Butch says it takes 6 to 7 years to build a program in the SEC

#626
#626
I can't wait for the day when butch can point to his wins on the field instead of having to sale us on his vision. I do think he'll get there in all seriousness, it's probably just gonna take longer than expected
 
#628
#628
KBVol said:
No, I personally would not want Kiffin back under any circumstance. Prefer Jones by a country mile. I'm considering Kiffin's behavior here, his attempt to whitewash our traditions and turn UT into USC east, his recruiting which was atrocious given the character of the players he signed and the ultimate attrition of his one class and how dirty he was in running the program with regards to NCAA compliance. Was Kiffin a better gameday coach than Jones?...yes, absolutely IMHO. But is Jones considerably better in literally every other facet? Yes and it's not even close.
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10-4:thumbsup:
 
#629
#629
volunteerfan said:
The reason Saban or harbaugh can be butt holes to the media and not kiss azz is because they are proven winners and they are irreplaceable coaches. They don't need a sales pitch because the results on the field speak for them
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It's because they are butt holes, it's not an act that they get by with. Saban is a winner, making poor choices. Harbaugh can't win the big game.
 
#630
#630
ReaderVol said:
Which is it, Bowl games or championships? You keep moving the target.
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I didn't move the target. The guy won his conference and let the bcs computers do the rest. Not long after that he took a nfl team that sucked to the playoffs, the the nfc championship game, and the next year the Super Bowl. Super bowl>nc right?
 
#632
#632
volunteerfan said:
How am I being silly? You tell me how loyal butch jones is and I tell you he's just like every other coach that you mentioned that isn't loyal. Did he get an extension because of what he had done on the field or because the AD was scared he might lose him to another school. Kudos to butch for pimping the game but don't try to tell me he's loyal when all I see is a hustler.
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So every coach that gets an extension is a "pimp"? :lol: Then EVERY COACH worth a crap is a pimp.
 
#635
#635
ReaderVol said:
Recruits are smart enough to know what Jones said and didn't say. Jones recruiting history says you're wrong. Logic as well says you're wrong.
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Thanks for the encouragement... since pretty much everything you consider logical... is WRONG.

Recruits listen to lots of coaches. Jones isn't the only one who knows how to talk or steer recruits.

Your statement above can be officially added to a long list of profoundly stupid and "illogical" statements.
 
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#638
#638
volunteerfan said:
I can't wait for the day when butch can point to his wins on the field instead of having to sale us on his vision. I do think he'll get there in all seriousness, it's probably just gonna take longer than expected
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With the talent he inherited did you honestly EXPECT it in the first two years? When he was hired, I hoped within four he'd have enough recruiting cred built up to start where he was last year. I concur with KB on the gameday aspect...I also think he learns from disappointments and has adjusted his tendencies there...slowly. His vision was a fast paced power team that physically wears out their opponents. He has quickly built up the roster that could implement that, save the OL. He's too stubborn on some points. Playing Crowder over Jones is perplexing and I initially defended starting Jumper (you never know where talent emerges and the coaches see the players more), but you gotta realize when a disaster's happening.

Butch is about at the pace I expected with the mess that was left him. The rest of this year and next should be enough to get a fair grade.
 
#639
#639
Are some coaches much better at rebuilding an FBS football program than others, you bet they are, where Butch Jones falls into the heirarchy is yet to be seen,no?
 
#641
#641
sjt18 said:
Thanks for the encouragement... since pretty much everything you consider logical... is WRONG.

Recruits listen to lots of coaches. Jones isn't the only one who knows how to talk or steer recruits.

Your statement above can be officially added to a long list of profoundly stupid and "illogical" statements.
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Well you're spot on man. I mean Jones tactics have lead horrible recruiting. Dang you're so smart.
 
