Greenland

[EasternVol]

Trump is for what is in the vital security interests of the US therefore the left must take a stand against what is in the vital security interests of the US


Object Zero
@Object_Zero_
·
4h


Greenland - As viewed from a proper map

Why Greenland?

Well because Moscow bases almost all of their strategic military assets on the Kola Peninsula next to Finland. This is where the Russian ICBM silos, submarine bases, and their strategic bombers are.

If you look at the flight path (ballistic or powered) from Kola to anywhere on the lower 48, then everything goes over Greenland.

Greenland is the theatre where any strategic exchange between Washington and Moscow is contested.

If you want to intercept a ballistic missile, the best point to do so is at the apogee, at the top of the flight path. The shortest route for an interceptor to get to an apogee is from directly below the apogee.

That’s where Greenland is.

So, without stating what should happen here, this is **why** the Trump administration says they **need** Greenland for national security.

The other thing that is happening is that the Northern Passage through the Arctic is opening up, and soon there will be Chinese cargo ships sailing through the Arctic to Rotterdam. It’s faster than the Suez and the ships aren’t limited to Suezmax size so China and EU trade is going to accelerate a lot.

This means Chinese submarines will also be venturing under the Arctic into the Northern Atlantic, IF THEY AREN’T ALREADY DOING SO.

Hence, the North East coast of Greenland serves not 1 but 2 critical strategic security objectives of US national security.

If this wasn’t clear to you, please understand that the Mercator global map projection is for children and journalists only. It is not a useful guide to where any countries or territories actually are in the real world that we live in. No self respecting adult should be using Mercator for their worldview. Anyone saying “there must be some other secret reason for Trump being interested in Greenland” is a certified ignoramus.

View attachment 804022




Could it be the EU does not want Trump to have control of Greenland where Trump could regulate cargo ships that go through the Northwest passage to Europe?

Maybe you should turn that in to your Social Studies teacher for feedback. You'd lose points for thinking that countries regulate shipping in international waters.

 

[jmacvols1]

No mention of bootstraps, or cutting corruption. You know we're broke, right?
Greenland has a high poverty rate because a lot of people there have a subsistence lifestyle in a harsh environment. If that's what they want, there's nothing wrong with it.
Do you think throwing money there will get them out of poverty permanently? If so, how?
Your wanting high welfare benefits for Greenlanders while domestic social programs are cut would be puzzling if you weren't such an obvious Trump minion.

if you are now concerned about the country being broke, then you would be in favor of addressing those things that are breaking the country as all these socialists programs from social security, medicare/medicare. SNAP. gov't house, child care and all the hundreds billions of fraud associated with them, right?

The reason for Greenland are strategically important to the security of the country first and foremost. In the process Trump's plan allows for them to continue to be self-governed and would do more good for them than Denmark ever has.

So are you for what is important for the US or do you want the US to allow itself to vulnerable to China, Russia et al?

You are only against this because Trump is for it.

 

[NashVol11]

if you are now concerned about the country being broke, then you would be in favor of addressing those things that are breaking the country as all these socialists programs from social security, medicare/medicare. SNAP. gov't house, child care and all the hundreds billions of fraud associated with them, right?

The reason for Greenland are strategically important to the security of the country first and foremost. In the process Trump's plan allows for them to continue to be self-governed and would do more good for them than Denmark ever has.

So are you for what is important for the US or do you want the US to allow itself to vulnerable to China, Russia et al?

You are only against this because Trump is for it.

The last sentence is projection. We don't need to take over Greenland for security at all, and you just complained about the social safety net bankrupting us while advocating for bringing in and financially supporting another entire country of people

 

[LSU-SIU]

The last sentence is projection. We don't need to take over Greenland for security at all, and you just complained about the social safety net bankrupting us while advocating for bringing in and financially supporting another entire country of people

Most likely the financial rules are in the process of being rewritten.

 

[EasternVol]

if you are now concerned about the country being broke, then you would be in favor of addressing those things that are breaking the country as all these socialists programs from social security, medicare/medicare. SNAP. gov't house, child care and all the hundreds billions of fraud associated with them, right?

