Recruiting Forum Football Talk V

[Jimmy Football]

I mean the only area of the defense that didn't improve from last year to this year is pass defense and that was even before South Carolina lit them up.

2021: 29.1 points allowed, 273.2 passing yards allowed, 1.8 TDs a game, 148.5 rushing yards allowed, 1.8 TDs a game, 421.7 total yards allowed
2022: 25.6 points allowed, 303.4 passing yards allowed, 2 TDs a game, 108.5 rushing yards allowed, 1.3 TDs a game, 412 total yards allowed

That tells me RG and the LBing coaches have developed and improved their defense.

And the craziest part of this is that the defense is playing a lot less plays per game now too.
2022: 73.9 plays a game
2021: 77.7 plays a game

153 first downs on pass plays this year (through 11 games)
156 first downs on pass plays last year (13 games total)

The secondary is the only area where the defense hasn't improved and actually got worse.

This team could have really used Theo and Alontae. Wish it had lined up for us.

 

[Vol8188]

I hate all the negative media we receive because it could potentially hurt us with recruits. All many of them know about us is what they hear from blithering idiots.

Last night every post you were making was about the need to fire coaches.

 

[Smyrna ATL Vol]

They weren't highly recruited. You can keep saying that, but it doesn't make it true.

Flowers was the 930th ranked player in his class. He did have an offer from Clemson (not sure if committable), but his only other SEC offer was Kentucky.

Charles was the number 600 ranked player in his class and had a horrible offer list.

Hadden-low ranked Juco player with a poor offer list.

Burrell-527th best player in his class. He did have one of the better offer lists of this group outside of Tank, but it's hard to say how many of those were commitable.

Tank-is the only player who was heavily recruited that you named.

Players must have potential before it can be brought out. To claim these guys were heavily recruited is just absurd unless you're trying to say "Tennessee Tech, Carson Newman, and MTSU would have loved to have landed these guys". If we want to win consistently, we have to improve our talent level. Otherwise, if we continue to recruit on USC's level, we will continue to lose games to them every few years.

No one is "blindly following coaches" or even "blindly blaming players". Mine and your inability to play in the NFL is an assertion of fact, not "blame". The fact is these guys were are not very talented. We have to recruit at a higher level (fortunately we already are). As upset as you seem to be about people "blindly following coaches and blaming players", you should be equally upset with yourself for blindly blaming coaches without acknowledging the obvious talent issues

It's not obvious our DC is in over his head at all. We played great against LSU and Kentucky.

Flowers offer list was because he was a great baseball player and signed to play baseball. But Clemson put full court press on him when they we’re on top of the world. Tank and Burrell were offered by many big schools. Hadden signed with Auburn and transferred after two picks on their spring game. Oklahoma and GT (Geoff Collins is an excellent defensive coach) offered Charles.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

One bad game does not equal regression

To be fair to everyone you are arguing with, it wasn't just a "bad game"...it was a historically embarrassingly nightmarishly horrible defensive performance.

I realize they had improved before that, but that was just a massive massive pile of game plan.

 

[Smyrna ATL Vol]

One bad game does not equal regression

Are you Willie Martinez? Lol

 

[Vols4us]

The DLine plays well against the run but we can’t seem to get any pressure or push in our pass rush. Only time we’re able to get sacks is when we bring 5 or more. Still more room to grow and get better in that unit. When we get to the point where someone on the DLine can beat their 1v1, it helps and mask’s inefficiencies in the back end. Hard to play zone or man when QB has all day to throw or can easily get out of the pocket and lose contain.

See my previous post. It's the scheme. It's the slant. When you have to go to one side of the other on non-obvious passing downs, you have removed a step forward toward the QB. Many times you have to reverse direction and the O-lineman already has you within his grasp unless they are slow to react.

That one step gives the passer a minimum of one second (usually more) to pass - the difference between a completion, an incompletion, a hurry or a sack. The opposing O's know we do this repeatedly and coached up their O-lines on what to do.

 

[Vol8188]

To be fair to everyone you are arguing with, it wasn't just a "bad game"...it was a historically embarrassingly nightmarishly horrible defensive performance.