#642
#642
jakez4ut said:
that's all it is. go back and listen to the replay of Vol Calls. context matters, and no where in the context of that conversation was he saying, or meaning to say, that the next 4 years should be a pass b/c it takes 6 or 7 years to build a program.

and that's just fact.
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You may be right but you cannot say it is "just fact". KB earlier reminded us that Jones has recently referenced all the time that Beamer got. He's complained pretty much incessantly since arriving about depth and then the last two years about youth.

Those statements also serve as context for this one. If he isn't looking to lower expectations and get some measure of a "pass" then why say stuff like this... much less harp on it?

I can't claim like so many of you have to "know" exactly what he meant or what spirit it was said in. But he either misspoke... or looking to give himself a pass.

And... there may be good reason. Let's say next year doesn't produce a championship run. What will be lost headed into '17? Besides the Srs that include Dobbs, Lewis, Vereen, JRM, Foreman, and O'Brien. Will Barnett stay? Hurd? Others?

The '17 roster will likely be "young" again and COULD be thin again in critical places.

If he wins the East and/or SEC next fall then he's golden. But what if he disappoints at 8-4 or 9-3? What if there's another year of futility vs Bama and UF? AND.... what if he loses critical upperclass contributors on top of that?
 
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#643
#643
ReaderVol said:
Well you're spot on man. I mean Jones tactics have lead horrible recruiting. Dang you're so smart.
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I am right. And you are ignorant for believing that no one else knows how to recruit or convince recruits that their version of things is the right one.

You need to be honest. You worship the guy. You think he's infallible so it offends you to no end when someone suggests that he's not.

I like him. I respect the good he's done. But he's far from perfect or proven.... you really need to get past that.
 
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#645
#645
sjt18 said:
I am right. And you are ignorant for believing that no one else knows how to recruit or convince recruits that their version of things is the right one.

You need to be honest. You worship the guy. You think he's infallible so it offends you to no end when someone suggests that he's not.

I like him. I respect the good he's done. But he's far from perfect or proven.... you really need to get past that.
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Of course you're right. And did I say Jones was the only one who knew how to recruit? That's right I didn't. But I do know this, he has a track record that shows he knows a helluva lot more than you. Y'all cry about records. Well how is his record in recruiting?
 
#647
#647
sjt18 said:
Defending Readervol? Even you should be able to see that he thinks Lyle Jones is Jim Jones.
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Seems extremist...even for you. :). Who you saving your HITLER for? :w00t:
 
#649
#649
ReaderVol said:
Of course you're right. And did I say Jones was the only one who knew how to recruit? That's right I didn't. But I do know this, he has a track record that shows he knows a helluva lot more than you. Y'all cry about records. Well how is his record in recruiting?
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All hail the undisputed recruiting champ. Let me know when and where we have the parade
 
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#650
#650
sjt18 said:
You may be right but you cannot say it is "just fact". KB earlier reminded us that Jones has recently referenced all the time that Beamer got. He's complained pretty much incessantly since arriving about depth and then the last two years about youth.

Those statements also serve as context for this one. If he isn't looking to lower expectations and get some measure of a "pass" then why say stuff like this... much less harp on it?

I can't claim like so many of you have to "know" exactly what he meant or what spirit it was said in. But he either misspoke... or looking to give himself a pass.

And... there may be good reason. Let's say next year doesn't produce a championship run. What will be lost headed into '17? Besides the Srs that include Dobbs, Lewis, Vereen, JRM, Foreman, and O'Brien. Will Barnett stay? Hurd? Others?

The '17 roster will likely be "young" again and COULD be thin again in critical places.

If he wins the East and/or SEC next fall then he's golden. But what if he disappoints at 8-4 or 9-3? What if there's another year of futility vs Bama and UF? AND.... what if he loses critical upperclass contributors on top of that?
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That's the fallacy the "young team" argument. Teams are always going to be young to some degree all the time. Good coaches coach young kids well and can win with young players. Plenty of examples of that right now in cfb.

Butch is just trying to create job security. I would too if I could make millions of dollars. But a fans job is to press back on him. Keep him honest.
 
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