Game Thread: Lady Vols v Belmont, Home, Thurs. Nov 13th, 7PM, SEC Network

[LV renaissance]

The thing that was the most concerning about the team is the 3-point shooting this season but especially the past two games is that almost all of the shots were completely uncontested, and we still couldn't hit them. This allows the defending team to bunch up completely in the paint, which then makes it near impossible to be effective on the drive and penetrate or our rarely used assist to someone open in the paint. The result is that even mid major teams can be competitive with us due to making it so hard for us to score. The other way this works against us is that it is much harder to consistently rebound missed three pointers because just boxing out doesn't help with the varied ways it bounces off the rim. In the first half in the last two games, the much smaller other team was about equal with us in rebounds. The last aspect that gets undermined by the bad shooting is that our best press is after a made bucket. It is hard to press when a player gets a rebound way away from the rim. My biggest concern for the season is that even if this team starts playing more like a team like it did in the 4th quarter (finally some urgency!), we just don't have consistent three-point shooters and the ones that have that potential are needed in other ways (Mia and Mya at point, Barker and Cooper to take some shots near the rim). In any case, the system unravels when you can't shoot the three. Coach has a major task figuring how to compensate for this and still run a version of her system. I still have confidence in her in general, but this is a heavy lift. I would love for this to be a product of my worry bias I get about the teams I follow, but I haven't been able to talk myself out of this perspective. The biggest solution I can come up with is to really to change our defense, where we press only on made baskets and then put all our energy on half-court defense after our misses. Coach is way smarter and experienced than me when it comes to basketball, so perhaps she can come up with some more creative solutions. Otherwise, I don't think it will be the type of year we were hoping for preseason.

 

[Volfan2012]

They actually ended up with one more shot attempt than OU.

That was one big positive last night for me is that we still one the possession game even though we shot the ball horrendously. We had 69 attempts to their 56, primarily due to offensive rebounding.

OU beat them by a few more point than us because Beers was unstoppable and a really good finisher.

I don’t think this will be our best shooting team but I don’t see us shooting quite THIS bad very many times this season. Some nights are just like that.

Were not allowing a lot of points. I mean you expect to win giving up 58. If our offense was working even at 43 percent from the field it would've been a 20 point win. 34 threes just going to be to much if you can't make 30 percent.

 

[Volfan2012]

The thing that was the most concerning about the 3-point shooting this season but especially the past two games is that almost all of the shots were completely uncontested, and we still couldn't hit them. This allows the defending team to bunch up completely in the paint, which then makes it near impossible to be effective on the drive and penetrate or our rarely used assist to someone open in the paint. The result is that even mid major teams can be competitive with us due to making it so hard for us to score. The other way this works against us is that it is much harder to consistently rebound missed three pointers because just boxing out doesn't help with the varied ways it bounces off the rim. In the first half in the last two games, the much smaller other team was about equal with us in rebounds. The last aspect that gets undermined by the bad shooting is that our best press is after a made bucket. It is hard to press when a player gets a rebound way away from the rim. My biggest concern for the season is that even if this team starts playing more like a team like it did in the 4th quarter (finally some urgency!), we just don't have consistent three-point shooters and the ones that have that potential are needed in other ways (Mia and Mya at point, Barker and Cooper to take some shots near the rim). In any case, the system unravels when you can't shoot the three. Coach has a major task figuring how to compensate for this and still run a version of her system. I still have confidence in her in general, but this is a heavy lift. I would love for this to be a product of my worry bias I get about the teams I follow, but I haven't been able to talk myself out of this perspective. The biggest solution I can come up with is to really to change our defense, where we press only on made baskets and then put all our energy on half-court defense after our misses. Coach is way smarter and experienced than me when it comes to basketball, so perhaps she can come up with some more creative solutions. Otherwise, I don't think it will be the type of year we were hoping for preseason.

I know we still have to take some, but I think we need to lower the number and some players need to lower the ones they take cause their percentages are not very good for any of the four games.

 

[knoxvol52]

I think we will be fine when the team learns what a quality shot is....

