So many doom and gloomers...

[cncchris33]

I humbly disagree, Tennessee has the money and resources to be a basketball powerhouse every year. Recruiting talent in the state has never been better and unlike a lot of power 5 schools, UT has fan support and shows up to the games. Fans have every right to be upset with the performance of this team this season especially after the last two. This team clearly shows Barnes lack of recruiting in 2017 and 2018 and he would have jetted to UCLA last summer if they had paid his buyout, so he doesn't really have any Tennessee loyalty, just a Tennessee paycheck.

No. Coach. Has. Loyalty.

Coaches are loyal to themselves, their families, and their bank accounts. Barnes is 65 years old and has been at Tennessee for 5 of those years. He has no reason to be loyal. The belief that coaches have an emotional loyalty to a school that hired them is silly. It’s a job to them. Fans have a hard time removing the emotion from it, but if you start looking at it as a job, it becomes a lot clearer to see that loyalty has but a small place for coaches, and reasonably so. That school won’t be loyal to the coach if the going gets tough, either. That’s a two-way street.

 

[Zues1]

It's okay to say Rick Barnes had a bad year this year because it's true. It's also okay to say it's his fault, because that is true too. He did a poor job constructing the roster to maintain success beyond the two year run we just had. I think we all hoped for a Pearl like run from him but that's just not in the cards. Pearl is an elite coach that's never had an opportunity at a true basketball power because of personality. There aren't many coaches at his level in the country. The earlier suggestion that he couldn't develop players is laughable as is using Scotty Hopson as an example. Scotty went from 5 to 12 to 17ppg here before leaving early for the NBA. The grossly unfair NCAA penalty against Bruce and the lack of support for him from the Tennessee administration likely cost us a final 4 or two, had Bruce stayed and got a small suspension like Frank Haith did for much worse penalties, or nothing at all like Sean Miller. Wade. Roy Williams, Boeheim etc etc.

All that said, Rick Barnes at least has given us something to look forward to by actually deciding to earn his giant salary on the recruiting trail. Next year should be 22-24 wins and a top 6 NCAA seed. Barring NBA departures, the year after should be Final Four contention.

As for the people saying "Tennessee isn't a good program" in some bizarre defense of Barnes. GTFO. Tennessee is 40th in All Time Wins. 35th when you take out the Ivy League schools and other one bid league schools. We are also top 40 in All Time NCAA appearances when you take out some Ivy League/one bid teams too. That was with it taking us almost 30 years after it started to get our first bid due to the Kentucky factor. Basically no school in the SEC besides Kentucky got NCAA invites. We won the SEC Regular season and tournament twice in the early NCAA era and didn't get bids. Kentucky did the same in the same era and got bids.

In spite of all the crap we've had to face from the very unjust Pearl punishment and bad hires, we've been to 13 of the last 21 NCAA tournaments. People here act like the late Devoe/Wade Houston/Kevin O'Neil era is the normal for Tennessee basketball, it's actually not. We aren't a "Blue Blood" but we are a program that should make the NCAA 7 out of 10 years with the field being 68. Maybe even 8 of 10. We dedicate massive resources to the basketball program, have top flight attendance and play in a conference where a top 6 finish will normally get you a bid. None of those are too high of expectations. Nor is reaching a dang Final Four. People act like we're East Tennessee State talking about a Final Four. Memphis has technically been to the Final Four from the same state and by every metric except how far we've advanced into the NCAAs Tennessee is a better program. We have more money, we have more fans, we have more wins, we have more tournament appearances, we have a real league that gets respect and allows us to earn bids. Should we expect the Final Four in the next 5 years? You're darn right we should and that would apply no matter who the coach was or what his salary was. That is the level of basketball every major D1 p5 program should expect. For goodness sakes Auburn and Texas Tech just did it.

Well stated. I owe you a beer

 

[walkenvol]

1. Pons is a freakish athlete but I can’t see him leaving. He would definitely have to improve his shooting and develop some type of mid range game.