The fraud yes, the programs not so much. Why do you want Greenlanders to get what Americans can't? You're not really America First.

The reason for Greenland are strategically important to the security of the country first and foremost. In the process Trump's plan allows for them to continue to be self-governed and would do more good for them than Denmark ever has.

Yeah, right. The strategic importance is marginal and we haven't done that much for the folks in the South Pacific.

So are you for what is important for the US or do you want the US to allow itself to vulnerable to China, Russia et al?

That's a fool's choice.

You are only against this because Trump is for it.

I'm against it because it's stupid and counterproductive.

 

[jmacvols1]

Maybe you should turn that in to your Social Studies teacher for feedback. You'd lose points for thinking that countries regulate shipping in international waters.

Canada claims all the NWP lies in its territory therefore Canada can regulate the traffic through it. So is it international or under Canadian control?

Google AI

• Canadian Sovereignty Claim: Canada claims the Northwest Passage lies entirely within its internal waters and that it has full sovereignty and the right to regulate all traffic. This claim is based on historic title and the use and occupancy of the sea ice by the Inuit people for millennia.
• Greenland's Geography: Greenland controls a key access point to the North Atlantic and the GIUK gap, but the bulk of the actual Northwest Passage route winds through the Canadian Arctic Islands, which are under Canadian jurisdiction. Control of Greenland would enhance the U.S. military and strategic presence in the broader Arctic, but it would not transfer sovereignty over Canadian waters.
• The 1988 Agreement: The U.S. and Canada currently manage the dispute through a 1988 "agree to disagree" framework, in which the U.S. agrees to ask for Canada's consent for U.S. icebreakers to pass through the contested waters, without prejudice to either side's legal position

=====================

If US took control of Greenland the US would have control over eastern end of the NWP. If Canada can control what they claim they own of the NWP then Trump could control the eastern exit of the NWP. Why should the US "ask consent" from Canada for ice breakers to go through the NWP if its international waters?

 

[jmacvols1]

The fraud yes, the programs not so much. Why do you want Greenlanders to get what Americans can't? You're not really America First.

Yeah, right. The strategic importance is marginal and we haven't done that much for the folks in the South Pacific.

That's a fool's choice.

I'm against it because it's stupid and counterproductive.

I never said anything and Greenland getting more than the average American.

The issue with Greenland is first and foremost its vital strategic importance to the US. You claim it's marginal and stupid...glad you are not running the country.

 

[EasternVol]

Canada claims all the NWP lies in its territory therefore Canada can regulate the traffic through it. So is it international or under Canadian control?

Google AI

• Canadian Sovereignty Claim: Canada claims the Northwest Passage lies entirely within its internal waters and that it has full sovereignty and the right to regulate all traffic. This claim is based on historic title and the use and occupancy of the sea ice by the Inuit people for millennia.
• Greenland's Geography: Greenland controls a key access point to the North Atlantic and the GIUK gap, but the bulk of the actual Northwest Passage route winds through the Canadian Arctic Islands, which are under Canadian jurisdiction. Control of Greenland would enhance the U.S. military and strategic presence in the broader Arctic, but it would not transfer sovereignty over Canadian waters.
• The 1988 Agreement: The U.S. and Canada currently manage the dispute through a 1988 "agree to disagree" framework, in which the U.S. agrees to ask for Canada's consent for U.S. icebreakers to pass through the contested waters, without prejudice to either side's legal position

=====================

If US took control of Greenland the US would have control over eastern end of the NWP. If Canada can control what they claim they own of the NWP then Trump could control the eastern exit of the NWP. Why should the US "ask consent" from Canada for ice breakers to go through if its international waters?

You better not turn that in to your Social Studies teacher. You'd never pass.
What internal waters would international shipping pass through going past the island of Greenland?

