Reasonable fans post game discussion

#76
#76
I think I’ve finally figured out why Uros gets minutes every game - the effort is there the whole time he plays. I’ve been posting how I wish he would start trying to dunk every time he touches the ball in the paint and he tried to tonight. If the officials would start officiating him fairly he would be even more productive. I thought the intentional foul they called on him should have been a foul on the lsu guy and Uros got hit in the head when the guy blocked his dunk attempt. Hope this game builds his confidence some and he can become better from it.

How can a guy this intimidating be so meek acting. (notice I said acting) I, like others think he should be able to take over the floor around (close) to the basket with his size alone. He is huge. Much more than most he would face,. His main problems to me are he is slow an ponderous and doesn't seem to be able to jump more then 12" off the floor. Playing against so many great athletics, he needs to play big and rough. To me he is trying to not foul. Hell in his case, don't worry about fouling just "take over", scoring will come from people understanding the danger challenging him and give him room. If he can jump a little (which will be enough if he plays rough), then he should work to put his elbows in the basket on every shot which should be a dunk. Would make for a really good FGP.
 
#77
#77
I admit, I’m an emotional roller coaster on game day. Just who I am. But, it’s hard to not get frustrated by this team. We should be so much better than we are and I’m not seeing improvement yet.

Not much else to say, other than just win. It’s still early but it hasn’t been an encouraging start to SEC Play. Barnes has to find a way to get more from the offense.
The value of return for his salary is just not there.
 
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#78
#78
He’s got 2 years left if he wants them
Given the history of our roster with transfers, I have to wonder if he really will want 2 more years of Barnes. He might take that path instead.
 
#79
#79
There are players shooting 3s that have no business doing so because they hit <25% of them. We have to take better shots and there needs to be more of a focus on throwing the ball inside and working inside out. This shoot if you are open is not good cause it means we shoot too many 3s. I mean if you are the opponent- why guard JJJ away from the basket?

On the recruiting trail I don't think Barnes has his people looking so much for "shooters". Watching other teams, hell there LOTS of shooters out there in high schools across the whole country. Everyone seems to have at least 2 guys who can shoot better than most anyone on our team. (let alone shoot 3s) As for three shooters, well I don't think Barnes ever looks at what a prospect can do from the 3 line. If I am right his teams will always frustrate most of us fans. To me you can teach defense, but you have to recruit shooter. As the object is to score more points than your opponent, you first recruit shooters AND THEN teach defense.
 
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#80
#80
On the recruiting trail I don't think Barnes has his people looking so much for "shooters". Watching other teams, hell there LOTS of shooters out there in high schools across the whole country. Everyone seems to have at least 2 guys who can shoot better than most anyone on our team. (let alone shoot 3s) As for three shooters, well I don't think Barnes ever looks at what a prospect can do from the 3 line. If I am right his teams will always frustrate most of us fans. To me you can teach defense, but you have to recruit shooter. As the object is to score more points than your opponent, you first recruit shooters AND THEN teach defense.
Well, I think anyone would agree that Vescovi and in particular, Powell are shooters yet Barnes can't seem to scheme them into our offense. AND he continues to tolerate JJJ shooting so many 3's.
 
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#81
#81
I don’t know how you coach guys to make open shots. Maybe we have to completely overhaul the offensive philosophy, but it’s tough to do that mid-season and probably ill-advised. But, right now, our problem is we miss a TON of wide open shots nearly every game.

We also missed 13 or 14 free throws tonight which is a killer. Basketball, like baseball, is a game of regression to the mean. Theoretically, we should be due a few good shooting games here soon, but it feels like I’ve been saying that for 2-3 weeks and it hasn’t come. Hopefully USCe can be a get right type of contest. We need a confidence booster.

You don't. Shooting is in a guy or it's not. I stated in an above post my thoughts on the Barnes approach to the game. You can coach them as to getting the best shooting position for success, but you can't teach him to shoot. Maybe like a guy who throws a baseball 100mph+ (you don't teach that, it's god given) you can help him with mechanics to help him become a better 100+ guy but that's it. Same with shooting...
 