 

[VolBall09]

I know we still have to take some, but I think we need to lower the number and some players need to lower the ones they take cause their percentages are not very good for any of the four games.

Prawl and Robertson both need a yellow light at this point. They both bring other things to the table but their 3 point shooting isn’t it.

Good film for Prawl last night. She was most effective when she was crashing the glass and playing good defense. Needs to pass on those long shots until she’s more confident.

Robertson has looked good at times this season but was completely out of control last night. She has to remember she is on a team loaded with other talent now. We definitely do not want her trying to do it all. The cross court pass she made to the third row when Pauldo was wide open in the corner was at a really bad time and a really poor decision for a veteran player.

I also do not like that Robertson seems to penetrate the lane solely to draw a foul and not to finish. Just tries to draw contact and throws up some wild shot that doesn’t have a prayer. You have to at least give it a chance.

 

[DeerPark12]

I wish we still had Strickland on our squad. She really wasn’t given chance when she was here.

She was given every chance under two coaches. But there's not a role in Caldwell's system for someone whose best role is to stand in a spot to catch and shoot. She found a place where she'll thrive in that role.

 

[vols90]

Prawl and Robertson both need a yellow light at this point. They both bring other things to the table but their 3 point shooting isn’t it.

Good film for Prawl last night. She was most effective when she was crashing the glass and playing good defense. Needs to pass on those long shots until she’s more confident.

Robertson has looked good at times this season but was completely out of control last night. She has to remember she is on a team loaded with other talent now. We definitely do not want her trying to do it all. The cross court pass she made to the third row when Pauldo was wide open in the corner was at a really bad time and a really poor decision for a veteran player.

I also do not like that Robertson seems to penetrate the lane solely to draw a foul and not to finish. Just tries to draw contact and throws up some wild shot that doesn’t have a prayer. You have to at least give it a chance.

Yes! I've noticed Robertson has been driving to the paint and then comes to a complete stop while almost sliding her planted foot. She did that several times last night. She's going to start getting called for traveling if she keeps doing that. She helped us at UT Martin, but other than that I'm not impressed with her so far. Hoping she can prove me wrong.

 

[lvocd]

LV renaissance, everything you said in your last post was right on.

From Week One of workouts Kim has been honest about her concerns about not having the consistent 3-pt shooters and how she hopes some players will step up and fill that role. Unfortunately, after no true dead-eye bombers emerged, Kim later had to concede that we are now "a driving team." But like you said, us not making threes just makes us easier to guard in the paint, and I believe that's why I'm getting a sense of panic from Kim this season that I never saw last season. I believe she knew last season that even if we were cold from deep now and then, that at least she was confident we had some solid shooters who could get hot. I don't think she feels that confidence right now. Ugh.

I would also love to see us try pressing only after made baskets. It may work more often if we did that. Like madtownvol said, "No amount of effort can compensate for leaving players wide open." We are actually helping lesser opponents score against us right now.

 

[mudcat1973]

 

[VolBall09]

She was given every chance under two coaches. But there's not a role in Caldwell's system for someone whose best role is to stand in a spot to catch and shoot. She found a place where she'll thrive in that role.

Exactly. I maintained from the moment we were involved with her that she was best fit at a mid-major like Belmont of FGCU. Glad she finally found the right speed for her.

 

[KTrain]

I finally understand the LVs full court press strategy. It is too speed up the game by letting the other team score quickly....

Belmont could have a dozen more points if they had been able to finish at the rim. This was a team whose best player could not really crack the LV line-up last season. That is a warning sign.

The math of the press does not work. You send two players to the ball. That always leave one player open and the LVs outnumbered in the half court. The press only works when the other makes an error-- bad pass or the player not cutting to the open space, like Strickland did on one TO.

This was Belmont. Teams with more size,skill and athleticism (i.e. everyone in the SEC) will have a field day with the LVs overplaying like this. The ball will always move faster than a player. No amount of effort can compensate for leaving players wide open.

