Roster Construction Doomed This Team

#51
#51
GSPVol said:
Problem is that Estrella has his Houdini side. He can amaze you one moment and disappear the next. Right now this team needs all the rest it can get. We recover our legs and get a favorable matchup and we might get out of the first weekend. Considering our offensive liabilities, that would be a heckuva season for this challenged roster.
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When JP’s been healthy, his “Houdini side” is being sitting on the bench. In the NCAA tournament I’m playing him till he fouls out. He’s our only effective offensive post player - Brown’s a freshman and is a bit short, Felix is a defender &dunker, and what can you say about Carey.
 
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#52
#52
This team is full of “almost” players. We only have two guys that are scoring threats. Everyone else is just catching the ball to get rid of it. The opposition knows this, and it doesn’t put any pressure on them defensively.

For example, at the end of the Alabama game in Knoxville, with 15 seconds left and no Ament, Alabama knew Gillespie was the only guy on the court that would even consider shooting the ball. When it’s a certainty that the 6’1” dude is taking the shot, it’s not difficult to force a low percentage shot.

I like CRB, but take out the year we hit on DK, and we’ve seen 7 years of consistently average to below average offensive basketball.
 
#53
#53
LibertyVol said:
Ament is slow, does not handle the ball well and is an inconsistent outside shooter. I believe he will struggle in the NBA.
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Compare Ament’s play from 3 months ago to the healthy Ament in the second half of conference play. Compare Ament’s body from when he signed to today. He’s a physically late maturing teenager and far from a finished product. I have no clue how well he will do in the NBA, but I’m confident there will be a much better version of the current Ament in 2-3 years to base that decision on. Guess we’ll see what the professionals think when draft time rolls around.
 
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#54
#54
cbrown said:
This team is full of “almost” players. We only have two guys that are scoring threats. Everyone else is just catching the ball to get rid of it. The opposition knows this, and it doesn’t put any pressure on them defensively.

For example, at the end of the Alabama game in Knoxville, with 15 seconds left and no Ament, Alabama knew Gillespie was the only guy on the court that would even consider shooting the ball. When it’s a certainty that the 6’1” dude is taking the shot, it’s not difficult to force a low percentage shot.

I like CRB, but take out the year we hit on DK, and we’ve seen 7 years of consistently average to below average offensive basketball.
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Simply not true
 
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#55
#55
VOLATNES said:
I feel like Henderson has a lot of upside. Feel like he showed he can run the point with experience. Feel like he and Evans with time and work this summer can improve a ton. Don’t see Boswell leaving due to his defensive abilities. He’s a Barnes type player like Mashack and some others. I don’t mind a player like Carey, but we had to rely on him too much and his game is so limited. His FT shooting killed us though. Bring in some more SGs and another solid PG and this is different team with good pieces. I never understood Barnes rotation all year. It constantly changes, even now. There was never any flow to it. Kids would sit for weeks. Then all of a sudden they play 20 mins.
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And roll the dice that you can reallocate Carey’s $NIL to find a better post player.
 
#56
#56
zjcvols said:
This isn’t feasibly possible in college basketball anymore. I can’t name one P4 team that returned 8 experienced players from last years team
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Didn’t read it all?

“ NIL and immediate transfers have changed the landscape. I’m glad that we have the current staff with the track record to manage this mess of NCAA basketball as well as they have been”
 
#57
#57
Dougie_D said:
It’s called losing out on your fantasy football draft . I think we thought Abrams , Burg , and even Boswell were going to be like Lanier , Vescovi, and Gainey. Ament has shown flashes to be like Knecht. Gillispie can be our ZZ at times too
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Nobody on this forum was talking up Boswell in the preseason
 
#58
#58
walkenvol said:
And roll the dice that you can reallocate Carey’s $NIL to find a better post player.
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Money aside. I don’t mind Carey. I like the physicalness he brings and the trash rebounds/points he grabs. Sort of a Rodman type player. Some games this year he was the only one not getting bullied, which isn’t Barnes style of play. But he has some things that make him a liability when things aren’t going right. I feel like if he was on a team with Knecht or Lanier type player he wouldn’t be bad.
 
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#60
#60
zjcvols said:
This isn’t feasibly possible in college basketball anymore. I can’t name one P4 team that returned 8 experienced players from last years team
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The definition of experienced is the question, teams returned 8+ guys, but no, they weren’t all 20+mpg guy. But yes, returning 4-5 key pieces and adding in 2-3 new key pieces seems to be the best strategy.

It’s where I think returning 6-7 of our eligible 9, and adding 3 transfers on top of 3 freshman is ideal.
 
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#62
#62
bleedingTNorange said:
The definition of experienced is the question, teams returned 8+ guys, but no, they weren’t all 20+mpg guy. But yes, returning 4-5 key pieces and adding in 2-3 new key pieces seems to be the best strategy.