 

[jmacvols1]

You better not turn that in to your Social Studies teacher. You'd never pass.
What internal waters would international shipping pass through going past the island of Greenland?

you did not deal with Canada. Canada claims all of the NWP is in its territory so it can control the NWP. But you said the NWP was international. Why should the US ask Canadian consent to send ice breakers through the NWP if it's international waters as you claimed?

I am for Trump in his deal with Greenland and doing all he can to kick out and keep out Russia/China/any US enemies of the US out of the Western hemisphere completely.

======================================

AI Overview

"Yes, the U.S. has historically asked Canada for consent to send icebreakers through the Northwest Passage (NWP) under a pragmatic 1988 Arctic Cooperation Agreement, which acknowledges Canada's claim of sovereignty while the U.S. maintains it's international waters, allowing cooperation on research transits without formally conceding its legal position. This approach, established after the 1985 Polar Sea incident, involves the U.S. seeking permission for its icebreakers, a move that respects Canadian sovereignty while preserving U.S. arguments about the NWP being an international strait."

 

[LSU-SIU]

you did not deal with Canada. Canada claims all of the NWP is in its territory so it can control the NWP. But you said the NWP was international. Why should the US ask Canadian consent to send ice breakers through the NWP if it's international waters as you claimed?

I am for Trump in his deal with Greenland and doing all he can to kick out and keep out Russia/China/any US enemies of the US out of the Western hemisphere completely.

He will probably deal with Canada as well.

 

[BernardKingGOAT]

I never said anything and Greenland getting more than the average American.

The issue with Greenland is first and foremost its vital strategic importance to the US. You claim it's marginal and stupid...glad you are not running the country.

It's mostly of vital profit importance to the Donald for himself, his family and his band of buddies

 

[NashVol11]

I never said anything and Greenland getting more than the average American.

The issue with Greenland is first and foremost its vital strategic importance to the US. You claim it's marginal and stupid...glad you are not running the country.

It has not held any vital strategic importance through 250 years of our history, but Trump said we need it so now that's your opinion

 

[jmacvols1]

He will probably deal with Canada as well.

Canada would have to deal with Trump.....I would put my money on Trump if I were a betting person.

 

[jmacvols1]

It's mostly of vital profit importance to the Donald for himself, his family and his band of buddies

you just don't like Trump

 

[LSU-SIU]

Canada would have to deal with Trump.....I would put my money on Trump if I were a betting person.

There is limited hand to play absent the big players i.e. China. If China wants to stop all this, they probably can, if there are already deals... they probably won't.

 

[jmacvols1]

It has not held any vital strategic importance through 250 years of our history, but Trump said we need it so now that's your opinion

GROK:



No, the claim that "Greenland has never held vital military importance" is incorrect. Greenland has been strategically vital for military purposes since at least World War II, and its importance has persisted through the Cold War and into the present day, primarily due to its unique geographic position in the Arctic—bridging North America, Europe, and the polar routes.

World War II (1939–1945)

When Nazi Germany occupied Denmark in April 1940, Greenland (a Danish territory) became vulnerable. The Allies feared Germany could use it as a base for attacks on North America (e.g., via bombers or submarines targeting Washington, D.C.) or to disrupt Atlantic shipping. Greenland's cryolite mine at Ivittuut was the world's primary source of this mineral, essential for aluminum production in Allied aircraft.

• The U.S. signed a 1941 "Defense of Greenland" agreement with the Danish ambassador (without full Danish government approval), allowing American bases, airfields, harbors, and weather stations.
• Greenland served as a key refueling stop for transatlantic flights ferrying aircraft to Europe and hosted weather stations critical for forecasting in the North Atlantic and Europe (vital for operations like D-Day).
• A "weather war" unfolded, with Germany attempting secret stations on the east coast; the Allies (including the Northeast Greenland Sledge Patrol) countered them to maintain meteorological superiority.

Without Allied control, German occupation could have severely hampered transatlantic supply lines and weather intelligence, worsening Britain's position in the Battle of the Atlantic.Cold War Era (1947–1991)Post-WWII, the U.S. viewed Greenland as "indispensable to the safety of the United States" (per 1946 State Department assessments). It became a midpoint for potential nuclear exchanges with the Soviet Union.

