NCAA files response in Tennessee lawsuit, cites state’s laws barring NIL in recruiting

#176
#176
Revengevol said:
The point was the NIL and the transfer portal only serve to potentially exacerbate the existing inequalities among teams, with the wealthier programs having an advantage recruiting top talent through NIL deals and easier transfers, further concentrating power among a few elite programs ( OSU recently spent over $11,000,000). We are going to see a lot more of this if things don’t change. About 20 schools with all the talent. Might as well just have a league for the have’s. There has to be controls. Sorry I was so “ dumb “ before.
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There are no legal controls in NIL. So says the Supreme Court.
 
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#179
#179
VolTull said:
Naw.
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lol. DEFINITELY a troll. And one with a really stupid handle also.

I mean seriously...Jethro Tull has some decent songs, but I once heard an interview of one of them whining that they didn't get enough credit for "using a flute in a rock band". I mean...seriously. First of all, no self-respecting adult male should EVER play the flute. Period dot. Let alone use it in a rock band. Let alone WHINE about not getting recognized for it!

If you are trying to be an idiot...congrats! You have greatly exceeded expectations 😄
 
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#180
#180
butchna said:
There will be no union. Not in the athletes best interest. Dartmouth was just granted authority to vote on unionization and only needs 8 votes. Could see that. But they compete in the Ivy League and do not offer athletic scholarships. Much different than Teamster types approaching someone who just landed some sweet NIL money and asking them to vote in the majority to pay union dues for a protracted battle to drag the university into court to share their proceeds. 3-5 year window of paying others to fight for you and what happens if the university refuses and locks the locker room? Strike and risk your commercial opportunities and not practice or develop your skill for the next level. And if you’re a Buckeye and you watch the Nittany Lions (who didn’t vote to unionize) happily claim your spot in the playoffs? How happy are you with your YES vote?
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So this won't be a typical blue collar union. If the model is the NFL union, I think it could be argued that has worked pretty well for the NFL players.
 
#181
#181
BanditVol said:
So this won't be a typical blue collar union. If the model is the NFL union, I think it could be argued that has worked pretty well for the NFL players.
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Yeah…but different circumstances. The NFL in its infancy, was a bunch of owners with their own money and anything their new venture generated primarily went into their pockets. On the other end, you had a bunch of mostly college graduates who received relative pennies on the dollar in compensation and generally had to work second jobs or live accordingly. No free agency…no options. It wasn’t a 3-5 year window before a minimum $705,000 year salary if you had the required skillset. Unions fighting for those steady gains and (eventually) free agency were vitally necessary. Here you have kids from different financial situations, mostly not the bread winners in their household, but even in the case that they are not banking on attending college for more than four years. The best arrive with some hefty NIL bucks and a good commercial relationships with local businesses. So a traditional union rep wants your vote to start sharing your payday to finance a long-term fortune for OTHERS and risk some of the conditions of your bonanza…what do you say? You ready to hold out? I’ve a raised a conscientious, socially aware (a little too much) daughter and I know her answer. If you’re talented enough to make the 85 man and your university gives up a small percentage of their TV money and other marketing payout to set a minimum amount for each player PLUS whatever scratch you can generate for yourself? OR long drawn out labor hold-outs…😴 DOA. Union’s worst nightmare is short attention spans.
 
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#184
#184
butchna said:
Yeah…but different circumstances. The NFL in its infancy, was a bunch of owners with their own money and anything their new venture generated primarily went into their pockets. On the other end, you had a bunch of mostly college graduates who received relative pennies on the dollar in compensation and generally had to work second jobs or live accordingly. No free agency…no options. It wasn’t a 3-5 year window before a minimum $705,000 year salary if you had the required skillset. Unions fighting for those steady gains and (eventually) free agency were vitally necessary. Here you have kids from different financial situations, mostly not the bread winners in their household, but even in the case that they are not banking on attending college for more than four years. The best arrive with some hefty NIL bucks and a good commercial relationships with local businesses. So a traditional union rep wants your vote to start sharing your payday to finance a long-term fortune for OTHERS and risk some of the conditions of your bonanza…what do you say? You ready to hold out? I’ve a raised a conscientious, socially aware (a little too much) daughter and I know her answer. If you’re talented enough to make the 85 man and your university gives up a small percentage of their TV money and other marketing payout to set a minimum amount for each player PLUS whatever scratch you can generate for yourself? OR long drawn out labor hold-outs…😴 DOA. Union’s worst nightmare is short attention spans.
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Dan Reeves spoke at an FCA dinner a few years back and in talking about his playing career and relationship with Tom Laundry said he used to sell cars in the offseason. He was going to quit playing football because he could make more money selling cars and Laundy offered him a player/coach position so he could get paid a little more.
 
