Reasons to think Coach Josh Heupel will move us forward

#2

VolsSportsFan

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#2
Well since the dislike Pruitt thread was an active thread let's try this one.

1. Can coach up a QB, having played the position and rather good at it, so he knows how to prepare a QB.
2. His offense scores a lot of points
3. I'm lost after that unless you factor in he's not Butch or Pruitt.

Thoughts?
Not sure that's actually a reason, other than he's more likable. Pruitt sure, but Jones actually did move us forward before slamming it in reverse. Well....Josh Dobbs moved us forward at least.
 
#4

sjt18

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#4
He seems to be of dependably good character. Guys can trust him.

Probably the biggest thing you didn't mention is "culture". The language of the coaching staff is positive even when critical. Everything is said and done with an expectation of a good outcome even if there are setbacks. The players are starting to parrot the positivity.

Kiffin had his guys believing. He didn't stay... but his guys had confidence that they could compete and that they would become a good team. Dooley tried feebly but just got swallowed up. He wasn't totally effective in choosing his staff either. Jones "tried"... but he's a used car salesman and people figure that out pretty quick.

Pruitt is just a negative guy. It is one of the reasons he has no business being a HC. He deflates people. The worse the pressure got... the worse he seemed to get.

We've all had different managers. Some cause you to want to give up and lose hope. Some are just as honest with their criticism but make you leave feeling like overcoming your problems is a future certainty. Pruitt appears to be the former. Hopefully Heupel is and will remain the latter.
 
#7

BeardedVol

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#7
Well since the dislike Pruitt thread was an active thread let's try this one.

1. Can coach up a QB, having played the position and rather good at it, so he knows how to prepare a QB.
2. His offense scores a lot of points
3. I'm lost after that unless you factor in he's not Butch or Pruitt.

Thoughts?
Counterpoints:

1. Outside of the QB position, his recruiting was "meh" at best at UC, with his teams decreasing in production the more Scott Frost's recruits exited the program.
2. His offense scores a lot of points, on bad and mediocre teams, and is relatively average against good teams with winning records.
3. He might be Butch, depending on whether or not he is capable of seeing the flaws in his system and adjusting it or not.
 
#10

UTNoFear

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#10
I have been pleasantly surprised that he isn't using the "year zero" excuse and has been hitting the portal in order to win now. I don't see us competing in the SECe now, but at least he isn't making excuses. I am at least intrigued.
I agree 100%. I'm more intrigued than anything right now. I'm not too concerned with the offense, but the defense worries me. But then we haven't exactly killed it on that side of the ball for a long time.
 
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#11
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#11
Well since the dislike Pruitt thread was an active thread let's try this one.

1. Can coach up a QB, having played the position and rather good at it, so he knows how to prepare a QB.
2. His offense scores a lot of points
3. I'm lost after that unless you factor in he's not Butch or Pruitt.

Thoughts?
Of course he will move us forward. They hired him. As to whether he moves us forward in the way you imply? It depends on how well he can recruit and develop. And I hope he quits referring to players as kids. The more often I read him being quoted saying that, the less faith I have.
 
#12

Behr

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#12
Because TLotM are really quiet. They normally won't tell you if the new coach will move us forward or not, they'll just repeat all of his flaws and negatives, over and over and over and over etc. and when he fails they'll tell us how they told us he would fail. It's actually pretty smart. There's a little of that now, but nowhere near the normal. To me that's a good sign.
 
#14

SayUWantAreVOLution

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#14
Well since the dislike Pruitt thread was an active thread let's try this one.

1. Can coach up a QB, having played the position and rather good at it, so he knows how to prepare a QB.
2. His offense scores a lot of points
3. I'm lost after that unless you factor in he's not Butch or Pruitt.

Thoughts?
He's got a pair. He surely saw the Schiano debacle and knows the Pruitt crap better than us and he knows Vols fans are a desperately thirsty for success group and, at times, a bloodthirsty toward coaches mob. He took the job knowing he might be the most hated man in Tennessee in a matter of months.

He's articulate enough to not embarrass the school like Pruitt and to some extent Fulmer. He's not a "good ol' boy" and hopefully those days are behind us. I miss the "Aw, Shucks... Let's go get a drink and talk football" demeanor of Fulmer, Majors, etc...... but it's a big, multi million dollar business now and needs to be run that way.

He's not likely to play it safe on offense and bore the heck out of us. Fast tempo, lots of action.... good and bad.... and no "turtling" to control the clock.

And yeah, he's not Pruitt and JG is thousands of miles away.
 
#15

sjt18

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#15
Counterpoints:

1. Outside of the QB position, his recruiting was "meh" at best at UC, with his teams decreasing in production the more Scott Frost's recruits exited the program.
In what way? If "decreasing" production produces 42+ ppg... I'll take it. I personally "listen" to Covid explanations for 2020 results. I don't think it excuses what we saw from Pruitt in part because problems on the field got worse as Covid got better. But Heupel did have several key players opt out. At a school almost completely dependent on developing players for two or 3 years before they play you cannot afford anything that takes 8 or 10 guys out of your 2 deep.

Gabriel was his guy... he became the starter and beat out guys that Frost left.

But it is true that when you hire a coach who has only been at their last stop for 3 years that you may not have a clear picture of their ability to recruit. OTOH... guys often do better and worse at different stops in recruiting.

I like what they've appeared to do in the portal in response to some losses he had no control over. I'm still waiting to see better results with new recruits but will wait until he's had more of a fair chance. The extended dead period coupled to the timing of his hiring really hurt. He does have some really good recruiters on staff.
2. His offense scores a lot of points, on bad and mediocre teams, and is relatively average against good teams with winning records.
His O's only scored less than 30 points 3 times in 3 years. Naturally teams score more against bad teams.... but he often scored lots of points on the better teams on his schedule.