• The 1951 Greenland Defense Agreement (within NATO) allowed permanent U.S. bases.
• Thule Air Base (now Pituffik Space Base), built secretly in the early 1950s under Operation Blue Jay, hosted Strategic Air Command bombers (e.g., B-47s) as a dispersal/refueling point for strikes over the Arctic, reducing Soviet early warning time.
• It anchored the GIUK Gap (Greenland-Iceland-UK) for tracking Soviet submarines.
• The base housed the Ballistic Missile Early Warning System (BMEWS) from 1960, providing 15–30 minutes' notice of ICBM launches.
• At its peak, Thule supported ~10,000 personnel and nuclear-capable assets.

Greenland was central to U.S. nuclear deterrence and defense against Soviet bombers/missiles.Current Significance (as of January 2026)With Arctic ice melting, new shipping routes (e.g., Northwest and Northeast Passages) and resource access have emerged, heightening competition from Russia (remilitarizing the Arctic) and China (seeking influence via investments).

• Pituffik Space Base remains the U.S.'s northernmost installation, hosting the 12th Space Warning Squadron for missile early warning (feeding NORAD) and space surveillance/satellite control.
• It's key for monitoring polar missile/submarine threats and Arctic domain awareness.
• Under the 1951 agreement (updated 2004), the U.S. maintains a presence while respecting Danish sovereignty; Denmark's defense (via Joint Arctic Command) focuses on sovereignty patrols, search-and-rescue, and environmental protection, with U.S. cooperation.

Recent U.S. interest (e.g., repeated statements emphasizing "national security" needs amid Russia/China activities) underscores its ongoing vital role, though Denmark and Greenland firmly reject any takeover, warning it could threaten NATO.

In summary, Greenland's military importance stems from its location for early warning, basing, weather intelligence, and Arctic control—making it strategically critical across multiple eras, not "never" vital.

 

[LSU-SIU]

People should have been listening to da pootin over the last 10+ years.

The U.S. can crush most of its enemies without a shot being fired. Ole Vladimir has to be laughing his ass off.

 

[BernardKingGOAT]

you just don't like Trump

He's proven that his family is going to profit from every international move he's made for the US in this term. From market manipulation with the tariffs to our dealings in the ME. He's not even trying to hide it. Sorry, his interests are always put before the USA's interests

 

[NashVol11]

GROK:



No, the claim that "Greenland has never held vital military importance" is incorrect. Greenland has been strategically vital for military purposes since at least World War II, and its importance has persisted through the Cold War and into the present day, primarily due to its unique geographic position in the Arctic—bridging North America, Europe, and the polar routes.

World War II (1939–1945)

When Nazi Germany occupied Denmark in April 1940, Greenland (a Danish territory) became vulnerable. The Allies feared Germany could use it as a base for attacks on North America (e.g., via bombers or submarines targeting Washington, D.C.) or to disrupt Atlantic shipping. Greenland's cryolite mine at Ivittuut was the world's primary source of this mineral, essential for aluminum production in Allied aircraft.

• The U.S. signed a 1941 "Defense of Greenland" agreement with the Danish ambassador (without full Danish government approval), allowing American bases, airfields, harbors, and weather stations.
• Greenland served as a key refueling stop for transatlantic flights ferrying aircraft to Europe and hosted weather stations critical for forecasting in the North Atlantic and Europe (vital for operations like D-Day).
• A "weather war" unfolded, with Germany attempting secret stations on the east coast; the Allies (including the Northeast Greenland Sledge Patrol) countered them to maintain meteorological superiority.

Without Allied control, German occupation could have severely hampered transatlantic supply lines and weather intelligence, worsening Britain's position in the Battle of the Atlantic.Cold War Era (1947–1991)Post-WWII, the U.S. viewed Greenland as "indispensable to the safety of the United States" (per 1946 State Department assessments). It became a midpoint for potential nuclear exchanges with the Soviet Union.