2. JJJ has shown flashes and has a lot potential as an elite defender however I don’t think he leaves either. Needs to work on his offensive game and be more aggressive taking it to the basket.

3. Fulky is pretty much what he is. Not a very good athlete but plays with a lot hustle and heart. He has developed a nice mid range game.

Next years roster should be nasty and I don’t have any concern about making the ncaa tournament.

Didn’t ask if you thought the scenario was likely, asked if it hypothetically were to happen would you be down on CRB about the roster.

The anti- CRB crowd are down on CRB right now about the state of the roster this season. If not for 2 guys leaving early and another bring lost to injury then we would have a very nice roster this year.

 

[calban]

It's okay to say Rick Barnes had a bad year this year because it's true. It's also okay to say it's his fault, because that is true too. He did a poor job constructing the roster to maintain success beyond the two year run we just had. I think we all hoped for a Pearl like run from him but that's just not in the cards. Pearl is an elite coach that's never had an opportunity at a true basketball power because of personality. There aren't many coaches at his level in the country. The earlier suggestion that he couldn't develop players is laughable as is using Scotty Hopson as an example. Scotty went from 5 to 12 to 17ppg here before leaving early for the NBA. The grossly unfair NCAA penalty against Bruce and the lack of support for him from the Tennessee administration likely cost us a final 4 or two, had Bruce stayed and got a small suspension like Frank Haith did for much worse penalties, or nothing at all like Sean Miller. Wade. Roy Williams, Boeheim etc etc.

All that said, Rick Barnes at least has given us something to look forward to by actually deciding to earn his giant salary on the recruiting trail. Next year should be 22-24 wins and a top 6 NCAA seed. Barring NBA departures, the year after should be Final Four contention.

As for the people saying "Tennessee isn't a good program" in some bizarre defense of Barnes. GTFO. Tennessee is 40th in All Time Wins. 35th when you take out the Ivy League schools and other one bid league schools. We are also top 40 in All Time NCAA appearances when you take out some Ivy League/one bid teams too. That was with it taking us almost 30 years after it started to get our first bid due to the Kentucky factor. Basically no school in the SEC besides Kentucky got NCAA invites. We won the SEC Regular season and tournament twice in the early NCAA era and didn't get bids. Kentucky did the same in the same era and got bids.

In spite of all the crap we've had to face from the very unjust Pearl punishment and bad hires, we've been to 13 of the last 21 NCAA tournaments. People here act like the late Devoe/Wade Houston/Kevin O'Neil era is the normal for Tennessee basketball, it's actually not. We aren't a "Blue Blood" but we are a program that should make the NCAA 7 out of 10 years with the field being 68. Maybe even 8 of 10. We dedicate massive resources to the basketball program, have top flight attendance and play in a conference where a top 6 finish will normally get you a bid. None of those are too high of expectations. Nor is reaching a dang Final Four. People act like we're East Tennessee State talking about a Final Four. Memphis has technically been to the Final Four from the same state and by every metric except how far we've advanced into the NCAAs Tennessee is a better program. We have more money, we have more fans, we have more wins, we have more tournament appearances, we have a real league that gets respect and allows us to earn bids. Should we expect the Final Four in the next 5 years? You're darn right we should and that would apply no matter who the coach was or what his salary was. That is the level of basketball every major D1 p5 program should expect. For goodness sakes Auburn and Texas Tech just did it.

.
Nuff said. End of Thread.

 

[MinisterofDef#92]

When the head basketball coach is being paid like he's at Duke I don't think making the NCAA tournament is an unreasonable expectation. Barnes played UT last year and wouldn't have been here had it not been for a buyout hang up. This season is a direct result of lazy recruiting Barnes first 3 years, the team isn't any good but that falls on Barnes.