#82
#82
I will do my best to be positive here:

So I went back last night and watched some of the 2019 team. I understand where the Fulk plays too vertical comment comes from, if you watch Grant when he was posting guys up a lot of times he would use his but to keep the defenders away from him and almost crouch forward a little bit. Fulk almsot always seems to lean back into his defender and use more of his upper back and shoulders to try and create space.
 
#83
#83
Well, I think anyone would agree that Vescovi and in particular, Powell are shooters yet Barnes can't seem to scheme them into our offense. AND he continues to tolerate JJJ shooting so many 3's.

Powell, yes I think he is a 3 shooter (maybe a really good one). But he can't stay on the Barnes floor because to me he looks/is lost most of the time on defense. Which sends him to the bench. Needs to be on the floor to get into a rhythm. I seem to notice something, when he is open the other 4 just seem to ignore him unless they need him to bail them out. They for the most part just seem to be playing with 4 guys. Wonder if there is a problem with him fitting in???
 
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#84
#84
You don't. Shooting is in a guy or it's not. I stated in an above post my thoughts on the Barnes approach to the game. You can coach them as to getting the best shooting position for success, but you can't teach him to shoot. Maybe like a guy who throws a baseball 100mph+ (you don't teach that, it's god given) you can help him with mechanics to help him become a better 100+ guy but that's it. Same with shooting...
Sadly, I think a lot of shooters are bypassed because they're not "athletic" enough and would be considered a liability on defense or incapable of attacking the rim. Powel is a perfect example. Good coaching will get those guys open looks. A shooter who's looking for his shot will get to those open spots he likes and be ready when a teammate gets the ball to him. Our problems are likely a combination of all these things.
 
#85
#85
It is hard as heck to shoot free throws in a tiny cracker box that reeks of corn dogs.
 
#86
#86
Powell, yes I think he is a 3 shooter (maybe a really good one). But he can't stay on the Barnes floor because to me he looks/is lost most of the time on defense. Which sends him to the bench. Needs to be on the floor to get into a rhythm. I seem to notice something, when he is open the other 4 just seem to ignore him unless they need him to bail them out. They for the most part just seem to be playing with 4 guys. Wonder if there is a problem with him fitting in???
I'd never really given much thought to a jealousy/chemistry issue with this bunch outside of the player/coach relationship. Interesting thought.
 
#88
#88
It is hard as heck to shoot free throws in a tiny cracker box that reeks of corn dogs.
Nah. FT shooting is all about focus and concentration. If you can shoot, you can shoot the free ones anywhere.
 
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#90
#90
We can’t shoot. Period

44% of our FGA are from 3 and we’re shooting 32%.

You’re just being a nega-Vol! Come on, golf! 🤪

Okay, but in all seriousness, it’s definitely a problem. I was really excited about Barnes changing his philosophy to play more modern basketball, but we clearly don’t have the players for that style so it might be time for the staff to re-evaluate how we play ball for the rest of the season if we want to have success.
 
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#91
#91
Possible. I will say Barnes can be (let’s say) tough on players and I do think there could be a issue with the scheme/confidence of those guys. I don’t find the offense to be complex because SEC teams usually scout is well. Our offensive efficiency has gone down the last three years as we get into late January and February. Our spacing is so poor. That’s a big problem.
We need some sort of offensive post presence in this offense. Yesterday we fed the post early often (both low and high post) and even when we kicked it back out at least we had good looks and we’re playing well initially. But we stopped. Nkamhoua has improved so if Fulkerson either doesn’t feel well or doesn’t want it than let Nkamhoua be primary. Otherwise we are left with only a couple of options in the half court: a) Chandler creating with the dribble. He is talented but it seems he still needs to adjust to longer athletic players as he is getting himself into trouble often. b) Doing dribble handoffs around the perimeter and jacking up a 3 from a group of players who are proving every game that they can’t make contested 3’s. Numbers don’t lie, we are what we are offensively in the half court and it isn’t pretty. Last year we were saying the same thing, but at least the excuse was we didn’t have a PG. This year we have 2 and it is still an ugly offense.

