GAME THREAD: @ LSU, Thursday, 6 pm EST, ESPN

[LasVegasBill23]

View attachment 816735

what a great response good going Coach..... well said

 

[LasVegasBill23]

Now that's its been several hours, I have to say I don't think this team has completely quit, yet they are lazy. We're lacking defensively intensity and of course our athleticism + plus scoring was non existent (except Civil).

LSU literally showed our girls what they want to be but they aren't there yet. Like I said, Fulwiley had one of her better games last night of the season and you couldn't take smile off her grill due to our defense taking a backseat. She, Williams, and both Johnsons blew by us on every transaction play just about and Fulwiley stayed in her comfort zone as she stayed right! Their guards simply outperformed ours and they wasn't made to feel uncomfortable one time. THEY ALSO SHARED THE BALL, WAS PATIENT ON OFFENSIVE POSSESSIONS AND NOT PLAYING HERO(INE) BASKETBALL (Cooper I'm talking to you basically).

Overall I'm glad this month of February is done. This has probably been one of the most brutal stretch runs in Lady Vols in program history. My only hope now, while it may not be the rest of this season, but going forward this will make our team better for the future and recognize we can half-ass our performance on the court. In order to beat the best we have to play a strong and determined 40 minutes all game, every game.

Good post LVD. Last night was improvement yet obvious they are not there yet. Your words strong and determined certainly in play.

We need to shore up our defense for sure. On offense we need to work on spacing and movement. Cannot depend on movement being defined as just the person with the ball. Work harder on transition defense.

And if Kim wants to stay with her system, recruit those who will buy in and are athletically a good fit for that system.

 

[madtownvol]

@madtownvol, I feel confident you read most of the posts on this forum, so you've likely read my posts raising strong questions about Kim's system., although they may not have been top of mind when you wrote this response. I'm not defending the system here. I'm criticizing Andraya's comment. She basically said that if players sometimes play the system they are taught with effort and skill and it works, but they just refuse (or at least some of them) to do so consistently, then the head coach should cater to the recalcitrant players and go looking for an approach that they will play in the middle of a season. Crazy!

Notice what Andraya did not say: She did not say, "These players cannot execute this system." She did not say, "This system won't work at this level." What she said was, "The results this year aren't good and it's up to Kim to abandon what she's done and find something this group of players will be willing to play." Again, that's cray-cray. But it sounds good. It sounds l;ike a smart statement. It gets everyone to nod even if there's no substance or analysis behind it. If she had offered an analysis of why this set of players aren't able to run the system as well as last year's players did, I'd have been all ears. Or if she had offered up a cogent critique of they system's possibilities to reach the Final Four, I'd have been there. She didn't. She just blamed the coach. Simple, easy, and not all that enlightening. There are at least a score of commentators on this board who have said exactly the same thing. Which is probably why what she said was so well received. I'm not criticizing Andraya overall, but this wasn't her best moment.

Hi Retro,

Per Draya, I will just ditto GLV's response above.

On criticisms of the "system, this is not a "mistakes were made" situation. The problem is not the system acting as it own intentional agent. No, the problem is with "the coaching" and that means that the head coach CKC is responsible. That is the rubicon you seem a bit hesitant to cross. You like detailed arguments so on that topic.

1. This may be the most "fundamentals" challenged team in the history of the LVs' program, though some late era Holly teams are also in the conversation.

Defensively, they are really bad in their court positioning and defensive stances, very undisciplined about reaching in to commit silly fouls (as getting steals seems to the primary objective) and fouling 3 pt shooters who are firing up hail marys as the shot clock expires.

Offensively, they put the moribund in stagnant. Only Latham seems to have any sense of consistent off ball movement and the timing and geometry of cutting to the hoop.

It appears that so much time has been invested in learning the [easily broken] "press" system that there was no time for coaching the basics of how to defend and execute an offense. Shockingly, that coaching "system" is not a formula for sustained success

2. Managing players

Zee is a physically gifted player who has no idea how to play in the low post.

Mia is a gem of a player. But you can not become a proficient PG playing in starts and fits. It worked okay last season for Spencer because she was a 5th year player with tons of experience under her belt.

Mya is a solid back-up who can hold down the fort. Her role should be spotting Mia in the last minute or two of each quarter and running the team at the end of cupcake blowout games. Coop and Robertson should only be the "break glass in case of emergency" PG options.

