Reasons to think Coach Josh Heupel will move us forward

[DERELICK_MY_VOLS]

To be fair, LSU had a BUNCH of their D not playing in that game and Burrow also put up almost 400yds passing.

Certainly UCF punched above their weight in that game but they weren't magical. LSU was missing a lot of their D line and some secondary.

To be fair.....the talent level wasn't even on the same page until maybe you hit LSU's 3rd string with pure youth/no experience.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

To be fair.....the talent level wasn't even on the same page until maybe you hit LSU's 3rd string with pure youth/no experience.

I get wanting to lionize CJH because we hope he'll be "the guy" but along with that let's recall that he was an "out of left field" hire that wasn't on the radar.

When we were tossing around Freeze, Franklin, Campbell, Christobal, etc his name wasn't bounced around..... wasn't even thought of. It's great to be positive about a coach, but it's not like we had to outbid Auburn for his services.

 

[Remy]

So many on here forget what Heupel did against LSU. The same LSU squad that had the 15th ranked total defense that season I believe it was that year. The same LSU roster that one the NC the following season. He put up 32 points in 15:29 seconds. LSU sat on the ball for 3 quarters. That was with UCF level talent against a roster of 4-5* future NFL draft pics. That’s some f’n coaching. He needs some defense to match his offense.

So, you're saying they beat LSU that game, or not?

 

[VolunteerCeltic]

I for one am tired of coaching searches and complete meltdowns of Volnation. CJH may or may not be a good coach here, at this point I would lean towards he will be gone in a couple of years.

 

[Vol$_Deep_11_9]

Without reading through the entire thread I will say that I like what I’ve heard from the staff so far, they don’t put these kids down even when talking about mistakes that are being made and what not. I want to think we might have a good one, I thought it with Butch and Pruitt. Regardless I think the whole idea that he’ll be gone in two years or sort of redundant. We don’t need that, he will, like everybody else have to have time and depending on how hard the NCAA hits us, he’s gonna get his 4 years. I like everything I’ve read and seen about his offense, which is the way the game has shifted. His 4 years IMO, are going to depend on his defensive staff and, of course, how well he can recruit. I’m at the point where it don’t matter to me who the coach is, just win. The Pruitt Era had its good moments and plenty of bad/awful. Going to be patient with Heupel.

 

[Envolronment]

I think that since the NCAA violations are an unknown at this point, trying to judge his recruiting so far is a wasted exercise. He played and coached at Oklahoma when they beat Alabama under Saban in a bowl game. So, he knows the best teams have to have talent.
He has an identity as a head coach. The last 4 coaches didn't really have that. Especially Pruitt. He knows what he wants to do both offensively and defensively. Now I have watched a lot of game film on UCF on the past 3 seasons and I did think that his in game decision not to kick the field goal against Pitt late in the 4th quarter probably cost them the game. But on the whole, he is smooth and makes fast, good, well thought through decisions. I am encouraged about us moving forward because he has a vision and he has used it before with a lot of success as a head coach. 28 - 8 with 3 bowl appearances in 3 years as a head coach is more impressive than any resume coming from a head coach hire that we have had since Johnny Majors.

 

[wmcovol]

1) he can coach offense and in today's college game you GOTTA be able to score
2) He has hired a good staff, very good in fact. Much better than the last 3 new HCs in my opinion.
3) He's not full of himself (Dooley), full of cliques (Jones) or full of $hit (Pruitt)

 

[sjt18]

I agree with you. Before that can happen however, we need the other SEC programs to slide downward as they were in the 90’s.

It all cycles. Saban will be 70 this fall. I'm personally not sure that Smart is good enough on gameday for UGA to take that last step. UT is looking up at UF but they haven't won the SEC since 2008. UT really missed a prime opportunity when Mizzou won the East. They were a product of UGA, UF, and UT being down more than them being really good. If UT improves then there will be opportunities to compete for the SEC.

Another thing to like about Heupel assuming the O does work as good at UT as it did at UCF and Mizzou is that it will attract really good offensive players. Guys want opportunities to showcase their ability.

 

[sjt18]

Interesting point. CJH has faced 4 P5 teams and is 2-2 as a HC. The results are:

2019
vs Stanford (W) 45-14
vs LSU (L) 32-40

2020
vs Stanford (W) 45-27
vs Pitt (L) 34-35

Right now I don't think there's anyone who can accurately predict how CJH will do in the SEC.

True statement though historically UCF wouldn't have been in any of those games much less won two or 3.

And I don't think years 1-3 at UT will be much of an indication of what kind of HC he might become.

Doesn't really matter. If he doesn't win games and prove he can coach within 3 years then he won't get recruits. If he doesn't get recruits then keeping him longer than 3 years just depletes your roster further. Jones underperformed his first 3 rosters. No one at UT had the courage to say the Emperor had no clothes... so they kept him. His recruiting fell off because opposing recruiters and players could see what well paid administrators couldn't- the guy is an empty suit.