Defensively we are very good, but you would think at this stage of the season we could provide some semblance of consistency on offense. As others have said, we need to push tempo. We are allowing defenses to get set to our detriment. Otherwise the rotation is baffling.

Give Uros credit as he is earning some time off the bench. However we need another frontcourt player (BHH) off the bench because unlike last year, JJJ shooting at this poor a percentage from the field is a huge liability when we play small ball. I love Ziegler. Powell doesn’t look like he is enjoying himself. Whether it is his own confidence or he is playing with a leash around his neck, who knows. He has skills, let him play consistent minutes. Spot minutes for Mashack is fine but a backcourt rotation of Vescovi, Chandler and Ziegler works for me the rest of the way. Bailey should not get any minutes. James has other good qualities on the floor, but should be told never to shoot another 3 again. Bailey, if not scoring, has no other qualities which earns him minutes. It is just horrid how poorly both he and James are shooting, which is substantially worse than their previous years. If either were shooting to their previous season averages we would be an interesting team.
 
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#92
#92
New guys+poor offensive system in general.

We take more three’s which is great! We still don’t play up tempo style enough and we still run that damned 3-2 motion 90’s offense. There just isn’t enough modern sets that consistently gets open looks. And we don’t shoot well. So we got an offense that doesn’t push the pace and generate enough open looks, and we aren’t a good shooting team. Recipe for bad offensive play

The biggest issue I see thus far is that we allow other teams to decide who shoots the 3 ball vs. us being more intentional on who we want shooting. The announcer said last night said 49% of TN's 3-pointers are open looks which seems good at first glance until you realize who is shooting them: JJJ, Ziegler, & Bailey shot 10 of our 3-pointers or 42% of the total while making only 2 for 20% versus SV, Chandler, Powell who shot 11 of our 3-pointers making 4 for 36%. If we go back and look at the season, they are attempting right at 40% so this is a recurring theme.

Therefore, I would say that the best adjustment we would make would be to be much more selective on who shoots which starts with who is on the floor (Powell only had 1 3-pt attempt which he missed - gotta get him more looks which means much more PT period). Next, we need better spacing and more touches in the paint (via post-ups or drive and kick) to stress the opposing teams defense which is your point about the scheme and sets we run. Last but not least, simply being open should not be enough for certain players to let it fly since there is a reason teams are leaving them open (unless, of course, we are under 10 on the shot clock).
 
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#93
#93
Don’t know where all these crazies have come from, but I hate being run off the forum by these guys spewing over the top trollish negativity. If you can’t have a reasonable discussion without mentioning CRB’s salary or making over the top insults of the staff, team, or individual players then please move on to one of the 10 other threads where like minded folks will welcome your venting.

Let the reasonable discussion begin!

Bravely posted…well done. For me, the disappointment comes from that same old sickening thought that we could, should be better than what we’ve seen so far. That our performance doesn’t match the talent on our team. That we are, once again, champions of underachievement. That we are what we were last year and we’re where we were last year, the year before, the year before that, etc. That we’re stuck in a hopeless fog of orange doom of mediocrity. That we’re above average on our best days but, across a season, still pretty average.

This past offseason gave me great hope because Barnes seemed to radically alter his recipe. He let go of a few players who couldn’t produce and replaced them with highly coveted replacements. He basically flipped the roster and rebuilt the team with obvious talent improvements. He recruited well. It was a very exciting offseason for me because it seemed Barnes had finally realized that his usual style or philosophy wasn’t working. He had upended the team with what looked to be fantastic improvements at various positions. To me, it looked like he was finally intent on hanging championship banners in TBO. No more of this underachieving, let’s make it to maybe the second round of the tourney, pat ourselves on the back and go home nonsense.