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#185
#185
BanditVol said:
lol. DEFINITELY a troll. And one with a really stupid handle also.

I mean seriously...Jethro Tull has some decent songs, but I once heard an interview of one of them whining that they didn't get enough credit for "using a flute in a rock band". I mean...seriously. First of all, no self-respecting adult male should EVER play the flute. Period dot. Let alone use it in a rock band. Let alone WHINE about not getting recognized for it!

If you are trying to be an idiot...congrats! You have greatly exceeded expectations 😄
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Chicago, the Marshall Tucker Band, Genesis, the Moody Blues, Traffic, and Led Zeppelin send their regards.
 
#186
#186
S.C. OrangeMan said:
There are no legal controls in NIL. So says the Supreme Court.
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Won’t get into another long debate over a resolution once the NCAA accepts they cannot limit what an athlete can earn with NIL , but to avoid your 20 top scenario, they will welcome every player to earn what they can, but address competitive balance with NIL caps for those on each teams roster, regardless of sources. Just like they do with scholly and PWO caps. Most logical and consistent control measure. Requiring reporting of income to play alongside the majority of D1 and D2 that does not does not seem like a reach. Ruling said they cannot limit it, did not say they could not keep track as the only legal source of income in the amateur athletic setting. Would only require setting cap limits and reporting windows for each sport’s seasons. Would simply force distribution of NIL participants across a wider base, just like schollies. Would be free to negotiate future seasons deals at any time and report it(them) in next window. Don’t want to wait? Take your money and hit the portal if school won’t accept the hit.

It is my UNDERSTANDING that NIL. deals cannot be performances based or limit school selection.
 
#187
#187
hog88 said:
Dan Reeves spoke at an FCA dinner a few years back and in talking about his playing career and relationship with Tom Laundry said he used to sell cars in the offseason. He was going to quit playing football because he could make more money selling cars and Laundy offered him a player/coach position so he could get paid a little more.
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Gale Sayers made enough money to put a down payment on a house but provided for his family working as a stockbroker.
 
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#188
#188
GUNTERSVOL said:
Won’t get into another long debate over a resolution once the NCAA accepts they cannot limit what an athlete can earn with NIL , but to avoid your 20 top scenario, they will welcome every player to earn what they can, but address competitive balance with NIL caps for those on each teams roster, regardless of sources. Just like they do with scholly and PWO caps. Most logical and consistent control measure. Requiring reporting of income to play alongside the majority of D1 and D2 that does not does not seem like a reach. Ruling said they cannot limit it, did not say they could not keep track as the only legal source of income in the amateur athletic setting. Would only require setting cap limits and reporting windows for each sport’s seasons. Would simply force distribution of NIL participants across a wider base, just like schollies. Would be free to negotiate future seasons deals at any time and report it(them) in next window. Don’t want to wait? Take your money and hit the portal if school won’t accept the hit.

It is my UNDERSTANDING that NIL. deals cannot be performances based or limit school selection.
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NIL cap limits are a violation of the Sherman Antitrust Act.
 
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#189
#189
GUNTERSVOL said:
Won’t get into another long debate over a resolution once the NCAA accepts they cannot limit what an athlete can earn with NIL , but to avoid your 20 top scenario, they will welcome every player to earn what they can, but address competitive balance with NIL caps for those on each teams roster, regardless of sources. Just like they do with scholly and PWO caps. Most logical and consistent control measure. Requiring reporting of income to play alongside the majority of D1 and D2 that does not does not seem like a reach. Ruling said they cannot limit it, did not say they could not keep track as the only legal source of income in the amateur athletic setting. Would only require setting cap limits and reporting windows for each sport’s seasons. Would simply force distribution of NIL participants across a wider base, just like schollies. Would be free to negotiate future seasons deals at any time and report it(them) in next window. Don’t want to wait? Take your money and hit the portal if school won’t accept the hit.