I could go on but in assessing a Head Coach you have to judge by the results on the floor. It is not about how much you like the coach or how improved they are becoming, through the repeated practice, in talking to the press after embarrassing losses.

One can argue that the pre-season rankings were inflated but taking a top ten team to a bubble team, with a relatively healthy squad is, in my view not an sign of "excellent" coaching.

 

[madtownvol]

So there we have it, ineluctable proof of a moral victory. Yes, she handled the criticism with forthright acknowledgement and with class. I admire her for that.

Meanwhile, back at the basketball game, some inexplicable combination of coaching (or perhaps lack thereof), casting, performance, and competition have dealt the long-suffering fans yet another ration of deja-vu.

Huizinga's Homo Ludens explains our cultural need for games. Wouldn’t it be nice to have one that didn’t disintegrate in the second half!

There is no Ludic in this Lady Vol team.....

 

[1reVOLver]

There is no Ludic in this Lady Vol team.....

Yeahbut…what about lucid?

¿El Cid?

Lucy?

 

[madtownvol]

Yeahbut…what about lucid?

¿El Cid?

Lucy?

View attachment 816794

A most interesting analogy. But who is the "system"-- Lucy or the Football. I am pretty confident who Charlie Brown is....

 

[Amb3096]

One can argue that the pre-season rankings were inflated but taking a top ten team to a bubble team, with a relatively healthy squad is, in my view not an sign of "excellent" coaching.

I think they were just overrated at the start of the season, and their preseason ranking didn't take into consideration freshmen growing pains and transfer assimiliation. NC State was also a top 10 team who fell by the wayside, but Wes Moore is still a fantastic coach.

 

[madtownvol]

I think they were just overrated at the start of the season, and their preseason ranking didn't take into consideration freshmen growing pains and transfer assimiliation. NC State was also a top 10 team who fell by the wayside, but Wes Moore is still a fantastic coach.

Good point but NCST is still 19-9 overall and 12-5 (4th) in the ACC conference. The word tailspin is not anywhere near the program.

 

[KTrain]

Where we go from here regardless of how this season ends is the retention of the freshman players at least most of them. Two solid freshman coming in am ok if Latham and Cooper are the only two coming back and even if only Latham. A mass exodos will be the end for Caldwell as no way to recover losing an entire roster and not saying she will. I do see some rumblings about several players hitting the portal hopefully that is not true.
If you have five or more back next season with the two incoming freshman to build on you can easily find five portal players that would produce better than the ones we had this season. Retention and portal are going to be huge for any step forward next season.

Well I hope we get all the freshman back and the twins IMO Mya would have hardly played any except scrub time on any other Top 25ish P4 team. That should keep their dad from pulling the plug if he has any acumen on basketball. If they want to keep them together this is probably the best place with Kim going 10 deep and 4 of the 10 players get around 10 minutes. I just don't see Mya getting any at most P4s and if you get one 5'3" player having 2 is a problem IMO. That's why I think a lot of the upper teams steer clear of a both or none mantra, unless they decide to play at different schools.

 

[RetroVol]

Below this is Claude's commentary on the substitution patterns in the LSU game, then the report itself. The report has names and I left them in because I think there's enough added value to justify the greater visual complexity. Here's Claude!--

Only 28 Tennessee sub events — a massive drop from the 42 against Oklahoma. And this is a very different game structurally:

4 full 5-5 swaps (Q1 6:09, Q2 7:29, Q3 4:02, Q3 2:26)
Only 3 events in all of Q4 — Caldwell barely touched the rotation down the stretch

The platoon identity is much cleaner here too. You can see the units:

Unit A: Barker/Robertson/MiPauldo/Prawl/Latham
Unit B: Hurst/Spearman/MyPauldo/Civil/Cooper

Those two alternate in the 5-5 swaps, with the 4-4s at Q1 7:45 and Q3 6:35 just being Unit A minus one player. Compare to Oklahoma where Caldwell had 14 sub events in Q4 alone — here she trusted her group and rode them.
Also notable: Barker is back in the rotation (6 events involving her), Boyd only got one cameo at Q3 4:02, and Wolfenbarger got a brief Q2 look. LSU meanwhile was almost entirely 1-1 subs (20 of 23 events) — classic Kim Mulkey tinkering around her core five.

