NCAA Tourney Selection Show

#152
#152
Peas29 said:
I disagree Nikki just happen to be at a university that the top players doesn’t seem to want to be. What she get out of what she has talent wise shows that she can coach. Had she been able to land the in state star Ursin it would’ve been a different past 4 years for her. She should’ve stayed at UCLA.
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... but it's her job as a coach to GET THEM to come. Yes she should've stayed at UCLA where it would've been easier to recruit but she got greedy instead. She left UCLA for LSU the same time Joanne Boyle left Cal for Virginia and they both should've stayed where they were. (Of course, Boyle has already been fired.) Still, I think she's better suited as an assistant where she was phenomenal vs. a HC where she is average.

Success breeds recruiting, not the other way around. When Gunter and then Pokey were at LSU they got plenty of good recruits.

LSU hasn't been to the tourney since 2018. They haven't been past the first round of the tourney since 2014. And she's never had a season without double digit losses. Her contract runs out next season, so I think she's gone, TBH.
 
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#153
#153
SGMVols said:
It’s shocking to me how little success people who played and/or coached under Pat have had as head coaches. Just doesn’t make sense.
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That's true. Several have had success as assistants (Caldwell, Warlick, McCray, Randall, Elzy, Niya and Tasha Butts), but none seemingly have been good HCs. Honestly, Kellie has been the best HC. We'll see about Kara. Jill Rankin had a lot of success as a high school HC.
 
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#154
#154
Looking at Baylor, they beat a lot of teams ranked over 25. They beat ranked South Florida (25 net) and West Virginia (24 net), that’s it. They lost to ranked Arkansas and unranked Iowa State. Lady Vols gotta get there, then beat them and then UConn. GO LADY VOLS!!!
 
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#155
#155
Amb3096 said:
Needs to get a life
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This is honestly why I wasn’t sad to see them or Evina leave. The helicopter parents are too much. Hated over zealous parents when I was a player. Just let the coach do their job. If your kid is good enough and working hard they will start/play. If not they should sit. I recall her dad thought she should be the starting PG for us as a freshman and wouldn’t let it go.
 
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#156
#156
Volfaninfl2 said:
Looking at Baylor, they beat a lot of unranked teams. They beat ranked South Florida and West Virginia. They lost to ranked Arkansas and unranked Iowa State. Lady Vols gotta get there, then beat them and then UConn. GO LADY VOLS!!!
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Exactly. We have been tested and have beaten at least one team better than them IMO.

Baylor’s losses were due to a combination of things, but they haven’t played nearly as many tough teams as us. Their loss to Arkansas was Richards’ first game of the season and she is their de facto point guard so that played a part there. Mulkey did not coach that Iowa State game they lost due to COVID. She is the kind of coach who often calls plays in live action or move players from the sideline to open things up for someone. Not having her on the sideline hurt for sure.
 
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#158
#158
VolBall09 said:
This is honestly why I wasn’t sad to see them or Evina leave. The helicopter parents are too much. Hated over zealous parents when I was a player. Just let the coach do their job. If your kid is good enough and working hard they will start/play. If not they should sit. I recall her dad thought she should be the starting PG for us as a freshman and wouldn’t let it go.
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This is also where the right coach who says, "Knock that sh/t off...NOW!" is needed.

(And no...I'm not talking about Jumper)
 
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#159
#159
"Coaching trees" are pretty overblown in my book. You can pick any "legendary" coach and scramble your brain trying to figure out which ones produced "coaching trees." Take Mike Kryzewski for example. One of the best college coaches in history, and not much of a tree to show for it. Or how about Phil Jackson in the NBA? Good luck finding a tree there. Awful legacy in that department. I'd wager that "coaching trees" are as much about having the right assistants come through a coach's program at the right time, rather than the coach somehow imparting the special wisdom or skill needed to be a "great coach." And yes, sometimes you get a lot of successful coaches from this coach or that coach, but that's as much about a stable and successful head coach attracting good assistant coaches to work for them as it is creating a "coaching tree."

There's more to it than this of course, but the jist of my assertion is - "coaching trees" don't mean all that much.
 
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#160
#160
Amb3096 said:
This is also where the right coach who says, "Knock that sh/t off...NOW!" is needed.

(And no...I'm not talking about Jumper)
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Their mom cracks me up though. Talk about cut your nose to spite your face. Tennessee is a 3 seed and set for a great tournament with an excellent new head coach.

One of her daughters’ teams didn’t even make it (ND). Alasia hardly played for them this season anyhow. Injury maybe?

The other two are on a mediocre mid-major team that had an average season. Nobody here is jealous of them. Rennia and Kasi are definitely not sad about how things have turned out for them.
 
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#161
#161
volman128 said:
That's true. Several have had success as assistants (Caldwell, Warlick, McCray, Randall, Elzy, Niya and Tasha Butts), but none seemingly have been good HCs. Honestly, Kellie has been the best HC. We'll see about Kara. Jill Rankin had a lot of success as high school HS.
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I think this year with covid was a problem for the LSU and OLD Miss but it is clear they are no easy out in the SEC. Aslo look for recruiting of top players to pick up for both teams.
 