On the flipside, we saw the defense look pretty good, when one player, like Coop harassed the PG in the back court and everyone else was positioned to be play lockdown half court defense. That is a more effective and efficient way to play D which will then facilitate more movement on the offense, which remains way too stagnant.

Super happy for Kaniya Boyd, she turned the game around. Does that mean she will be a game changer in every game and she should now play 30 minutes a game. Uh, probably not but different players who are less central are going to have to step to help Coop and Barker score points.

Prawl looked more comfortable and confidence tonight. Even though her shots weren't dropping, the looked pretty good on the release. I see her having more impact as the season goes on.

But, the LVs lack of consistent outside shooting will be a problem in SEC play and this team will have to be creative to get paint points and play better D.

I know, I am supposed to say, "we are the elitist of elite" and these early season games are just tiny little growing pains as as the team learns "the system". But a defense scheme, which has potentially great half court defenders chasing ghosts on over aggressive full presses and an offense built on 3 point shooting when good 3 point shooters are in very short supply is not a formula for success. Some adjustments really need to be made. The "system" is not optimizing the talent

I don't follow as close as most on here but looking at the Boxscore, if it was right. Wolfenbarger just had 6 minutes and with Latham out. The fact you're working in 3 maybe 4 freshmen it looks like the deepness of this team is not what I was expecting so far. IMO that hurts on the full court and the all out play 10 and wear them down mode, if your 10 is not up to par. I was expecting at least 15 minutes out of Wolfenbarger, I know she ended up with 4 fouls but I'm just hoping this was a one off game, maybe I had too high expectations in regard to the deepness. Hopefully with time and better chemistry and game to game experience the curve will rise.

 

[KB5252]

This team is young, undisciplined and sloppy. That said they are also very talented. Need to find a way to score inside when the 3's don't fall, we lose against better than average teams if we play the way we did last night.

Going to have to grow up quick, I know they'll improve, but it remains to be seen how much. Just my honest assessment of what I watched last night, was the first game I could actually sit down to watch.

 

[Golfteacher]

This team is still in search for its identity. It is a good chance we are not the three shooting team we were last year, just maybe we need to use our athleticism getting to the elbow and the rim. We certainly need better shot selection and we need to move around more and set plays off picks. For the most part the defense seems to be good, however, we seem to leave the paint open while we flank the ball. We have the athletes we just need to put them in better position to win. A large part of that is figuring out who you are.

 

[Coach Jumper]

Yes! I've noticed Robertson has been driving to the paint and then comes to a complete stop while almost sliding her planted foot. She did that several times last night. She's going to start getting called for traveling if she keeps doing that. She helped us at UT Martin, but other than that I'm not impressed with her so far. Hoping she can prove me wrong.

There is a thing I teach in driving to the hoop i call... the point of decision ....that is the point where you make a decision and stay with it no matter what happens.

Driving in without a the purpose or plan is foolish... The same thing causes accidents when you're driving your car.... You're approaching a light. It turns yellow at some point. You have to make a decision that you're gonna go through the light and then you start the second guess your decision...crash

 

[OrangeBeachVol]

I don't follow as close as most on here but looking at the Boxscore, if it was right. Wolfenbarger just had 6 minutes and with Latham out. The fact you're working in 3 maybe 4 freshmen it looks like the deepness of this team is not what I was expecting so far. IMO that hurts on the full court and the all out play 10 and wear them down mode, if your 10 is not up to par. I was expecting at least 15 minutes out of Wolfenbarger, I know she ended up with 4 fouls but I'm just hoping this was a one off game, maybe I had too high expectations in regard to the deepness. Hopefully with time and better chemistry and game to game experience the curve will rise.

You look at her stats and it shows why she is not getting much PT.

In 4 games she has made 1 shot in 4 att for a .25% and has 7 rbds for a 1.8 avg per game, 0 asist and 3 blks. With the talent around her she is going to have to step it up get more PT. Can't just take up space in Kims games.

