Shooting at a church in Sutherland springs Texas

#101
#101
orangepridenation said:
No they don't. It's just a right wing talking point so you act like they do.
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I’m not religious, I’m agnostic.


Devout atheists crack me up. They’re already proving my point in this thread.

Also, you’ll need to point out this right wing talking point about devout atheists. I haven’t heard it.
 
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#102
#102
K-town Vol Fan said:
Looks like he legally purchased the gun from Academy Sports.

So if you're kicked out of the Air Force for assaulting your wife and child you can still go out and buy an AR no questions asked.

And people say we don't need stricter gun laws.
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Question 11.g on the 4473 asks if you have ever been discharged from the armed forces under dishonorable conditions. If he had, then he lied on the form. That is punishable by 10 years in prison and up to a $250k fine.

Why is it people with bad intentions won’t follow the rules?
 
#104
#104
armchair said:
Crazies on the loose...
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#107
#107
DancingOutlaw said:
Question 11.g on the 4473 asks if you have ever been discharged from the armed forces under dishonorable conditions. If he had, then he lied on the form. That is punishable by 10 years in prison and up to a $250k fine.

Why is it people with bad intentions won’t follow the rules?
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He lied on the form? So we have to count on people to tell the truth when they are purchasing a gun such as this? This is so flawed and messed up its ridiculous. Why would someone admit to something they know will DQ them from buying the gun? Of course they are going to lie. Give me a ****ing break. You think he cared about a fine and 10 yrs in prison for lying on a dumb form when he was planning on doing this?
 
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#108
#108
K-town Vol Fan said:
He lied on the form? So we have to count on people to tell the truth when they are purchasing a gun such as this? This is so flawed and messed up its ridiculous. Why would someone admit to something they know will DQ them from buying the gun? Of course they are going to lie. Give me a ****ing break. You think he cared about a fine and 10 yrs in prison for lying on a dumb form when he was planning on doing this?
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Lol you are not helping your case at all. Welcome to the dark side.
 
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#110
#110
K-town Vol Fan said:
He lied on the form? So we have to count on people to tell the truth when they are purchasing a gun such as this? This is so flawed and messed up its ridiculous. Why would someone admit to something they know will DQ them from buying the gun? Of course they are going to lie. Give me a ****ing break. You think he cared about a fine and 10 yrs in prison for lying on a dumb form when he was planning on doing this?
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The application form that San Bernardino terrorist Tashfeen Malik would have used to apply for her visa to enter the United States asks such questions as, “Do you seek to engage in terrorist activities while in the United States or have you ever engaged in terrorist activities?”

“Are you a member or representative of a terrorist organization,” asks another question, to which the Pakistani citizen would have been required to check a “yes” or “no” box.

“Have you ever or do you intend to provide financial assistance or other support to terrorists or terrorist organizations?” asks a third, along with similar questions relating to espionage, human trafficking, money laundering, prostitution and other offenses.

According to the State Department Malik, who with her U.S.-born husband Syed Farook killed 14 people in last Tuesday’s attack at a social services center in San Bernardino, entered the U.S. in July 2014 on a K-1 fiancé(e) visa.
 
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#111
#111
When we are relying on criminals to tell the truth when they purchase guns and dont even vet their answers something is clearly broken.
 
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#112
#112
K-town Vol Fan said:
When we are relying on criminals to tell the truth when they purchase guns and dont even vet their answers something is clearly broken.
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I've read that his discharge was a "bad conduct" discharge not a dishonorable one.
 
#113
#113
K-town Vol Fan said:
When we are relying on criminals to tell the truth when they purchase guns and dont even vet their answers something is clearly broken.
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Well it’s kind of like we rely on them to not go in gun free zones.

Or possess a firearm if they’re a felon.

Or possess magazines over a certain capacity.

Or possess a gun that is banned in their state.

Or have a loaded weapon in their car when the state doesn’t allow it.

Or shoot and murder innocent people.

It’s weird that they won’t follow the rules. We probably need more rules.
 
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#114
#114
DancingOutlaw said:
Well it’s kind of like we rely on them to not go in gun free zones.

Or possess a firearm if they’re a felon.