I realize they had improved before that, but that was just a massive massive pile of game plan.

Not sure how much of it was game plan. We had multiple guys out on defense to start the game. We lost more as the game went along. If I'm not mistaken both Slaughter and Hadden went down at corner and we were already without Burrell. Charles came in, but this is his first game back.

It was embarrassing. It was horrible. Some of it was on scheme. I'm sure there's times we could have been in a better call. Most of it was on talent on both sides of the ball. Spencer Rattler is a high level QB (5* and former Heisman candidate) regardless of what the rest of what the early part of this season has shown.

You can't take a terrible secondary, subtract multiple pieces from that secondary, and then act shocked when they don't perform. This is Sal Sunseri level CB talent and we got Sunseri level results.

 

[Jimmy Football]

A good performance Saturday won’t erase the damage from last weekend, but it could redirect momentum heading into ESD and the offseason.

This is a WAY bigger game for us than it has any right to be.

 

[Vol8188]

Are you Willie Martinez? Lol

You got me!

 

[ConwayFitty]

IDK Derek Barnett and Josh Dobbs carried Butch Jones' sorry ass all by themselves.

You have to give Jennings some credit. we lose the Georgia game if he doesn't make that grab

 

[VolGee4]

Trevon Flowers was 930th ranked.
Jaylen McCullough was 156th.
Warren Burrell was 527th.
Doneiko Slaughter was 472nd.
Tamarion McDonald was 596th.
Kamal Hadden was 27th in Juco.
Brandon Turnage was 102nd.
De’shawn Rucker was 406th.
Christian Charles was 600th.

Other than McCullough and Turnage, that’s not real good.

Jordan Matthews is 151.
Sylvester Smith is 222.
Rickey Gibson is 411.
Christian Conyer is 520.

Turrentine was highly rated, and we need him to improve. We need to take some better players in the portal and recruit better at that position. Kaleb Beasley is a good start in 2024.

Interestingly, most of USCe’s higher rated guys in last year’s class were on defense. They took a lot on offense from the portal.

 

[MoCo_Vol]

The question is...do you think Willie has done enough on the recruiting trail to give him another season?

2022 class:
Dee Williams - 7th ranked JuCo player 2nd best JuCo CB
Jourdan Thomas - 854th ranked player in class 70th ranked safety
Christian Harrison - outside top 1k in class, 108th ranked CB in class

2023 class:
Jordan Matthews - 151st ranked player in class 17th ranked CB in class
Sylvester Smith - 222nd ranked player in class 15th ranked S in class
Rickey Gibson - 411th ranked player in class 41st ranked CB in class
Cristian Conyer - 520th ranked player in class 50th ranked CB in class
John Slaughter - 651st ranked player in class 59th ranked S in class
Jack Luttrell - 876th ranked player in class 73rd ranked S in class

2024 class:
Kaleb Beasley - 143rd ranked player in class 14th ranked CB in class


I mean, that's a lot of priority to the secondary in the 2023 class...so I'm kind of curious what next year will look like. Jordan Matthews will likely start he's got the size (6'1" 185) and he's a 10.66 100m guy so he should have the speed (that's a faster 100m than Squirrel btw). He finished top 5 in 5A in Louisiana for the 100m and 200m as a Junior.

 

[volbeast33]

I wouldn't say ruin for me, because we ended the Bama streak...and hell most of us would have taken a 6-6 or 7-5 season if it meant we upset Bama.

We should beat Vandy, and after the way we lost to South Carolina no one on that team should be taking this game lightly. I'm sure the coaches have told them all season "if you don't show up you'll lose" and South Carolina proved it and removed any doubt that it was just "coach talk". So the team should take the week of practice seriously and take Vandy seriously. Especially those guys that want a shot at the NFL who are on defense. Cause if you can't ball out against Vandy (who actually is one of the worst offenses in the SEC) then scouts are going to question if you're worth drafting at all.

I can handle 6-6 or 7-5…. I can’t handle losing to Vandy….. I don’t think it will happen though…. Go Vols…. Finish strong.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

We're going to miss the College Football playoffs by one game, and the trolls come out in force wanting to burn everything to the ground and start over. What a bunch of drama queens!