#165
#165
volman128 said:
... but it's her job as a coach to GET THEM to come. Yes she should've stayed at UCLA where it would've been easier to recruit but she got greedy instead. She left UCLA for LSU the same time Joanne Boyle left Cal for Virginia and they both should've stayed where they were. (Of course, Boyle has already been fired.) Still, I think she's better suited as an assistant where she was phenomenal vs. a HC where she is average.

Success breeds recruiting, not the other way around. When Gunter and then Pokey were at LSU they got plenty of good recruits.

LSU hasn't been to the tourney since 2018. They haven't been past the first round of the tourney since 2014. And she's never had a season without double digit losses. Her contract runs out next season, so I think she's gone, TBH.
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Gunter faded at the end of her career and Pokey benefited off a WNBA Legend Coach.
 
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#166
#166
I have no problem with what her mom said in that moment.. maybe some of the posters should take a page out of the book they’re reading from and just ignore her. Her daughters are all talented players. Let’s beat Middle and move forward.

I actually like our path to sweet 16. I think if we make it there; the Baylor game will be a good one. They don’t have any truly dominant scorers but Baylor as always defends very very well and are well balanced; but so are we. I actually like our post play over there’s outside of Nalyssa Smith. She’s the type of mobile 4 that can gives us problems.

Let’s show up, compete, win, and move to the next game. One at a time. MTSU you’re up first.
 
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#167
#167
volman128 said:
That's true. Several have had success as assistants (Caldwell, Warlick, McCray, Randall, Elzy, Niya and Tasha Butts), but none seemingly have been good HCs. Honestly, Kellie has been the best HC. We'll see about Kara. Jill Rankin had a lot of success as high school HS.
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I am not sure this situation is shocking or "true." What is the standard of success? Warlick won several SEC titles and made the elite 8 on several occassions. Caldwell has taken her teams to the NCAA on numerous occassions and, was having success in turning around UCLA before she took the LSU job. Elzy has KY in the tourney. DeMoss was doing quite well in her brief time at KY before deciding that being a head coach was not for her. Also, as part of the CPS tree, we have people who were not formal assistant coaches but were part of her staff, such as Matthew Mitchell who was a grad assistant coach under CPS.

And most of all, we need baseline comparisons.

So lets compare. how many "great" assistants have come out of the coaching trees of other legends -- Geno, Tara, C. VIV, Muffet? I could be wrong but I don't think any of their former assistants have scaled higher heights as head coaches than former LVs.

Furthermore, the Leon Barrymore - Kim M. lineage seems to be the rare exception, where an assistant has outperformed her mentor.

All in all, CPS has created a larger coaching tree than her legend comparison points. While non have an NC, several of former LV head coaches have relatively successful careers, including Kellie.
 
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#168
#168
madtownvol said:
I am not sure this situation is shocking or "true." What is the standard of success? Warlick won several SEC titles and made the elite 8 on several occassions. Caldwell has taken her teams to the NCAA on numerous occassions and, was having success in turning around UCLA before she took the LSU job. Elzy has KY in the tourney. DeMoss was doing quite well in her brief time at KY before deciding that being a head coach was not for her. Also, as part of the CPS tree, we have people who were not formal assistant coaches but were part of her staff, such as Matthew Mitchell who was a grad assistant coach under CPS.

And most of all, we need baseline comparisons.

So lets compare. how many "great" assistants have come out of the coaching trees of other legends -- Geno, Tara, C. VIV, Muffet? I could be wrong but I don't think any of their former assistants have scaled higher heights as head coaches than former LVs.

Furthermore, the Leon Barrymore - Kim M. lineage seems to be the rare exception, where an assistant has outperformed her mentor.

All in all, CPS has created a larger coaching tree than her legend comparison points. While non have an NC, several of former LV head coaches have relatively successful careers, including Kellie.
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To be fair, the Leon Barrmore tree also includes Kristy Curry, who was an assistant at La Tech with Mulkey, and is actually part of the Sonja Hogg coaching tree, which also includes Gary Blair. Sonja Hogg was the original coach that brought La Tech to prominence in the late 70s/early 80s. Gary Blair got his start coaching in college as an assistant at La Tech in the early 80s.

Muffet McGraw's coaching tree includes Kevin McGuff, who has, despite underperforming at OSU, had as much success as pretty much anyone that's part of Pat's coaching tree. Beth Cunningham and Nielle Ivey were outstanding assistants at ND. It remains to be seen how Nielle will do at ND, or how Cunningham will do at Duke.

CViv's tree has Jolette Law, who is the most notable. It also has Chelsea Newton.

But yes, the most notably successful coaches didn't play at big name schools, Mulkey not included.

Something to note, though, is that Tennessee has two former players out of the coaches of the top 16 seeds: Kellie and Kyra Elzy. I think we are the only program that can say that.
 
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#169
#169
Peas29 said:
Gunter faded at the end of her career and Pokey benefited off a WNBA Legend Coach.
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Pokey got Seimone Augustus, the #1 player in the country, to come there in her final years. Sylvia Fowles also signed there when Gunter was still the HC.
 
#174
#174
Darth_Vol said:
Really glad we don't have any parents like that remaining...
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Don't get close guys....
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#175
#175
What an excellent thread from a group of knowledgeable fans. thanks

my only "belief" was that Fowles, who was on the way to UT at the last minute went to LSU was suspect. Somewhat like the worse of football recruiting (smile)
 
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