The point is valid though that if opponents can keep his team under 30 points then they are likely to win.
3. He might be Butch, depending on whether or not he is capable of seeing the flaws in his system and adjusting it or not.
He may fail. But I don't think it will be for the same reasons Jones did.
 
#16

sjt18

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#16
He's got a pair. He surely saw the Schiano debacle and knows the Pruitt crap better than us and he knows Vols fans are a desperately thirsty for success group and, at times, a bloodthirsty toward coaches mob. He took the job knowing he might be the most hated man in Tennessee in a matter of months.

He's articulate enough to not embarrass the school like Pruitt and to some extent Fulmer. He's not a "good ol' boy" and hopefully those days are behind us. I miss the "Aw, Shucks... Let's go get a drink and talk football" demeanor of Fulmer, Majors, etc...... but it's a big, multi million dollar business now and needs to be run that way.

He's not likely to play it safe on offense and bore the heck out of us. Fast tempo, lots of action.... good and bad.... and no "turtling" to control the clock.

And yeah, he's not Pruitt and JG is thousands of miles away.
Do you have any idea where Aberdeen, SD is or what kind of area he comes from? His "country bona fides" are not in question.
 
#17

BeardedVol

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#17
In what way? If "decreasing" production produces 42+ ppg... I'll take it. I personally "listen" to Covid explanations for 2020 results. I don't think it excuses what we saw from Pruitt in part because problems on the field got worse as Covid got better. But Heupel did have several key players opt out. At a school almost completely dependent on developing players for two or 3 years before they play you cannot afford anything that takes 8 or 10 guys out of your 2 deep.

Gabriel was his guy... he became the starter and beat out guys that Frost left.

But it is true that when you hire a coach who has only been at their last stop for 3 years that you may not have a clear picture of their ability to recruit. OTOH... guys often do better and worse at different stops in recruiting.

I like what they've appeared to do in the portal in response to some losses he had no control over. I'm still waiting to see better results with new recruits but will wait until he's had more of a fair chance. The extended dead period coupled to the timing of his hiring really hurt. He does have some really good recruiters on staff.
His O's only scored less than 30 points 3 times in 3 years. Naturally teams score more against bad teams.... but he often scored lots of points on the better teams on his schedule.

The point is valid though that if opponents can keep his team under 30 points then they are likely to win.

He may fail. But I don't think it will be for the same reasons Jones did.
Look at his offense's production over time against teams with winning records vs those without winning records. UCF's schedule is rife with bad teams, and those offensive numbers are well-padded by it.

The real unknown with Huepel is whether or not he is going to be able to adapt his offensive system to consistently work in the SEC, and can his defensive staff put together an actual defense which doesn't give up ~500 YPG.
 
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#18

DaddyChad

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#18
Idk how we can go backwards much honestly. How the hell do you do worse than a guy like Pruitt? Now whether he’s the man or just the placeholder for the next guy, who knows at this point. Arguably has the best resume since Majors or anyone we’ve hired.
 
#21

OffTackleVol

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#21
Of course he will move us forward. They hired him. As to whether he moves us forward in the way you imply? It depends on how well he can recruit and develop. And I hope he quits referring to players as kids. The more often I read him being quoted saying that, the less faith I have.
Just curious, why does it bother you that he refers to his players as "kids?" And why does cause you to have "less faith?" Not being argumentative, again just curious........
 
#22

EricberryFAN

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#22
Listen, why don't we try not to fill our heads with more false hope. Only because I'm tired of being let down. I'm going with a, "It is what it is" approach....and we haven't seen what it is. Soo...

We don't really have much of a choice but to give him the keys and let him drive this train wreck. At least he seems willing to.

With that being said, I'll be in Neyland on Sept 2nd and as always, Go Vols.

Hope to see a lot of this from him below..

 
#23

Impossible Girl

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#23
Well since the dislike Pruitt thread was an active thread let's try this one.

1. Can coach up a QB, having played the position and rather good at it, so he knows how to prepare a QB.
2. His offense scores a lot of points
3. I'm lost after that unless you factor in he's not Butch or Pruitt.

Thoughts?
Heupel has that unique factor in that he is a guru. He just hasn’t had a bad offense, ever. He also hires very cerebral guys for his offensive staff. Plus, the majority of the offensive staff came with him and knows this offense. I have little doubt that he’ll get the most out of whoever lands the QB job.

The biggest concern is how will the defense do. It’s pretty telling that he didn’t even attempt to bring Randy Shannon with him from UCF. I had heard that Shannon was not his choice, and had he stayed, he was going to go in a different direction.
 
#24

JoAllan

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#24
Counterpoints:

1. Outside of the QB position, his recruiting was "meh" at best at UC, with his teams decreasing in production the more Scott Frost's recruits exited the program.
2. His offense scores a lot of points, on bad and mediocre teams, and is relatively average against good teams with winning records.
3. He might be Butch, depending on whether or not he is capable of seeing the flaws in his system and adjusting it or not.
Frost was HC at UCF for 2 seasons........it’s not like he built a freakin dynasty........it’s also “not” like Frost had 7 years of “his” recruits in the program.

Frost had the magical undefeated season, in all fairness and reality where is production going to go from there? Especially with a new coach.

UCF was not nor is Bama or Clemson.

It’s never apples to apples. But Frost went 19-7 in his two years at UCF. Heupel went 22-4 his first two years.

I don’t know what Heupel is going to do......however he did very well where he has previously been.
 

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