• The 1951 Greenland Defense Agreement (within NATO) allowed permanent U.S. bases.
• Thule Air Base (now Pituffik Space Base), built secretly in the early 1950s under Operation Blue Jay, hosted Strategic Air Command bombers (e.g., B-47s) as a dispersal/refueling point for strikes over the Arctic, reducing Soviet early warning time.
• It anchored the GIUK Gap (Greenland-Iceland-UK) for tracking Soviet submarines.
• The base housed the Ballistic Missile Early Warning System (BMEWS) from 1960, providing 15–30 minutes' notice of ICBM launches.
• At its peak, Thule supported ~10,000 personnel and nuclear-capable assets.

Greenland was central to U.S. nuclear deterrence and defense against Soviet bombers/missiles.Current Significance (as of January 2026)With Arctic ice melting, new shipping routes (e.g., Northwest and Northeast Passages) and resource access have emerged, heightening competition from Russia (remilitarizing the Arctic) and China (seeking influence via investments).

• Pituffik Space Base remains the U.S.'s northernmost installation, hosting the 12th Space Warning Squadron for missile early warning (feeding NORAD) and space surveillance/satellite control.
• It's key for monitoring polar missile/submarine threats and Arctic domain awareness.
• Under the 1951 agreement (updated 2004), the U.S. maintains a presence while respecting Danish sovereignty; Denmark's defense (via Joint Arctic Command) focuses on sovereignty patrols, search-and-rescue, and environmental protection, with U.S. cooperation.

Recent U.S. interest (e.g., repeated statements emphasizing "national security" needs amid Russia/China activities) underscores its ongoing vital role, though Denmark and Greenland firmly reject any takeover, warning it could threaten NATO.

In summary, Greenland's military importance stems from its location for early warning, basing, weather intelligence, and Arctic control—making it strategically critical across multiple eras, not "never" vital.

None of those things require American ownership, exhibit 1 million that people who ask AI to think for them are the worst of us

 

[LSU-SIU]

None of those things require American ownership, exhibit 1 million that people who ask AI to think for them are the worst of us

I thought we were at the point of - own nothing and be happy.

 

[LouderVol]

GROK:



No, the claim that "Greenland has never held vital military importance" is incorrect. Greenland has been strategically vital for military purposes since at least World War II, and its importance has persisted through the Cold War and into the present day, primarily due to its unique geographic position in the Arctic—bridging North America, Europe, and the polar routes.

World War II (1939–1945)

When Nazi Germany occupied Denmark in April 1940, Greenland (a Danish territory) became vulnerable. The Allies feared Germany could use it as a base for attacks on North America (e.g., via bombers or submarines targeting Washington, D.C.) or to disrupt Atlantic shipping. Greenland's cryolite mine at Ivittuut was the world's primary source of this mineral, essential for aluminum production in Allied aircraft.

• The U.S. signed a 1941 "Defense of Greenland" agreement with the Danish ambassador (without full Danish government approval), allowing American bases, airfields, harbors, and weather stations.
• Greenland served as a key refueling stop for transatlantic flights ferrying aircraft to Europe and hosted weather stations critical for forecasting in the North Atlantic and Europe (vital for operations like D-Day).
• A "weather war" unfolded, with Germany attempting secret stations on the east coast; the Allies (including the Northeast Greenland Sledge Patrol) countered them to maintain meteorological superiority.

Without Allied control, German occupation could have severely hampered transatlantic supply lines and weather intelligence, worsening Britain's position in the Battle of the Atlantic.Cold War Era (1947–1991)Post-WWII, the U.S. viewed Greenland as "indispensable to the safety of the United States" (per 1946 State Department assessments). It became a midpoint for potential nuclear exchanges with the Soviet Union.

