Dick Vermeil's acutal two point conversion chart

#102
#102
utvolpj said:
And you should quit hanging out with others drinking that same water . They're bringing you down to their level of debate - scratch the surface with no research and the occasional insult. You used to be better than that.

The chart had reached mythical level on this site. It's become completely ridiculous and overblown. You'd realize that if you took your own advice and read our watched what Butch actually said. Maybe do it after your appointment. Would serve you better than watching/reading some sports writer jumping on the train and repeating the same thing as all the rest. Until then it's probably useless to continue discussing this topic since it was such a tiny part of the game
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I am hanging out at the same place I have for several years PJ, you know that.

You are the person that stated in this thread this morning
1. every coach uses the Chart,
2. called it a mythical chart.
3. the chart has reached the mythical level.

Which is it PJ?
 
#103
#103
Gramps said:
I am hanging out at the same place I have for several years PJ, you know that.

You are the person that stated in this thread this morning
1. every coach uses the Chart,
2. called it a mythical chart.
3. the chart has reached the mythical level.

Which is it PJ?
Click to expand...

What the heck are you going on about now? None of those contradict each other and are all true. Are you getting second hand high from your associations? You're seriously slipping

I'll help you some more - it has become the stuff of legend and/or fairy tales by those who ignore the rest of the story
 
#104
#104
utvolpj said:
What the heck are you going on about now? None of those contradict each other and are all true. Are you getting second hand high from your associations? You're seriously slipping

I'll help you some more - it has become the stuff of legend and/or fairy tales by those who ignore the rest of the story
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I am talking about what you have said in this thread today. It is all there is you have not modified it. :p

Yes , they do contradict each other :dance2:

Are you sure all are true?

1. Source that ALL COACHES uses the chart

2. You are Wrong. The chart is real, it has been around a long time. IIRC since the 1970's. It is not mythical as you say it is.

3. Wrong again pj. You are the only poster that I have read that said the chart has risen to mythical propotions.

I am getting some second hand slipping this morning from my associations from who once was a very sensible poster until you located to FL and is in the process of falling apart from the post I have saw you make recently.

Serious question: Have you started hanging out with and become best friends with LG since you relocated to gatorland?

Ha Ha , now you done went and gone Paul Harvey on me with the rest of the story line. That line is like worthy---- well done. :thumbsup:


I didn't have any pics so I used some of Freaks Smileys
 
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#105
#105
bignewt said:
Im jusy saying everybody seems to think its a foregone conclusion that if we went for two we would have gotten it...i for one have zero faith in either coach to make a big play like that succeed.
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the pat didn't exactly succeed either did it?
It failed to give us the points we needed just as surely as not trying for two did.
Just saying
 
#106
#106
GAVol said:
I think the point is that it's a chart; not a Bible.
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PJ has implied, even said that nowhere can he find where Jones said he referred to a chart to tell him to kick the extra point. So no, he meant mythical as in, "doesn't exist".
 
#107
#107
KBVol said:
PJ has implied, even said that nowhere can he find where Jones said he referred to a chart to tell him to kick the extra point. So no, he meant mythical as in, "doesn't exist".
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Absolutely wrong. You created the legend of the chart being the single deciding factor. Butch directly contradicted that in his press conf yet you ignore it for the myth you've created of him being a liar
 
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#108
#108
Gramps said:
I am talking about what you have said in this thread today. It is all there is you have not modified it. :p

Yes , they do contradict each other :dance2:

Are you sure all are true?

1. Source that ALL COACHES uses the chart

2. You are Wrong. The chart is real, it has been around a long time. IIRC since the 1970's. It is not mythical as you say it is.

3. Wrong again pj. You are the only poster that I have read that said the chart has risen to mythical propotions.

I am getting some second hand slipping this morning from my associations from who once was a very sensible poster until you located to FL and is in the process of falling apart from the post I have saw you make recently.

Serious question: Have you started hanging out with and become best friends with LG since you relocated to gatorland?

Ha Ha , now you done went and gone Paul Harvey on me with the rest of the story line. That line is like worthy---- well done. :thumbsup:


I didn't have any pics so I used some of Freaks Smileys
Click to expand...
I'm on mobile so I'll just say your post is trash and you know it. Words can have multiple meanings. You fit right in with the room temp brigade. You used to actually have some pride in your posts but I see that is no longer the case and you've slipped below even LG on the ridiculous scale. Have a nice one as we're obviously done here
 
#109
#109
utvolpj said:
Absolutely wrong. You created the legend of the chart being the single deciding factor. Butch directly contradicted that in his press conf yet you ignore it for the myth you've created
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You couldn't be more wrong....again. He keeps moving the narrative with inconsistent comments and you just keep lapping it up. There's a reason why Rob Lewis tweeted this with the comment he did.


@Volquest_Rob: This Butch quote is going to get some attention, 'we don't use analytics during game' says there used in the week to devise game plan


You can see the forest for the trees.
 
#110
#110
KBVol said:
You couldn't be more wrong....again. He keeps moving the narrative with inconsistent comments and you just keep lapping it up. There's a reason why Rob Lewis tweeted this with the comment he did.