It is my UNDERSTANDING that NIL. deals cannot be performances based or limit school selection.
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Your last statement is correct, however, it’s easy to use loopholes. For example: “hey Nico, we want to offer you a deal. You can still play for anyone you want, but we’re going to need to to be present at 15 events during the fall that will happen every Friday evening at 7pm in Knoxville, TN. If you want to sign with Southern Cal, that’s fine, as long as you’re in Knoxville every Friday during football season.”

It doesn’t limit school selection, but yes it does. Lol.
 
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#191
#191
The NCAA has had decades to prepare for NIL, Portal, etc. Ed Obannon and other ex-NCAA players brought the issues up and the NCAA was to busy counting their fortunes.

I’m not sure anybody understands 100% of the NIL. Will mistakes be made, of course. If the NCAA demands perfection in the application then it should have better prepared for NIL to begin with.
 
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#192
#192
hog88 said:
I love listening to the old-timers stories.
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Hated Barry Switzer his entire coaching career. If he writes a book or is at an event where he’s spinning old Oklahoma recruiting yarns, I’m front in line. The book on Gale Sayers I referenced was I Am Third…foreword by Bill Cosby. 😏
 
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#193
#193
S.C. OrangeMan said:
NIL cap limits are a violation of the Sherman Antitrust Act.
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How? Folks keep referring to this, but I'm don't see how it conflicts with that. NIL Cap limits for individual athletes does not prohibit fair competition among the collectives. That seems like it would allow more smaller collectives to actually participate verses limiting the number of collectives. A player can still shop around to find a collective that will off her/him the top of the limit.
 
#195
#195
volfan102455 said:
How? Folks keep referring to this, but I'm don't see how it conflicts with that. NIL Cap limits for individual athletes does not prohibit fair competition among the collectives. That seems like it would allow more smaller collectives to actually participate verses limiting the number of collectives. A player can still shop around to find a collective that will off her/him the top of the limit.
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All you would do is force money to be changed hand under the table again
 
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#196
#196
Rockytop10nessee said:
Your last statement is correct, however, it’s easy to use loopholes. For example: “hey Nico, we want to offer you a deal. You can still play for anyone you want, but we’re going to need to to be present at 15 events during the fall that will happen every Friday evening at 7pm in Knoxville, TN. If you want to sign with Southern Cal, that’s fine, as long as you’re in Knoxville every Friday during football season.”

It doesn’t limit school selection, but yes it does. Lol.
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If NIL wasn't tied to the school, players would not be transferring to another school for better NIL deals.
 
#199
#199
Rockytop10nessee said:
Your last statement is correct, however, it’s easy to use loopholes. For example: “hey Nico, we want to offer you a deal. You can still play for anyone you want, but we’re going to need to to be present at 15 events during the fall that will happen every Friday evening at 7pm in Knoxville, TN. If you want to sign with Southern Cal, that’s fine, as long as you’re in Knoxville every Friday during football season.”

It doesn’t limit school selection, but yes it does. Lol.
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Got that, but it would provide protection from anti cap forces being able to use not being able to play for a team because of cap limits as a restriction effort. A players value should be good in Tuscaloosa OR Starkville OR Memphis, etc.
 
#200
#200
volfan102455 said:
How? Folks keep referring to this, but I'm don't see how it conflicts with that. NIL Cap limits for individual athletes does not prohibit fair competition among the collectives. That seems like it would allow more smaller collectives to actually participate verses limiting the number of collectives. A player can still shop around to find a collective that will off her/him the top of the limit.
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It's wage fixing. You cannot agree with other employers in your industry to cap how much your labor can earn.

All the grocery stores (universities) cannot get together and agree that no butchers (players) can be paid more than $X.

It's illegal to wage fix. That should be obvious.
 
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