Tennessee Lady Vols Substitution Patterns
vs LSU - Chronological (with player names)

	TN	LSU
Q1	9:15 Robertson → Civil 8:44 Prawl/Latham → Hurst/MyPauldo 7:45 Hurst/Spearman/MyPauldo/Cooper → Barker/MiPauldo/Prawl/Latham 6:09 Barker/MiPauldo/Civil/Prawl/Latham → Robertson/Hurst/Spearman/MyPauldo/Cooper 4:49 Hurst/MyPauldo → MiPauldo/Civil 2:22 Spearman/Cooper/Civil → Barker/Prawl/Latham 2:03 MiPauldo → Civil 0:51 Barker/Robertson/Prawl → Spearman/MiPauldo/Cooper	5:26 Joyner/Fl.Johnson/Za.Johnson/Richard → Knox/Hines/Koval/Fulwiley 2:22 Knox/Hines/Fulwiley/Koval → Fl.Johnson/Za.Johnson/Richard/Joyner 0:51 Za.Johnson → Knox
Q2	8:35 Spearman/Civil/Cooper → Barker/Robertson/Prawl 7:29 Barker/MiPauldo/Prawl/Latham/Robertson → Hurst/Spearman/Civil/Cooper/MyPauldo 6:56 MyPauldo → MiPauldo 6:41 Spearman → Barker 6:16 Barker/Hurst/Civil → Robertson/Prawl/Latham 4:56 Cooper → Civil 3:27 Latham → Wolfenbarger 2:45 Robertson/MiPauldo → Boyd/Cooper 1:49 Boyd/Prawl → Robertson/MiPauldo	10:00 Joyner → Fulwiley 7:57 M.Williams → Hines 7:10 Fl.Johnson → Koval 6:28 Koval → M.Williams 4:56 Knox → Za.Johnson 3:27 Fulwiley → Fl.Johnson 3:15 Richard → Fulwiley 3:00 Za.Johnson → Joyner 1:49 Joyner → Koval 0:41 Koval → Knox
Q3	10:00 Wolfenbarger/Civil → Spearman/Latham 8:36 Robertson/MiPauldo/Latham → Hurst/MyPauldo/Civil 6:35 Hurst/Spearman/MyPauldo/Cooper → Barker/MiPauldo/Prawl/Latham 6:22 Civil → Robertson 5:36 Prawl → Civil 4:02 Barker/Robertson/MiPauldo/Civil/Latham → Boyd/Hurst/Spearman/MyPauldo/Cooper 2:26 Boyd/Hurst/Spearman/MyPauldo/Cooper → Barker/Robertson/MiPauldo/Prawl/Latham 0:03 Barker/MiPauldo/Prawl → Spearman/Civil/Cooper	10:00 Hines/Fulwiley → Za.Johnson/Richard 6:35 Fl.Johnson → Fulwiley 6:22 Richard → Hines 4:02 Hines → Fl.Johnson
Q4	8:45 Spearman/Civil/Cooper → Barker/MiPauldo/Prawl 6:33 Barker/MiPauldo/Prawl/Latham → Hurst/Spearman/MyPauldo/Civil 4:26 Robertson/Hurst/MyPauldo → MiPauldo/Latham/Cooper	10:00 Knox → Richard 7:34 Fl.Johnson → Knox 4:26 Fulwiley → Fl.Johnson 2:47 Fl.Johnson → Fulwiley 0:45 M.Williams → Besselman 0:37 Besselman → Bourrage

 

[RetroVol]

I have said over the years, "Data will change people's minds, you just sometimes have to rub their noses in it." Well, I've rubbed my nose in the data long enough. I don't understand the substitution patterns. That may well be because of what Kim has said -- that they have never achieved the rotation stability this year that they did last, with the implication that has been due to erratic levels of focus and effort from key players. At least, that's the way I understand her. That said, looking at even just the 28 sub events for Tennessee above, much less at some of the games with even higher volumes, I do not understand how anyone could be making those decisions on a rational basis over the course of a game. They are just too fast and too frequent and too random. For example, what's the possible justification for rotating Barker in at 6:41 of Q2 on a 1:1 swap and then out again at 6:16at 6:16 as part of a 3:3? Or doing a 1:1 at 2:03 of Q1 bringing Civil in for MiPauldo? Civil is a guard, but she's not a primary ball handler, assist maker, and outside shooter like Mia. Or at least she hasn't been. Is she now? Does the team know how all the roles are changing as these occur? What's the difference in how the team is supposed to operate when Coop is the primary ball handler vs. MiPauldo or Robertson? If you go from two point-guard ball handlers to one, can everyone adjust on the fly?