 

[spojo13]

A win is a win, and Belmont is not a bad team by any stretch. I believe the announcers said they were picked preseason to win their conference, so it may turn out to be a quality win with the tough schedule. With that said, this team really looks extremely disjointed right now. As many have already stated, we don’t have the consistent shooters from the three point line that this system thrives on. We have some streaky shooters that can get hot, but we don’t have players that teams have to respect outside that will open up the lane for Coop, Barker, Spearman, etc to drive. Spear, Spencer, and Darby were all threats that other teams had to respect, which made the lane a lot less congested. I also noticed that even when we did drive that nobody was cutting to the basket but all 4 other players were standing at the three point line. Several times, Mia or Coop would drive in and then stop to look for someone cutting, but no one was there, so it of course ended in a three point shot as that was the only outlet. I know it’s “the system,” and we have been told that is what Kim does; however, if you don’t have the players to run said system, you either adjust or hope that at some point everyone magically becomes more consistent from three during a season.

PS if I see our team not picking up the ball as a player drives full steam to the basket one more time, I might go crazy

 

[volsagain]

Boyd needs a lot more minutes. She is a very good defender and hustles with a purpose. She helped tremendously last year while she was learning the point position and playing team ball. That's the biggest problem right now not playing as a team. Just trying to drive to the basket to only score and not looking for a team mate for an option. We have the athletes but they need to play as a team.

 

[chuckiepoo]

Prawl and Robertson both need a yellow light at this point. They both bring other things to the table but their 3 point shooting isn’t it.

Good film for Prawl last night. She was most effective when she was crashing the glass and playing good defense. Needs to pass on those long shots until she’s more confident.

Robertson has looked good at times this season but was completely out of control last night. She has to remember she is on a team loaded with other talent now. We definitely do not want her trying to do it all. The cross court pass she made to the third row when Pauldo was wide open in the corner was at a really bad time and a really poor decision for a veteran player.

I also do not like that Robertson seems to penetrate the lane solely to draw a foul and not to finish. Just tries to draw contact and throws up some wild shot that doesn’t have a prayer. You have to at least give it a chance.

One other thing i saw at least twice last night was a three point shot feint that almost had Nya leave the floor. That will eventually get called or wind up leaving the floor. Really poor form.

 

[chuckiepoo]

Exactly. I maintained from the moment we were involved with her that she was best fit at a mid-major like Belmont of FGCU. Glad she finally found the right speed for her.

Judging by the wonderful off ball movement our current cast exhibited?

I am not buying that. Until we have better movement off ball and cease standing around the arc waiting for the ball, I would say she could have been quite effective as a three point threat.

 

[volsagain]

Judging by the wonderful off ball movement our current cast exhibited?

I am not buying that. Until we have better movement off ball and cease standing around the arc waiting for the ball, I would say she could have been quite effective as a three point threat.

That's the problem everyone standing around the arc waiting for a 3 point shot. The other problem our bigs play soft in the paint least amount of contact they will . Need to be stronger use the contact for and one not just collapse and fall away from contact. Hopefully Big O will bring that next year.

 

[GameTime]

It's OK guys....I think.

 

[TnVolsX4]

Unfortunately UCLA Stanford and Louisville are all before Christmas

 

[cwbytruckers]

This team is much harder to watch than I anticipated. Coach substitutes so frequently that no player can get into a groove and seem frustrated all the time. But the hardest thing to watch is the pure carelessness with the ball. But the only other thing I would say is why is our 6’4 girls slinging up threes so often. Go rebound. Go Post Up.

 

[JohnnyPayne]

The best thing for Caldwell is to have a satisfactory season because it will force even more NIL funds. Eventually $ can’t lose. Danny can’t afford let her fail.

 

[Coach Jumper]

That's the problem everyone standing around the arc waiting for a 3 point shot. The other problem our bigs play soft in the paint least amount of contact they will . Need to be stronger use the contact for and one not just collapse and fall away from contact. Hopefully Big O will bring that next year.

It's not rocket science.... Most of the time when they were on defense they had four people with two feet in the paint..... Instead of taking the 3 point shot, we could have taken a single dribble and pull up for a is much higher percentage mid-range shot..

the golden rule in basketball.....Take what the defense gives you