• The 1951 Greenland Defense Agreement (within NATO) allowed permanent U.S. bases.
• Thule Air Base (now Pituffik Space Base), built secretly in the early 1950s under Operation Blue Jay, hosted Strategic Air Command bombers (e.g., B-47s) as a dispersal/refueling point for strikes over the Arctic, reducing Soviet early warning time.
• It anchored the GIUK Gap (Greenland-Iceland-UK) for tracking Soviet submarines.
• The base housed the Ballistic Missile Early Warning System (BMEWS) from 1960, providing 15–30 minutes' notice of ICBM launches.
• At its peak, Thule supported ~10,000 personnel and nuclear-capable assets.

Greenland was central to U.S. nuclear deterrence and defense against Soviet bombers/missiles.Current Significance (as of January 2026)With Arctic ice melting, new shipping routes (e.g., Northwest and Northeast Passages) and resource access have emerged, heightening competition from Russia (remilitarizing the Arctic) and China (seeking influence via investments).

• Pituffik Space Base remains the U.S.'s northernmost installation, hosting the 12th Space Warning Squadron for missile early warning (feeding NORAD) and space surveillance/satellite control.
• It's key for monitoring polar missile/submarine threats and Arctic domain awareness.
• Under the 1951 agreement (updated 2004), the U.S. maintains a presence while respecting Danish sovereignty; Denmark's defense (via Joint Arctic Command) focuses on sovereignty patrols, search-and-rescue, and environmental protection, with U.S. cooperation.

Recent U.S. interest (e.g., repeated statements emphasizing "national security" needs amid Russia/China activities) underscores its ongoing vital role, though Denmark and Greenland firmly reject any takeover, warning it could threaten NATO.

In summary, Greenland's military importance stems from its location for early warning, basing, weather intelligence, and Arctic control—making it strategically critical across multiple eras, not "never" vital.

Pituffik is still under US control. as far as I have been able to find all of the defensive systems we put in place during the cold war, or their replacements, are still there.

Denmark/Greenland are still part of NATO which gives us further leeway.

greenland is already part of our shield. we don't need more control of it to establish a safety net. its already in place without the US paying for Greenland's poor.

Greenland is still pretty icy. its not like we could suddenly convert the entire island into a fort to reach some critical threshold of protection.

 

[LSU-SIU]

Pituffik is still under US control. as far as I have been able to find all of the defensive systems we put in place during the cold war, or their replacements, are still there.

Denmark/Greenland are still part of NATO which gives us further leeway.

greenland is already part of our shield. we don't need more control of it to establish a safety net. its already in place without the US paying for Greenland's poor.

Greenland is still pretty icy. its not like we could suddenly convert the entire island into a fort to reach some critical threshold of protection.

Europe are the losers, Greenland would be protected from the rest of European countries. Norway is one I spoke about long ago in the Ukraine thread, well, sitting duck.

I am glad I got to live in Europe for a few years, it was nice knowing them.

 

[MontyPython]

They would be dumb not to take the offer. If NATO and Denmark are truly concerned about the defense of all NATO territory including Greenland then they would accept Trump's deal. Not accepting proves they have no real concern over Greenland...evidently Denmark just wants to own Greenland out of arrogance showing no true concern for the people of Greenland. Trump is willing to raise their standard of living something Denmark has not, will not do. And Greenland remains self-governing with the full defense of the US military.

I would go a step further and say if the deal is refused US leaves NATO and European countries defend themselves with their own money. And if Russia or China make any kind of move on Greenland then Greenland will for a fact become part of the US regardless of what Denmark says for Denmark really has no concern about US vital security interests. Cannot have Russia, China, Iran in the backyard of the US.

You, sir, are living in a delusional, bizarro world.

 

[MontyPython]

If Trump actually wants to do the right thing here with Greenland, he needs to put big giant ****ing cash on the table. Pay Denmark for the territory, but more importantly, pay big money to raise the standard of living in Greenland. Give them a reason to want to join us.

All this retarded power flexing by Trump is just stupid.

I actually think the United States potentially acquiring Greenland would be a major coup similar to us buying Alaska from Russia back in the day. That proved an amazing investment.

But just stop with the sabre rattling and threats.

 

[jmacvols1]

You, sir, are living in a delusional, bizarro world.

Trump is living rent free in the mind of Denmark