It’s where I think returning 6-7 of our eligible 9, and adding 3 transfers on top of 3 freshman is ideal.
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To me this is my focus:

Gotta Keep
Estrella
Brown
Evans
Boswell
Henderson

On The Fence
Phillips
Massamba

Go On Git
Carey
Burg

Then get a real PG, a wing shooter and a stretch 4. I’m fine bringing Phillips back if they add an actual stretch 4. If they think Massamba actually is something, I’m fine bringing him back. But I don’t Carey 2.0 (or bring back Carey)
 
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#65
#65
zjcvols said:
To me this is my focus:

Gotta Keep
Estrella
Brown
Evans
Boswell
Henderson

On The Fence
Phillips
Massamba

Go On Git
Carey
Burg

Then get a real PG, a wing shooter and a stretch 4. I’m fine bringing Phillips back if they add an actual stretch 4. If they think Massamba actually is something, I’m fine bringing him back. But I don’t Carey 2.0 (or bring back Carey)
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Agree with your list. Boswell should be a 6th man defense energy guy off the bench. If Brown and Evans take sophomore leap could see both starting with Estrella.

Barnes should be hitting portal for 2 starting guard spots if he has any aspirations of being top 25 team next year.
 
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#66
#66
A lot of posters have said all of this stuff already, but...

There's another reason for optimism here. Even though this year (not over yet) feels like a disappointment so far, it has allowed Estrella, Brown, Evans, Boswell, and Henderson to really develop imo. If Boswell or Evans (other one starts)/Brown/Phillips/Henderson can be the 6-9 spots next year with the amount of experience they've had this season (and last season for Cade) and improvement of another offseason/year older, if Estrella can use this year to continue progressing to being an elite post presence and better at defense, and if we can bring in a good PG, actual SG (they really did try this past offseason, just got unlucky), and legitimate stretch 4 as other posters have suggested... that's a real recipe for success.
 
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#67
#67
VOLATNES said:
Money aside. I don’t mind Carey. I like the physicalness he brings and the trash rebounds/points he grabs. Sort of a Rodman type player. Some games this year he was the only one not getting bullied, which isn’t Barnes style of play. But he has some things that make him a liability when things aren’t going right. I feel like if he was on a team with Knecht or Lanier type player he wouldn’t be bad.
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Except Rodman was athletic and could jump. Carey can't move and his vertical is embarrassing for a big man on a P4 roster. His negatives far outweigh any positives. Lack of athleticism, lack of vertical, can't shoot, can't hit FTs, and he's a hothead that lets his temper get to him. If he did anything good consistently that may outweigh other negatives but he really does nothing well.

He'd be better off at an OVC type school.
 
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#68
#68
zjcvols said:
To me this is my focus:

Gotta Keep
Estrella
Brown
Evans
Boswell
Henderson

On The Fence
Phillips
Massamba

Go On Git
Carey
Burg

Then get a real PG, a wing shooter and a stretch 4. I’m fine bringing Phillips back if they add an actual stretch 4. If they think Massamba actually is something, I’m fine bringing him back. But I don’t Carey 2.0 (or bring back Carey)
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Carey is really the only one I absolutely don’t wanna see back, I realize 1-2 more probably gotta go, but again I’m good with whatever as long as we can bring in at least 3
 
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#69
#69
walkenvol said:
When JP’s been healthy, his “Houdini side” is being sitting on the bench. In the NCAA tournament I’m playing him till he fouls out. He’s our only effective offensive post player - Brown’s a freshman and is a bit short, Felix is a defender &dunker, and what can you say about Carey.
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He's a load.
 
#70
#70
Flogballs said:
I thought Awaka left because he had serious problems with Carr. Then Carr ended up leaving anyway
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First I’ve heard of that. I heard the staff knew of the Aidoo transfer to Arkansas, but were caught completely flat footed on Awaka. Dude’s gonna make a Final Four.

Carr, despite his offense, I get. He was never going to fit with Barnes. But, that speaks more to Barnes’ inflexibility.

Barnes has and will win a lot of games. Sadly, there is a ceiling to his style and his long career proves that to be the case.
 
#71
#71
VolsNetClippers2025 said:
A lot of posters have said all of this stuff already, but...

There's another reason for optimism here. Even though this year (not over yet) feels like a disappointment so far, it has allowed Estrella, Brown, Evans, Boswell, and Henderson to really develop imo. If Boswell or Evans (other one starts)/Brown/Phillips/Henderson can be the 6-9 spots next year with the amount of experience they've had this season (and last season for Cade) and improvement of another offseason/year older, if Estrella can use this year to continue progressing to being an elite post presence and better at defense, and if we can bring in a good PG, actual SG (they really did try this past offseason, just got unlucky), and legitimate stretch 4 as other posters have suggested... that's a real recipe for success.
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Estrella can be a really dominant inside scorer but he will never make it there if we don't get legitimate scorers from the outside.

he's about the only player on this team that should be a legit threat to return as a starter.

the others are good bench players but should not be starting 5 without greatly improved shooting.

we also need a guy to replace okpara on defense.
 