Your opinion is intellectually LAZY...lol

1) Within his first 3 years at TN, CRB found and successfully recruited several under-rated kids who became stars at UT (e.g., Grant, Bone, Alexander, Turner, Fulkerson, Bowden)
2) Withing his first 3 years at TN, CRB (and the staff he recruited and hired) have achieved superior player development which was highlighted when 4 players off of last year's squad went to the play professionally in the NBA (or the G-league)...no one predicted that when those players walked on campus
3) Within his first 3 years at TN, CRB turned around a power 5 program which just had a .500 season the year before he arrived (I will not even get into the other negative perceptions of our program at the time) and won a regular season championship and made the NCAA tourney (and the team achieved a #1 national ranking the next season)

How do you reconcile your opinion that Barnes was "lazy" recruiting his first 3 yrs with these facts?

 

[Volsfaninva917]

I really can't believe you're missing the message, here. NO ONE believes it is acceptable to miss the tournament. His salary is irrelevant to that discussion. Would you have been any more forgiving if he missed the NCAAT making $3.2 million? And before you disingenuously say "yes", we all no you would be here speeing thus same rhetoric, so spare us the lip service.

His recruiting over the past two years that you are complaining about wasn't going to be fixed in 6 months just because he got a raise. At best, you could hope to see an increased focus and results in the next available recruiting class. That was the first realistic change in expectations. And guess what, he signed a top 5 class.

But that doesn't all for you to bitch and moan about him because you disagree with how you believe he landed his raise in salary, which is what the real crux of the issue is with people like you. Quit complaining about immediate on court results that are no reflection of his raise, and just be honest that you are mad that he makes almost $5 million, because that is what you really dislike. You're lying to yourself if say it's about anything else, and anyone with the slightest bit of intelligence can see right thru it.

If Tennessee misses the NCAAT next year, then we all have something to genuinely complain about regarding his salary.

We are going to revisit this conversation next March and I think you'll be singing a different tune

 

[Volsfaninva917]

Your opinion is intellectually LAZY...lol

1) Within his first 3 years at TN, CRB found and successfully recruited several under-rated kids who became stars at UT (e.g., Grant, Bone, Alexander, Turner, Fulkerson, Bowden)
2) Withing his first 3 years at TN, CRB (and the staff he recruited and hired) have achieved superior player development which was highlighted when 4 players off of last year's squad went to the play professionally in the NBA (or the G-league)...no one predicted that when those players walked on campus
3) Within his first 3 years at TN, CRB turned around a power 5 program which just had a .500 season the year before he arrived (I will not even get into the other negative perceptions of our program at the time) and won a regular season championship and made the NCAA tourney (and the team achieved a #1 national ranking the next season)

How do you reconcile your opinion that Barnes was "lazy" recruiting his first 3 yrs with these facts?

You act like Barnes has taken Tennessee to new heights, when he hasn't.

 

[calban]

Your opinion is intellectually LAZY...lol

1) Within his first 3 years at TN, CRB found and successfully recruited several under-rated kids who became stars at UT (e.g., Grant, Bone, Alexander, Turner, Fulkerson, Bowden)
2) Withing his first 3 years at TN, CRB (and the staff he recruited and hired) have achieved superior player development which was highlighted when 4 players off of last year's squad went to the play professionally in the NBA (or the G-league)...no one predicted that when those players walked on campus
3) Within his first 3 years at TN, CRB turned around a power 5 program which just had a .500 season the year before he arrived (I will not even get into the other negative perceptions of our program at the time) and won a regular season championship and made the NCAA tourney (and the team achieved a #1 national ranking the next season)

How do you reconcile your opinion that Barnes was "lazy" recruiting his first 3 yrs with these facts?

Because, if the team were disbanded today, 5 guys might go to other P5 schools and 5 might red shirt for Hampton. Admit he could have done better with the roster and the discussion ends. it is what it is.

 

[Roustabout]

I’m curious to know who you would replace Barnes with?

Cmon, give me some realistic options.

Where in the fudge did I suggest replacing Barnes?

 

[JettVol]

The best opportunity for this team this year will be, win a couple down the stretch we are picked to lose, try to get to the weekend during the SECT. That might get us to the big dance. Besides those points, Barnes needs to keep next years class intact. If he can do that with a subpar year this year, next year we will be much improved from a talent prospective.

