see it; I am a process-follower here, not a partisan. I may not like the process, but if it is there, established, it should be followed.

So, show me. Cite authority, not hopes or wishes or preferences, please.


Have no idea. Not sure why El Salvador put him there/holds him there. Sounds like an El Salvador issue. I am as curious as you. Has he broken any ES laws? I don’t know.


So now you want us to TRY him for something? Dang, you are lost. What do you think he did? I think he was here illegally, and should therefore be deported. That is all.

Our Supreme Court Order provides all the background you need...

Again, as acknowledged by Trump administration attorneys, Garcia should not have been deported to El Salvador. The folks who did this are now facing potential contempt charges from the District Court judge for their illegal actions.

 

[MontyPython]

I din't care about that guy, I just don't want the piece of garbage in the U.S. anymore. You guys just keep on and keep on wanting to die on this hill; fine with me.

If the administration wants to make El Salvador cough up its citizen, then they can just do the easy thing and make arrangements for another country to take him. Then they can put him on a plane, land in the U.S., and put him on another plane right back out of this country using another deportation statute. That should satisfy the courts.

Nope. That violates a raft of laws. See the Supreme Court ruling on this issue.

You can like the guy or not, but our government wrongly deporting him to a high security prison is just wrong. I'm pretty confident Trump will ultimately be forced to eat crow on this issue, and Garcia will be "undeported" back to the US... and likely tried for his purported MS13 ties.

 

[Orangeburst]

what happened in 2019 that allowed the judge to issue a withholding of removal status?

 

[Ritzwatch]

Our Supreme Court Order provides all the background you need...

Again, as acknowledged by Trump administration attorneys, Garcia should not have been deported to El Salvador. The folks who did this are now facing potential contempt charges from the District Court judge for their illegal actions.

Cool. So you don’t have anything yet which says the deportation itself is unlawful, you only have a court opinion that says the place to which he was deported was a place he should not have been sent.

Which I have already stated over and over.

You MAGA have a strange way of agreeing with others.

 

[norrislakevol]

Nope. That violates a raft of laws. See the Supreme Court ruling on this issue.

You can like the guy or not, but our government wrongly deporting him to a high security prison is just wrong. I'm pretty confident Trump will ultimately be forced to eat crow on this issue, and Garcia will be "undeported" back to the US... and likely tried for his purported MS13 ties.

Unlikely. He will likely never be brought back, even to be deported again. The defense of him looks too bad on the left and the administration knows it. You act like court orders have never been ignored before, not saying it's right, just saying that it is a thing that happens from time to time. The courts cannot compel El Salvador to give him up anyways.

 

[MontyPython]

Cool. So you don’t have anything yet which says the deportation itself is unlawful, you only have a court opinion that says the place to which he was deported was a place he should not have been sent.

Which I have already stated over and over.

You MAGA have a strange way of agreeing with others.

The **** word smithing games you playing here bro. As I have said since the beginning, the deportation of Mr. Garcia to El Salvador was illegal.

Seeing as you hate him so much, bring him back and then to try to deport him again… but oh by the way, he has rights, so he will have his day in court.

Just one last thing… You me, and all other taxpayers in this country are likely going to have to pay Mr. Garcia money as compensation for the illegal deportation of him to a prison in El Salvador. I would say it’s very likely that he will retain an attorney once he returns here and he’s not deported and said Attorney will sue the federal government and they’ll settle for who knows how much. But guess what dude you and me will be paying for it.

 

[MontyPython]

Unlikely. He will likely never be brought back, even to be deported again. The defense of him looks too bad on the left and the administration knows it. You act like court orders have never been ignored before, not saying it's right, just saying that it is a thing that happens from time to time. The courts cannot compel El Salvador to give him up anyways.

Oh, we’ll see if that holds up once the various members of the Trump administration are held in contempt of court. Once they’re held or threatened to be held behind bars, then we’ll see if Mr. Trump can make that call to tell the El presidente to send that ************ back.

Again, whether or not a district court judge has the power to tell Trump how to do his job is not the question here. The question, rather, revolves around the fact that the executive branch is defying the judicial branch. And when that happens, contempt of court follows.