Heupel has to produce something on the field that he can sell to recruits. The offense should be an easy sell. Defense is a big question mark.

My best guess is that he's a Mark Richt type who will need to learn to hire a great defensive coordinator and allow that guy to run the defense.

There's nothing about the guy that suggests he's anything like Richt. He may fail. He may fail badly. But his hands are all over the O and he appears to be very involved in the D from a "strategic" level.

Banks might be the guy but recruiting players at UT will be challenging for a couple of years.

If UT's O is as exciting as the ones he produced at UCF and Mizzou then getting offensive talent won't be a problem. Defense could definitely be a problem if their goal of being a big play D doesn't work.

They have publicly and repeatedly talked about what they were going to do on O AND playing an attacking style of defense. Both of those things are attractive to recruits. To make this work then he needs success not just in the first 3 years but in the first year. He's already a class behind because of the timing of his hire. Success isn't necessarily winning the East at this point. Success could be 7 or 8 wins and looking like he belongs on the field with the top tier of the SEC.

Heupel lacks the obvious advantages that Smart has at UGA. But he by all accounts is a very good leader and extremely intelligent. Very likely more intelligent than Kirby. No guarantee of success by any stretch of the imagination... but a better starting place than a hammerhead like Pruitt.

 

[AstonRoyal]

He seems to be of dependably good character. Guys can trust him.

Probably the biggest thing you didn't mention is "culture". The language of the coaching staff is positive even when critical. Everything is said and done with an expectation of a good outcome even if there are setbacks. The players are starting to parrot the positivity.

Kiffin had his guys believing. He didn't stay... but his guys had confidence that they could compete and that they would become a good team. Dooley tried feebly but just got swallowed up. He wasn't totally effective in choosing his staff either. Jones "tried"... but he's a used car salesman and people figure that out pretty quick.

Pruitt is just a negative guy. It is one of the reasons he has no business being a HC. He deflates people. The worse the pressure got... the worse he seemed to get.

We've all had different managers. Some cause you to want to give up and lose hope. Some are just as honest with their criticism but make you leave feeling like overcoming your problems is a future certainty. Pruitt appears to be the former. Hopefully Heupel is and will remain the latter.

Both positivity and negative coaching can work. Nick Saban is known to be pretty harsh and critical, kind of where Pruitt gets it from.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Unlike out former coaches, he's yet to coach a single down at UT, and some on here are already spewing nonsense about how we are going to hit 9 wins, and how Heupel is going to be a top SEC coach in no time.

All this, without him coaching, one single down of football yet at UT.

Yeah but we do that with every coach.

 

[Rickyvol77]

Unlike out former coaches, he's yet to coach a single down at UT, and some on here are already spewing nonsense about how we are going to hit 9 wins, and how Heupel is going to be a top SEC coach in no time.

All this, without him coaching, one single down of football yet at UT.

And some are ignorantly saying that his success at Mizzou and UCF means nothing and he will never be an elite coach and he will be gone in 4 years....
All this, without him coaching, one single down of football yet at UT

 

[sjt18]

Both positivity and negative coaching can work. Nick Saban is known to be pretty harsh and critical, kind of where Pruitt gets it from.

Only if it produces player confidence. I'm not sure exactly how Saban brings his guys back to believing they can do anything... but he does. My old HS coach was critical and maybe even negative. But even subtle approval from him produced confidence in us. We drilled the same things over and over with him nitpicking every detail until we were so consistent we knew when to expect the sound of contact from someone else's block.

Pruitt just seemed to put guys down in a way that they didn't get back up. He produced doubt rather than confidence.

 

[butchna]

I get wanting to lionize CJH because we hope he'll be "the guy" but along with that let's recall that he was an "out of left field" hire that wasn't on the radar.

When we were tossing around Freeze, Franklin, Campbell, Christobal, etc his name wasn't bounced around..... wasn't even thought of. It's great to be positive about a coach, but it's not like we had to outbid Auburn for his services.

Because they outbid “?”for Harsin? Already saddled himself with a Sam Pittman move in letting Garner go.

 

[BeardedVol]

And some are ignorantly saying that his success at Mizzou and UCF means nothing and he will never be an elite coach and he will be gone in 4 years....
All this, without him coaching, one single down of football yet at UT

How does Heupel having moderate success as an OC at Missouri in 2016-17, and a HC at UCF in 2018, have any bearing on how UT will fare under him in 2021 and beyond?

 

[PlanetVolunteer]

Ok every loss Heup had at UCF except BYU was within a score, so he's a handful of plays from being pretty much perfect and being the top young coach in the game.

 

[BruisedOrange]

I like that he's been at several schools, coached under several guys not from the same coaching tree. That's a lot of different angles under which blemishes, faults, and those "intangible" problems would likely show.

Most of all, the fact that his former AD--the one who knows better than anyone how he well Heupel works with others, how clean a program he runs, his personal character--was willing to bet his potentially long and lucrative career on Heupel being the right coach for this job.