Yeah, yeah. Positionless. I'm still lost. "Line change" substitutions" make sense, whether they work or not -- they are at least understandable. 4:4 around an anchoring player I could understand. Or 3:3 where the 3-4-5 positions swap. or 2:2 swapping the 1-2 positions -- all understandable and I can see the team adjusting on the fly. But some of this? I'm just lost. And that's just on offense. No idea how that affects defensive responsibilities.

And if the substitution patterns don't make sense, then the whole intensive effort, generate turnovers, get more shots than them approach falls apart. How much of this is a factor of this year's team, I don't know, but I've got to say that one of the things Kim needs to prioritize next year is figuring out how to keep whatever substitution approach she settles on less chaotic.

 

[RetroVol]

Hi Retro,

Per Draya, I will just ditto GLV's response above.

On criticisms of the "system, this is not a "mistakes were made" situation. The problem is not the system acting as it own intentional agent. No, the problem is with "the coaching" and that means that the head coach CKC is responsible. That is the rubicon you seem a bit hesitant to cross. You like detailed arguments so on that topic.

1. This may be the most "fundamentals" challenged team in the history of the LVs' program, though some late era Holly teams are also in the conversation.

Defensively, they are really bad in their court positioning and defensive stances, very undisciplined about reaching in to commit silly fouls (as getting steals seems to the primary objective) and fouling 3 pt shooters who are firing up hail marys as the shot clock expires.

Offensively, they put the moribund in stagnant. Only Latham seems to have any sense of consistent off ball movement and the timing and geometry of cutting to the hoop.

It appears that so much time has been invested in learning the [easily broken] "press" system that there was no time for coaching the basics of how to defend and execute an offense. Shockingly, that coaching "system" is not a formula for sustained success

2. Managing players

Zee is a physically gifted player who has no idea how to play in the low post.

Mia is a gem of a player. But you can not become a proficient PG playing in starts and fits. It worked okay last season for Spencer because she was a 5th year player with tons of experience under her belt.

Mya is a solid back-up who can hold down the fort. Her role should be spotting Mia in the last minute or two of each quarter and running the team at the end of cupcake blowout games. Coop and Robertson should only be the "break glass in case of emergency" PG options.

I could go on but in assessing a Head Coach you have to judge by the results on the floor. It is not about how much you like the coach or how improved they are becoming, through the repeated practice, in talking to the press after embarrassing losses.

One can argue that the pre-season rankings were inflated but taking a top ten team to a bubble team, with a relatively healthy squad is, in my view not an sign of "excellent" coaching.

I agree with everything you say that I have enough bball knowledge to understand. And if Andraya had said, "This system doesn't work regardless of players. It doesn't develop the right skills, put them in positions where they can succeed, give them the consecutive minutes they need to implement the skills they have practiced, etc.," I would have been fine. That would have been a good quick statement of the points you just made. Instead, I think the fairest reading of her comment is: this year's players have decided they don't want to play this way so Kim should have changed her system in the middle of the year to suit their moodiness." Maybe I'm wrong about that. Maybe that's not how it sounded to everybody else. But hearing it that way, I'm going absolutely not. Insteand, I'd agree with saying, "You've shown you can play this system and get good results. Just because you don't want to is not a reason for me to go looking for something that you might be willing to work at."

Bottom line, we're back to the main question. How much of the disappointing results this year is due to players who haven't given it their best shot, how much to a system that may be fundamentally flawed at this level (hard to know without a faithful implementation, but still), and how much to Kim's failure to take appropriate action to head off some of the "meltdown" behavior much earlier, tinker with the system where that was possible, or whatever.

Andraya was saying, "Tennessee should have a different coach." Fine. Say that. But don't pretend that this year is all or even primarily on Kim's failure to just run out in the middle of the season and find some other system, or even just gut hers (and all the promises she made to her players) and play a core 5-6, or whatever Andraya's preferred approach would have been. Nope. Don't see that.