 

[RyanWalkerPGH]

The best opportunity for this team this year will be, win a couple down the stretch we are picked to lose, try to get to the weekend during the SECT. That might get us to the big dance. Besides those points, Barnes needs to keep next years class intact. If he can do that with a subpar year this year, next year we will be much improved from a talent prospective.

Luckily they are all signed. Otherwise I would be a little concerned.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

We are going to revisit this conversation next March and I think you'll be singing a different tune

And there it is; the proof that you are chomping at the bit to bash Barnes, i.e. you are giddy with hope that we don't do well next year.

Go pound sand.

 

[njvols]

College Basketball Coaching Salary and Buyout Database for 2019-20 Season - Stadium

Top 5 Salary to miss the tourney? Look I would be fine with it given the circumstances had Barnes not played UT last spring. He raised the bar here with his demands not the fans.

i get it, but even Calipari has off years...and you could also make the case, that KY is historically under achieving with Cal. I suspect, if we're back in the mix next year, most will give Barnes a "pass" for getting caught with a bad roster for 2020. Ultimately, it's all on Barnes, but Turner injury, Bone going pro, Bowden not having good year...all this should flush out next year. We are just really fortunate that Vescovi came in...can't imagine where we'd be without him..

 

[allvol123]

Barnes is what he is. I am thankful that he took us from the gutter to a place where we expect to complete for conference titles.

That said, he's never really had great success in the tourney. After awhile you just have to understand where you stand.

 

[cncchris33]

We are going to revisit this conversation next March and I think you'll be singing a different tune

Why will I be singing a different tune? Are you predicting we miss the tournament in 20-21? If that were to happen, I have already conceded I'll be first in line to call him to the carpet to answer for such a failure.

The difference between you and I with regard to this issue is perspective. Somehow, you have it in your mind that because of some mathematical formula related to his increased salary, that he was going to automatically make players better versions of themselves in 6 months time, and that was before losing his returning PG. That is just unreasonable, illogical, and ridiculous to the n-th degree. The die was cast for this season before any talk of a raise for Barnes based on our mass personnel losses and lack of experience. How you can’t see that really just baffles me.

Judge him relative to his pay increase starting with the first thing that he had a realistic chance to make an impact on. Start with the 2020 recruiting class and the 20-21 season. He has already knocked the recruiting class out of the park. It remains to be seen what happens with the on court results next season, but if he flops with that kind of talent and misses the tournament, then barring some catastrophic set of circumstances, I’ll be right in line with you calling for some sort of explanation and accountability. I won’t be calling for his head on a pike, just yet, but he will have lost the majority of his good will with me.

 

[livefaith]

And this is why we continue to settle for a **** product. For ****s sake... EXPECT champions. Demand champions.

That's the spirit! I wonder what would happen if every fan base did this?

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Why will I be singing a different tune? Are you predicting we miss the tournament in 20-21? If that were to happen, I have already conceded I'll be first in line to call him to the carpet to answer for such a failure.

The difference between you and I with regard to this issue is perspective. Somehow, you have it in your mind that because of some mathematical formula related to his increased salary, that he was going to automatically make players better versions of themselves in 6 months time, and that was before losing his returning PG. That is just unreasonable, illogical, and ridiculous to the n-th degree. The die was cast for this season before any talk of a raise for Barnes based on our mass personnel losses and lack of experience. How you can’t see that really just baffles me.

Judge him relative to his pay increase starting with the first thing that he had a realistic chance to make an impact on. Start with the 2020 recruiting class and the 20-21 season. He has already knocked the recruiting class out of the park. It remains to be seen what happens with the on court results next season, but if he flops with that kind of talent and misses the tournament, then barring some catastrophic set of circumstances, I’ll be right in line with you calling for some sort of explanation and accountability. I won’t be calling for his head on a pike, just yet, but he will have lost the majority of his good will with me.

Pretty clear he's hoping we fail so he can dance and sing about how right he was.