 

[GetYouSomeofThat]

Lol, so it's "hate" to be honest about his record, and not proclaim him the second coming of Neyland before he's coached a single down of football at UT?

Nope

But it appears to be hate when you feel compelled to try and rebut any positive post with your "honesty"


You've made your point...making it repeatedly...seems

Pointless.

 

[FLVOL_79]

1. He isn't an ex Saban assistant
2. We went to grade school together

Both irrelevant points.

 

[sjt18]

Lol, so it's "hate" to be honest about his record, and not proclaim him the second coming of Neyland before he's coached a single down of football at UT?

You aren't being honest about his record. You are interpreting it in a specific way to express doubt and displeasure about the hire. You know last year was a really screwed up year. You want to dismiss that and how it was specifically difficult for UCF because including last year in the "stats" makes him look worse.

I'm not saying he's the second coming of anyone. I'm not saying he won't be an all time great. Some of us are choosing to be hopeful... and that seems to aggravate you so much that you have to douse it.

Let's put it this way.

Kiffin arrived as a failed NFL coach... we gave him a chance and he hosed us.

Dooley arrived as a guy with a pedigree who seemed to have La Tech moving in a good direction... We gave him a chance and he failed.

Jones arrived with a couple of "good stops" where he coached on Kelly's coattails.... We gave him a chance and he failed.

Pruitt arrived with a pretty good DC resume as the handpicked choice of Fulmer... We gave him a chance and he failed.

Heupel comes in after being a successful OC and HC... Let's give him a chance before we declare him a failure. Might as well, right? Why make yourself and everyone else miserable over things that have not happened yet?

 

[BeardedVol]

Nope

But it appears to be hate when you feel compelled to try and rebut any positive post with your "honesty"


You've made your point...making it repeatedly...seems

Pointless.

Right...because pointing out that Heupel hasn't even coached a game at UT yet, when posters on here are already proclaiming him a "top SEC coach", is trying to "rebut any positive post".

 

[sjt18]

Right...because pointing out that Heupel hasn't even coached a game at UT yet, when posters on here are already proclaiming him a "top SEC coach", is trying to "rebut any positive post".

Which posters and why are you arguing with folks who didn't say it as if they did?

You took issue with my posts and I've come nowhere close to saying that Heupel is anything except a talented guy with an opportunity.

 

[BeardedVol]

You aren't being honest about his record. You are interpreting it in a specific way to express doubt and displeasure about the hire. You know last year was a really screwed up year. You want to dismiss that and how it was specifically difficult for UCF because including last year in the "stats" makes him look worse.

I'm not saying he's the second coming of anyone. I'm not saying he won't be an all time great. Some of us are choosing to be hopeful... and that seems to aggravate you so much that you have to douse it.

Let's put it this way.

Kiffin arrived as a failed NFL coach... we gave him a chance and he hosed us.

Dooley arrived as a guy with a pedigree who seemed to have La Tech moving in a good direction... We gave him a chance and he failed.

Jones arrived with a couple of "good stops" where he coached on Kelly's coattails.... We gave him a chance and he failed.

Pruitt arrived with a pretty good DC resume as the handpicked choice of Fulmer... We gave him a chance and he failed.

Heupel comes in after being a successful OC and HC... Let's give him a chance before we declare him a failure. Might as well, right? Why make yourself and everyone else miserable over things that have not happened yet?

How many times does it have to be pointed out that every single team had to deal with covid-related issues? To beat it all, the state of Florida, put the least restrictions on anyone. Covid was not responsible for UCF's defense giving up ~500 YPG, and it was not responsible for them not beating a team with a winning record in 2020.

How am I not giving Heupel a chance? I've stated more than enough times, that I've reserved my judgement on him as UT's coach, until he's actually coached games at UT.

 

[Remy]

Without reading through the entire thread I will say that I like what I’ve heard from the staff so far, they don’t put these kids down even when talking about mistakes that are being made and what not. I want to think we might have a good one, I thought it with Butch and Pruitt. Regardless I think the whole idea that he’ll be gone in two years or sort of redundant. We don’t need that, he will, like everybody else have to have time and depending on how hard the NCAA hits us, he’s gonna get his 4 years. I like everything I’ve read and seen about his offense, which is the way the game has shifted. His 4 years IMO, are going to depend on his defensive staff and, of course, how well he can recruit. I’m at the point where it don’t matter to me who the coach is, just win. The Pruitt Era had its good moments and plenty of bad/awful. Going to be patient with Heupel.

So you're saying after watching Heupel lose to Vandy three years in a row, hypothetically speaking you'd sign up and watch him lead the Vols to a fourth defeat since he must get his four years? You're signing up for that?

 

[BeardedVol]

Which posters and why are you arguing with folks who didn't say it as if they did?

You took issue with my posts and I've come nowhere close to saying that Heupel is anything except a talented guy with an opportunity.

Actually you took issue with my counterpoints to the OP's post.