And finally, as for Zee -- you're right. No clue how to play low post. Was that where she was recruited to play? Does Kim even run a 5?

 

[madtownvol]

I have said over the years, "Data will change people's minds, you just sometimes have to rub their noses in it." Well, I've rubbed my nose in the data long enough. I don't understand the substitution patterns. That may well be because of what Kim has said -- that they have never achieved the rotation stability this year that they did last, with the implication that has been due to erratic levels of focus and effort from key players. At least, that's the way I understand her. That said, looking at even just the 28 sub events for Tennessee above, much less at some of the games with even higher volumes, I do not understand how anyone could be making those decisions on a rational basis over the course of a game. They are just too fast and too frequent and too random. For example, what's the possible justification for rotating Barker in at 6:41 of Q2 on a 1:1 swap and then out again at 6:16at 6:16 as part of a 3:3? Or doing a 1:1 at 2:03 of Q1 bringing Civil in for MiPauldo? Civil is a guard, but she's not a primary ball handler, assist maker, and outside shooter like Mia. Or at least she hasn't been. Is she now? Does the team know how all the roles are changing as these occur? What's the difference in how the team is supposed to operate when Coop is the primary ball handler vs. MiPauldo or Robertson? If you go from two point-guard ball handlers to one, can everyone adjust on the fly?

Yeah, yeah. Positionless. I'm still lost. "Line change" substitutions" make sense, whether they work or not -- they are at least understandable. 4:4 around an anchoring player I could understand. Or 3:3 where the 3-4-5 positions swap. or 2:2 swapping the 1-2 positions -- all understandable and I can see the team adjusting on the fly. But some of this? I'm just lost. And that's just on offense. No idea how that affects defensive responsibilities.

And if the substitution patterns don't make sense, then the whole intensive effort, generate turnovers, get more shots than them approach falls apart. How much of this is a factor of this year's team, I don't know, but I've got to say that one of the things Kim needs to prioritize next year is figuring out how to keep whatever substitution approach she settles on less chaotic.

Glad to see that the analytics confirm the perception - there is no method to this madness.

Now, let's think about how the players must feel playing in this system. I will contend that what some condemn as the players being "lazy" and uncaring is actually their being confused, uncertain, and understandably frustrated. I think this is particularly clear for Barker.

 

[Amb3096]

I have said over the years, "Data will change people's minds, you just sometimes have to rub their noses in it." Well, I've rubbed my nose in the data long enough. I don't understand the substitution patterns. That may well be because of what Kim has said -- that they have never achieved the rotation stability this year that they did last, with the implication that has been due to erratic levels of focus and effort from key players. At least, that's the way I understand her. That said, looking at even just the 28 sub events for Tennessee above, much less at some of the games with even higher volumes, I do not understand how anyone could be making those decisions on a rational basis over the course of a game. They are just too fast and too frequent and too random. For example, what's the possible justification for rotating Barker in at 6:41 of Q2 on a 1:1 swap and then out again at 6:16at 6:16 as part of a 3:3? Or doing a 1:1 at 2:03 of Q1 bringing Civil in for MiPauldo? Civil is a guard, but she's not a primary ball handler, assist maker, and outside shooter like Mia. Or at least she hasn't been. Is she now? Does the team know how all the roles are changing as these occur? What's the difference in how the team is supposed to operate when Coop is the primary ball handler vs. MiPauldo or Robertson? If you go from two point-guard ball handlers to one, can everyone adjust on the fly?

Yeah, yeah. Positionless. I'm still lost. "Line change" substitutions" make sense, whether they work or not -- they are at least understandable. 4:4 around an anchoring player I could understand. Or 3:3 where the 3-4-5 positions swap. or 2:2 swapping the 1-2 positions -- all understandable and I can see the team adjusting on the fly. But some of this? I'm just lost. And that's just on offense. No idea how that affects defensive responsibilities.

And if the substitution patterns don't make sense, then the whole intensive effort, generate turnovers, get more shots than them approach falls apart. How much of this is a factor of this year's team, I don't know, but I've got to say that one of the things Kim needs to prioritize next year is figuring out how to keep whatever substitution approach she settles on less chaotic.