@Volquest_Rob: This Butch quote is going to get some attention, 'we don't use analytics during game' says there used in the week to devise game plan


You can see the forest for the trees.
Click to expand...

I posted his quote and you removed the parts that didn't for your narrative when responding to it. That tweet means nothing unless you believe a gameplan is truly set in stone when the game starts.

Also, it's they're
 
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#111
#111
So Butch said in the press conference that analytics are used while preparing for the game and "gut" is used during the game. That is goes against his post game comments. Whichever it was JUST ADMIT IT WAS WRONG WHETHER YOU USED A CHART, ANALYTICS, OR YOUR GUT and be done!!!! Butch still doesn't get it and takes no responsibility.
 
#114
#114
GAVol said:
Ridiculous. They got the defense they wanted, called a plant and executed it.
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Relax. It's just one of the many creations that happen on message boards. Someone floats and idea, someone feels it, someone else runs with it, then in a few days it becomes an established FACT that cannot be disputed.

Evidence is irrelevant to some people's narrative.

Remember "Justin Hunter playing scared and protecting his draft status"? And dozens of others

Someone should make a list. It would be pretty substantial. So, just learn to roll with it.
 
#116
#116
livefaith said:
Relax. It's just one of the many creations that happen on message boards. Someone floats and idea, someone feels it, someone else runs with it, then in a few days it becomes an established FACT that cannot be disputed.

Evidence is irrelevant to some people's narrative.

Remember "Justin Hunter playing scared and protecting his draft status"? And dozens of others

Someone should make a list. It would be pretty substantial. So, just learn to roll with it.
Click to expand...
On here, that'd be a list a mile long starting with Casey Clausen's ability.
 
#117
#117
My opinion is that Butch either did not think about going for two in the excitement of getting the touchdown or realized it too late to change anything. No way someone thinking about it rationally would have come up with the decision to kick the extra point in that scenario.

As for the mention of the chart post game, I think he mentions it at first because he was going to try to use the chart to rationalize his decision (like his analytics BS) but quickly realized that it was going to be too easy for people to see that the chart did not back him up in this instance. He already mentioned the chart, so he babbled incoherently about the defense blah blah blah without ever actually answering why he did not go for two.
 
#118
#118
I believe Butch also mentioned they discussed whether to go for two before the drive even started. I don't really believe that, but, if true, it explains the decision. It was a long drive that started in the third quarter. I could see going for 1 if it was a quick drive making it likely that Florida would get 3 possessions, but not after the long drive.
 
#119
#119
utvolpj said:
I posted his quote and you removed the parts that didn't for your narrative when responding to it. That tweet means nothing unless you believe a gameplan is truly set in stone when the game starts.

Also, it's they're
Click to expand...

Let's start with an English lesson.....

The contraction I used was "there's", as in "there is a reason..." There's = there is.

"They're" is the contraction for "they are".... you may be shocked to know that I was not attempting to say "they are a reason...." You don't do English very well, do ya hoss?

Secondly, I "amended" the quote to eliminate the crap that meant nothing. He started by saying there were several reasons and then said this .... "We have a chart that is pretty standard in football first of all, and maps it all".....so I isolated that part of the quote because, taken with his "analytics" comments after the Oklahoma game, that's the only part of the sentence with any substance. Otherwise, why even mention it. Additionally, his other "reason" had something to do with "trusting the defense". Well, whether he did or didn't trust his defense, that had nothing to do with the mathematical decision as to whether to go for two or not......but that "pretty standard chart in football" did. 12 or 13 point, there was no difference....14 points beats either one, whether he trusted the defense or not.

And given that every possible analyst and commentator known to man has been blasting him for his decision and how he came to make that decision, its beyond clear that my point is valid. But hey, go ahead and take that hill, and die on that hill.
 
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#120
#120
This one seems simple enough. The only correct option is go for two. Butch asked Debord in the heat of the moment, he chose 1, there's no rationale for it, it was not smart, ridiculed for days, everyone gets it by now, Butch still backs his guy. If nothing else CBJ has proven to be a loyal SOB...maybe to his demise but in life, it's a good trait.

Let's beat Arkansas.
 
#121
#121
KBVol said:
Let's start with an English lesson.....

The contraction I used was "there's", as in "there is a reason..." There's = there is.

"They're" is the contraction for "they are".... you may be shocked to know that I was not attempting to say "they are a reason...." You don't do English very well, do ya hoss?
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Ummm yeah...

KBVol said:
@Volquest_Rob: This Butch quote is going to get some attention, 'we don't use analytics during game' says there used in the week to devise game plan
Click to expand...

And that's why you have to take all details into account before making an important decision. If you get stuck on one you may miss something

:whistling:
 
#122
#122
utvolpj said:
Ummm yeah...



And that's why you have to take all details into account before making an important decision. If you get stuck on one you may miss something

:whistling:
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"Ummm yeah"? Lol!

Took some gall to even respond...I'll give you that.
 
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