It certainly looked to me that Barnes was stepping way out of his comfort zone by doing this. He was taking a huge risk by stirring things up. Again, I interpreted this as Barnes honestly trying to build a championship basketball team. But then we look at the results, performances, and we start scratching our heads…again.

A key measure of improvement I looked for this season was the rotation that Barnes used game in endgame out. I believed from the start that we had the talent to sustain a rotation of 9-10 players every game. I still believe that. I haven’t been tracking the minutes played by our players every game, but when I have checked, we’ve had nine or 10 guys getting decent minutes most games. Barnes has experimented with his groupings and I applaud him for that. But our bench has either performed well in games or it has disappeared. He still hasn’t found a chemical reaction on the floor within the five players out there at one time. Sure, they’ve had flashes of greatness but nothing consistent. And we’ve had flashes of gross underachievement like we saw last night.

All this to ask: has Coach Barnes reached his ceiling? Can we honestly expect our team to reach 30 wins in a season? Maybe win the SEC tourney? Make the Sweet 16 or better? These seem to be utterly reasonable questions at this point.
 
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#94
#94
The salary stuff is moronic. I don’t care if we pay him $1 or $10m. That’s between him and his employer. I’m sure these same people would give him a pass to lose 20 games if he were coaching for $250k/year. 🙄

You’d think they would worry about their own finances instead of someone else’s.

It’s quite amazing.
 
#95
#95
New guys+poor offensive system in general.

We take more three’s which is great! We still don’t play up tempo style enough and we still run that damned 3-2 motion 90’s offense. There just isn’t enough modern sets that consistently gets open looks. And we don’t shoot well. So we got an offense that doesn’t push the pace and generate enough open looks, and we aren’t a good shooting team. Recipe for bad offensive play
Most of the 3s we take aren’t good looks though. If we work the ball inside and then kick out that’s almost always a better shot than passing it around the perimeter and jacking up a 3, at least with the way we pass it is. We rarely skip pass and our passes are often either off target so the shooter can’t catch and shoot or the receiving player doesn’t catch the ball cleanly.
 
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#96
#96
New guys+poor offensive system in general.

We take more three’s which is great! We still don’t play up tempo style enough and we still run that damned 3-2 motion 90’s offense. There just isn’t enough modern sets that consistently gets open looks. And we don’t shoot well. So we got an offense that doesn’t push the pace and generate enough open looks, and we aren’t a good shooting team. Recipe for bad offensive play

Once the game goes in a half court game in the 2nd half (most games do) it’s “sink or swim” with the 3 ball with this offense. Teams have shut down KC drives to the basket now after seeing it on tape.

Barnes defense philosophy is to defend the shot & rebound, not force turnovers & get in transition a la LSU last night. Thus why Tennessee doesn’t get a lot of transition points.

Hell, I’d play Plav more. Teach him to keep his hands up on both ends. BHH needs a few more minutes too. Fulky needs less until he gets back full strength.
 
#97
#97
You’d think they would worry about their own finances instead of someone else’s.

It’s quite amazing.

Cal makes more than Rick and he hasn’t exactly done any better recently. The salary stuff is extremely dumb, but it’s fine to say we should be able to expect more from the talent on this team.
 
#98
#98
Don’t know where all these crazies have come from, but I hate being run off the forum by these guys spewing over the top trollish negativity. If you can’t have a reasonable discussion without mentioning CRB’s salary or making over the top insults of the staff, team, or individual players then please move on to one of the 10 other threads where like minded folks will welcome your venting.

Let the reasonable discussion begin!
I see something off with Chandler's and Fulkerson's energy. You can see it at the foul lineb with Chandler. He just throws the ball up like he doesn't care. Misses way too many for a PG. Barnes needs to stop benching Powell so quickly. He is ruining the kid's confidence. I see Chandler and Z make tons of mistakes. Our entire team seems to be struggling with their shot.
 

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