 

[Volsfaninva917]

And there it is; the proof that you are chomping at the bit to bash Barnes, i.e. you are giddy with hope that we don't do well next year.

Go pound sand.

Awww does that make you feel better about yourself? I'm not pulling against Barnes at all however I do feel he's ripping UT off. I don't need a reason or special circumstances to bash anyone, I just will when I want to. But I get it, it hurts your feelings because he signed your hat and now you would drink his bathwater.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

.

How much does it typically cost to be #1 in the AP poll for a month (and just the 2nd time in history) and to sign one of the highest ranked group of recruits ever?

 

[terrypedigo]

I don't understand why fans are so upset. Tennessee has never been a great basketball program in its history. We've had a couple years here and there but fans act like we are Duke. Just appreciate what we had the last two years realize the next two has potential and stop acting like Tennessee basketball has always been something special.

I can remember years when i didn't know who the coach was, that's how big a power house our basketball program has been over the year's, now let the BASHING begin but it's the truth, every few year's we make the sweet 16, and a chance at the elite 8 and the fan's think we are UCLA of the 60's, we got a chance at becoming a decent program, but we will never be KENTUCKY, just like they will be us in FOOTBALL, YES THEY WILL HAVE A GOOD YEAR, but they will never compete year in and year out, just that simple.

 

[HalfullVol]

I don't understand why fans are so upset. Tennessee has never been a great basketball program in its history. We've had a couple years here and there but fans act like we are Duke. Just appreciate what we had the last two years realize the next two has potential and stop acting like Tennessee basketball has always been something special.

How DARE you come up in here spouting all this rational thinking

OFF WITH HIS HEAD!!

 

[cncchris33]

I can remember years when i didn't know who the coach was, that's how big a power house our basketball program has been over the year's, now let the BASHING begin but it's the truth, every few year's we make the sweet 16, and a chance at the elite 8 and the fan's think we are UCLA of the 60's, we got a chance at becoming a decent program, but we will never be KENTUCKY, just like they will be us in FOOTBALL, YES THEY WILL HAVE A GOOD YEAR, but they will never compete year in and year out, just that simple.

Mostly agree. I think there is a better chance we become an annual factor in basketball than UK does in basketball. The talent gap at the top is just so much bigger on the football side.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

Once Barnes retires for good, you better hope Fulmer dishes out a truck load of money for a proven Basketball coach because Tony Bennett, Jay Wright, Bill Self, Chris Beard, Tom Izzo, those proven coaches aren’t leaving their jobs to come here.

Replacing a HOF coach will not be an easy task unless you want to take a chance on an up & comer.

 

[Maybe next year]

When the head basketball coach is being paid like he's at Duke I don't think making the NCAA tournament is an unreasonable expectation. Barnes played UT last year and wouldn't have been here had it not been for a buyout hang up. This season is a direct result of lazy recruiting Barnes first 3 years, the team isn't any good but that falls on Barnes.

 

[Thunder Good-Oil]

TN actually has a very good, nearly great, basketball history. TN was #2 behind Kentucky for decades while the NCAAT was a one-team-per-conference event. TN didn't close the gap with KY like the one between Duke and UNC was, so the wealth wasn't shared. Also, once the NCAAT did take more than one team, teams weren't seeded. TN was one of the best teams in the country in the 1940s and during the Mears run in the 60s and 70s. There just wasn't the same level of interest with national TV exposure so TN didn't cash in on the success.

TN had some unfortunate draws with their elite teams in the 70s. Most damaging though was that Dickey and Lamar made horrible decisions as the NCAAT was exploding. TN was in the abyss for the better part of 2 decades which scarred the program. It takes time to build up a program from the depths of Wade, KO, Buzz, Donnie, and even the damage inflicted by Bruce. Barnes is exactly what's needed right now. It appears that he's building substantial momentum and it will be a very attractive situation for the coach that he will hand it off to when he retires. Probably better than what Devoe and Pearl stepped into. Possibly the best ever.