Mia got pulled immediately after a turnover, and she came back in quickly after. Probably wanted to do a little coaching. Barker got subbed out in the 2nd quarter because she picked up her 2nd foul very soon after coming in. I’m sure Kim would have preferred to keep her in the game, but wanted to play it safe.

 

[RetroVol]

Mia got pulled immediately after a turnover, and she came back in quickly after. Probably wanted to do a little coaching. Barker got subbed out in the 2nd quarter because she picked up her 2nd foul very soon after coming in. I’m sure Kim would have preferred to keep her in the game, but wanted to play it safe.

Thanks. Still feel the same after looking at these substitution patterns over the last few games. Maybe LSU is an attempt to tone it down and find some consistency. But, still it's a lot of change as to who's doing what from minute to minute.

 

[AthensVol2007]

That makes sense to you. The point stands.

No it doesn’t, this isn’t remotely a top 15 team and they’ve proven it when it got down to the nut cutting.

 

[RetroVol]

Retro, I need one of your AI comparisons on the amount of 40+ games at half that have translated into losses vs last season.

Claude says:

There's your answer:


2024-25: Scored 40+ at halftime in 20 of 34 games, lost only 1 — that was at Texas (40-45 at half, 76-80 final). They were 19-1 when putting up 40+ by halftime.


2025-26: Scored 40+ at halftime in 13 of 27 games, lost 5 — Texas A&M (42-47), Oklahoma (45-47), LSU (42-43), UConn (42-42), and NC State (44-40). That's 8-5 when hitting 40+ at the half.


The contrast is stark. Last year when the offense got rolling early, it was essentially a guaranteed win (95%). This year they're barely above .500 (62%) in those same situations. And in 4 of the 5 losses they were actually trailing or tied at halftime despite scoring 40+ — meaning the opponent was keeping pace or ahead, and then Tennessee collapsed in the second half. The UConn game is the most extreme: 42 at the half, only 24 in the second half for a 66-96 blowout loss.

 

[LadyVolsDiehard]

Claude says:

There's your answer:


2024-25: Scored 40+ at halftime in 20 of 34 games, lost only 1 — that was at Texas (40-45 at half, 76-80 final). They were 19-1 when putting up 40+ by halftime.


2025-26: Scored 40+ at halftime in 13 of 27 games, lost 5 — Texas A&M (42-47), Oklahoma (45-47), LSU (42-43), UConn (42-42), and NC State (44-40). That's 8-5 when hitting 40+ at the half.


The contrast is stark. Last year when the offense got rolling early, it was essentially a guaranteed win (95%). This year they're barely above .500 (62%) in those same situations. And in 4 of the 5 losses they were actually trailing or tied at halftime despite scoring 40+ — meaning the opponent was keeping pace or ahead, and then Tennessee collapsed in the second half. The UConn game is the most extreme: 42 at the half, only 24 in the second half for a 66-96 blowout loss.

Just as I thought. Our defense has been a big let down. We're not getting the turnovers before half court like we were last season. We aren't making teams uncomfortable this season.

 

[mudcat1973]

This will get you all the 3 point specialist you need ...



Need to start playing by the rules like the rest do...Tamper,Tamper,Tamper...

This Morally correct stuff went out the window when NIL became a legal thing.

Got list of the low down cheating temper universities?

 

[AllVols3]

You got this wrong there AllVols, I don't bitch, I was only replying to a post of another that mentioned the team had players not giving an effort and said we should play the ones that do. Maybe save your insults for someone that gives cares what you think.

Im sorry I hurt your feelings with the truth, it hurts.

 

[Lucy]

I’ve been trying to establish my own reset for this season.
A solid victory in the SEC tournament against Bama or GA, next round victory would be great. No more blow out losses.
NCAA tournament, first round slaughter and making sweet sixteen would be a great start to next year!
The biggest accomplishment, however, in my mind is if CKC can retain all our players with eligibility remaining (love all the freshmen) and keep both recruits in the fold. If she can this says to me she has buy in from the players. They understand her vision. If she loses the majority of the freshman and or Cooper/Latham (unless Coop declares for draft) then I have real questions about her ability to have success at this level.

 

[1morevol]

Hi Retro,

Per Draya, I will just ditto GLV's response above.