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#72
#72
zjcvols said:
To me this is my focus:

Gotta Keep
Estrella
Brown
Evans
Boswell
Henderson

On The Fence
Phillips
Massamba

Go On Git
Carey
Burg

Then get a real PG, a wing shooter and a stretch 4. I’m fine bringing Phillips back if they add an actual stretch 4. If they think Massamba actually is something, I’m fine bringing him back. But I don’t Carey 2.0 (or bring back Carey)
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I don’t think Henderson is back, and have heard there’s already a landing place. He’s way more skilled than Boswell, but not as big and not getting those back up PG minutes late in the year, sends a message.

Phillips was ready to take a step. Surgery should have happened at the end of last season. I can’t imagine he won’t be back. Same for Estrella. If you can keep Estrella, Phillips and Brown, and more importantly get them fully healthy, you’ve really got something. Barnes will have to totally rebuild the rest as you’re losing all your scoring.

Boswell will help, but if Barnes plans on keeping him in the mid 20s and up on minutes, we’re done. Burg? That is experiment bombed. His offensive game was nonexistent and crumbles under any ball pressure. I’d say you have 5 return (Boswell, Evans and the 3 bigs). The rest you’re going to the portal, plus the signees, none of which move the needle for me. All development.

I think we’re still involved with Rice.
 
#75
#75
zjcvols said:
I was going to save this for after the season, but I'm pretty annoyed with that loss. The roster construction was really bad this year. Honestly, the historic offensive rebounding & Nate Ament turning into a lottery pick the second half of the season is the only reason they were able to be top 25 and get a top 6 seed in the tourney this year.

I don't understand why after having a small ball/stretch 4 the last two years (JJJ, then Milicic) they went after Jaylen Carey with Okpara, Phillips, and Estrella already on the team. Ament is designed to play the 4 in college. I don't get why they thought having an undersized, non-vertical 4 with zero skills and bad defense would be beneficial to the team. Imaging having a ball mover like JJJ or a stretch 4 like Milicic getting his minutes and that's probably worth 3-4 wins. I'm not blaming Carey completely, this was just a bad fit.

And while we make mistakes in recruiting/transfer portal, I don't know what the staff saw that made them think Abram & Burg would be contributors this year (more specifically Abram). Both are 23 year olds and they gave up on Abram in December. Burg finally looked like he can play competent minutes in late February. If they were freshman, I wouldn't worry about it. But they asked way too much offensively of Boswell & Evans this year. That's pretty bad scouting by the staff. Ament and Gillespie had zero space to work with this year and it really hurt both their games, they were not able to fulfill their potential this year IMO. I'm more annoyed by Carey than Abram/Burg, but it still needs to be pointed out.

I hope that the staff understands the value of having more shooting. I know they were surprised by Cameron Carr leaving in the middle of December last year and that put them behind the 8 ball a little bit (God, it's really a shame it didn't work out with him) in terms of their shooting. I know they were outbid for a couple high end shooters in last year's portal, that will happen. But I honestly do not want to watch another offense like this again. And sure, not having Zakai as a steady hand and Gillespie played way too much on the ball, but they did nothing to help him out this year. I'm not worried about the program long-term, I'm actually really excited about what Boswell, Evans, Estrella and Brown can be next year. But they cannot have as many misses as they did this year. They must focus on getting real shooting answers in the portal.
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I agree with these overall thoughts. You’ve done a good job with the assessment of individual players so here are some of my thoughts on an overall level:

1. We missed ZZ, Mashack and Gainey more than we could have imagined. The Awaka and Carr defections notwithstanding, no one on this squad possesses that “refuse to lose” mindset. I think Ament showed flashes when he put the team on his back. Everyone loves to win but there are certain people who hate losing more than they like winning and I don’t see that.

2. Guard play- the lack of a scoring 2 guard has been covered at length. I’m talking about perimeter & on ball defense. Someone else can cover the Xs and Os of ball screen defense, etc but all I know is Duke Miles yesterday was the latest example of an opposing guard going nuclear on us, especially when we need stops late in the game and can’t get them ( see Philon during the last 5-6 minutes of the Alabama game).

3. NCAA Tournament success normally comes down to matchups, guard play and getting a fortuitous bounce or two. I don’t trust this team to be consistent. You never know when they will have that “crap the bed” game with missed free throws, turnovers/ unforced errors, mental lapses, etc.

I always tell myself to quit being so emotionally vested in this team but, having said all this, I’ll still be anxiously watching next week.
 
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