Or possess magazines over a certain capacity.

Or possess a gun that is banned in their state.

Or have a loaded weapon in their car when the state doesn’t allow it.

Or shoot and murder innocent people.

It’s weird that they won’t follow the rules. We probably need more rules.
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No, we need better background checks on any person who purchases a firearm. Enough of this "check this box if you're a criminal." As if they would ever check yes.
 
#115
#115
Do we know when the weapon was purchased?

Before or after his short time in the Air Force?
 
#117
#117
armchair said:
Atheists have rational thought on their side. I don't see a purple elephant standing in my back yard; therefore, I will assert that there is no purple elephant back there.

Religious zealots are irrational. They see a purple elephant in the back yard because they want to see one, even though there is no purple elephant in the back yard. And then they go around the neighborhood, and the town, and the state, and the world, TELLING EVERYBODY: "Listen, there is a purple elephant in my back yard! And you've probably got one in your back yard too! I can't see him--and you won't either--but I know he's there and if I give you this book full of 2nd grade stories, you will believe in the purple elephant too. And it's important to remember that the purple elephant loves you. And if you get run over by a truck tomorrow, or kidnapped and killed, well, it's because that's the will of the purple elephant. But don't worry, if that happens, we will all say prayers for you....to the purple elephant. And if you believe all this, then after you die, you'll go to a wonderful place in the clouds and eat TV dinners for eternity--and no one will care! Oh, it's heaven. DO believe in the purple elephant, sir!"

Religious folks are humorous.
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I'm your huckleberry. Start a thread and we'll test your rationality.
 
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#118
#118
n_huffhines said:
Can't it be both? He used a tragedy to call me out with a lie about me. I guess he gets to say whatever and I have to keep quiet?
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No. If it was about your personal integrity, you could have called him out about your personal integrity as opposed to first claiming it was about the poor dead church people.

If it was about politicizing poor dead church people, you could have called harmless_chair out for politicizing poor dead church people as well.
 
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#119
#119
messed up situation. thoughts and prayers to those involved. reading the age of the dead ranges from 5 to 72.
 
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#120
#120
Orange_Crush said:
No. If it was about your personal integrity, you could have called him out about your personal integrity as opposed to first claiming it was about the poor dead church people.
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You don't know what you're talking about. I called him out for the lie and for politicizing the tragedy in my first response:

n_huffhines said:
Flat out lie. Politicizing a tragedy is your first move. You have no honor.
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If it was about politicizing poor dead church people, you could have called harmless_chair out for politicizing poor dead church people as well.
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I didn't read armchair's posts. GTFO with your judgement. You don't even know what's been said in this short convo.
 
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#121
#121
K-town Vol Fan said:
No, we need better background checks on any person who purchases a firearm. Enough of this "check this box if you're a criminal." As if they would ever check yes.
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He received a bad conduct discharge from the AF so he was legally able to purchase firearms.

Two officials who spoke to The Associated Press on the condition of anonymity identified the gunman as Devin Kelley. An Air Force spokeswoman said records confirm Kelley received a bad conduct discharge after being court-martialed in 2012 for assaulting his spouse and child.
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#122
#122
You folks have a nice day. I'm leaving the beach early and heading back to Tennessee. My father-in-law is not doing well with his bladder cancer, and my wife needs help. Gotta go.
 
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#125
#125
K-town Vol Fan said:
No, we need better background checks on any person who purchases a firearm. Enough of this "check this box if you're a criminal." As if they would ever check yes.
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This is the problem though. I advise you not to expend energy fretting over why criminals won’t follow the rules. It’s a waste of your time. You want to codify morality, and it won’t work. The background check doesn’t stop many people, not because it isn’t effective but because the vast majority filling out a 4473 aren’t people who would fail it. The same way a gun free zone sign will stop a carry permit holder, but not some nutjob who wants to murder his ex. Locks only keep honest men out. People get spun up trying to autopsy the crime and what could be different. But most of the time what they decide is the root cause or an aggravating factor already has a law designed to criminalize that very thing. So eventually you wind up at “ban guns”, which in theory would work if criminals followed the rules. Which we have already established they don’t.
 
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