On criticisms of the "system, this is not a "mistakes were made" situation. The problem is not the system acting as it own intentional agent. No, the problem is with "the coaching" and that means that the head coach CKC is responsible. That is the rubicon you seem a bit hesitant to cross. You like detailed arguments so on that topic.

1. This may be the most "fundamentals" challenged team in the history of the LVs' program, though some late era Holly teams are also in the conversation.

Defensively, they are really bad in their court positioning and defensive stances, very undisciplined about reaching in to commit silly fouls (as getting steals seems to the primary objective) and fouling 3 pt shooters who are firing up hail marys as the shot clock expires.

Offensively, they put the moribund in stagnant. Only Latham seems to have any sense of consistent off ball movement and the timing and geometry of cutting to the hoop.

It appears that so much time has been invested in learning the [easily broken] "press" system that there was no time for coaching the basics of how to defend and execute an offense. Shockingly, that coaching "system" is not a formula for sustained success

2. Managing players

Zee is a physically gifted player who has no idea how to play in the low post.

Mia is a gem of a player. But you can not become a proficient PG playing in starts and fits. It worked okay last season for Spencer because she was a 5th year player with tons of experience under her belt.

Mya is a solid back-up who can hold down the fort. Her role should be spotting Mia in the last minute or two of each quarter and running the team at the end of cupcake blowout games. Coop and Robertson should only be the "break glass in case of emergency" PG options.

I could go on but in assessing a Head Coach you have to judge by the results on the floor. It is not about how much you like the coach or how improved they are becoming, through the repeated practice, in talking to the press after embarrassing losses.

One can argue that the pre-season rankings were inflated but taking a top ten team to a bubble team, with a relatively healthy squad is, in my view not an sign of "excellent" coaching.

/|\
This

 

[Rooster1]

I think they were just overrated at the start of the season, and their preseason ranking didn't take into consideration freshmen growing pains and transfer assimiliation. NC State was also a top 10 team who fell by the wayside, but Wes Moore is still a fantastic coach.

Hard to find a team that did not face those same considerations. You may argue that the sheer volume at UT was unique and I wouldn’t try to argue that point. But many teams were facing large turnovers, it happens almost every year now in the transfer era.

I know of one team in the top 4 that returned only one starter and had to assimilate 2 transfers and 3 freshman all of whom play significant roles. The preseason rankings were a judgement of talent pools, with assumptions made of what a D1 coach could do with stated talent.

 

[VolTenn25]

I’ve been trying to establish my own reset for this season.
A solid victory in the SEC tournament against Bama or GA, next round victory would be great. No more blow out losses.
NCAA tournament, first round slaughter and making sweet sixteen would be a great start to next year!
The biggest accomplishment, however, in my mind is if CKC can retain all our players with eligibility remaining (love all the freshmen) and keep both recruits in the fold. If she can this says to me she has buy in from the players. They understand her vision. If she loses the majority of the freshman and or Cooper/Latham (unless Coop declares for draft) then I have real questions about her ability to have success at this level.

Do we even believe coop is ready for the draft? She still has a lot to work on. Another year would do her good.

 

[Volfan2012]

I’ve been trying to establish my own reset for this season.
A solid victory in the SEC tournament against Bama or GA, next round victory would be great. No more blow out losses.
NCAA tournament, first round slaughter and making sweet sixteen would be a great start to next year!
The biggest accomplishment, however, in my mind is if CKC can retain all our players with eligibility remaining (love all the freshmen) and keep both recruits in the fold. If she can this says to me she has buy in from the players. They understand her vision. If she loses the majority of the freshman and or Cooper/Latham (unless Coop declares for draft) then I have real questions about her ability to have success at this level.

The best part is that the reset happens quickly. We will have it all decided by the end of April except maybe an incoming transfer or two. You have April 6th through April 21st to get in the portal. After that your returning to your same school. If they can retain most of the present players then maybe they can do the work in the portal that they should've done last year. The money should be there as were losing a lot of players to graduation and I'm sure a few of them have hefty NIL accounts.
This year could still be a good one beat Vandy, win a couple in the SEC tourney make the sweet sixteen would be somewhat vindication, if not completely for the terrible second half of the season. Regardless of how this one ends this coaching staff has to retain and also do some serious thinking about portal roster building and effective system changes that will work in the SEC.