I for one do not want to burn it to the ground...but you have to admit that was one of the worst defensive gameplans of all time...giving so much ground up to recievers that gives a talented QB easy pitch and catches to get in rhythm, and not coming up with a good plan or make adjustments to get pressure is inexcusable.

Banks and Martinez suck at their job even if they don't have much to work with.

That was awful coaching and it has ruined the season...people have a right to be upset.

 

[Big Orange#1]

It ain't got a dang thing to do with "Sacking up!!!"...Vandy is playing good solid ball and we just made one of the worst offenses in the SEC look like...well...our offense at its best...oh, and in case you forgot, our Heisman candidate QB is gone forever and the guy replacing him has never been very good under the pressure of being the starting QB...and has one week to practice before being thrown into a game with the added pressure to save a great season on his shoulders...so..being worried that we are going to lose to Vandy right now is a very rational thought.

Ignoring those facts is not "sacking up"...it is living in fantasy land.

Yeah Sacking up isnt going to help that Joe Milton is going to have to overcome possibly the worst defensive coordinator in major college football history.

 

[Vol8188]

Flowers offer list was because he was a great baseball player and signed to play baseball. But Clemson put full court press on him when they we’re on top of the world. Tank and Burrell were offered by many big schools. Hadden signed with Auburn and transferred after two picks on their spring game. Oklahoma and GT (Geoff Collins is an excellent defensive coach) offered Charles.

So Flowers had one strong offer? That's not what anyone would call an impressive offer list. Yes, Hadden signed with a bad Auburn team and then left because he wouldn't see the field. Before signing with them he was a low rated and barely recruited JUCO player.

LMFAO if you're trying to convince me that a Georgia Tech offer is a sign of talent, then you've lost your mind. I'm sure Collins is a great coach. I'm also certain his roster is nowhere near SEC level. If we continue to play Georgia Tech level talent in the secondary (especially at corner, the most important position outside of QB), we will continue to lose to underwhelming teams a few times a year.

 

[TrippieRedd]

So Flowers had one strong offer? That's not what anyone would call an impressive offer list. Yes, Hadden signed with a bad Auburn team and then left because he wouldn't see the field. Before signing with them he was a low rated and barely recruited JUCO player.

LMFAO if you're trying to convince me that a Georgia Tech offer is a sign of talent, then you've lost your mind. I'm sure Collins is a great coach. I'm also certain his roster is nowhere near SEC level. If we continue to play Georgia Tech level talent in the secondary (especially at corner, the most important position outside of QB), we will continue to lose to underwhelming teams a few times a year.

Rucker was offered by
- Bama
- Auburn
- Clemson
- Fl
- FSU
- LSU
- Miami
- OK

Sorry y'all are talking about the starters

 

[ConwayFitty]

A good performance Saturday won’t erase the damage from last weekend, but it could redirect momentum heading into ESD and the offseason.

This is a WAY bigger game for us than it has any right to be.

Vandy needs it for bowl eligibility. They'll be coming to play

 

[Weezer]

One bad game does not equal regression

They've struggled in more games than not this year. It just so happened the offense couldn't bail them out this time.

 

[Weezer]

It ain't got a dang thing to do with "Sacking up!!!"...Vandy is playing good solid ball and we just made one of the worst offenses in the SEC look like...well...our offense at its best...oh, and in case you forgot, our Heisman candidate QB is gone forever and the guy replacing him has never been very good under the pressure of being the starting QB...and has one week to practice before being thrown into a game with the added pressure to save a great season on his shoulders...so..being worried that we are going to lose to Vandy right now is a very rational thought.

Ignoring those facts is not "sacking up"...it is living in fantasy land.

I had no idea you were so dainty.

Not that I'm judging.

 

[Vol8188]

Rucker was offered by
- Bama
- Auburn
- Clemson
- Fl
- FSU
- LSU
- Miami
- OK

Sorry y'all are talking about the starters

Yeah, he specifically named a bunch of guys who he claimed to be highly recruited and was wrong about nearly all of them (Tank and Burrell being the exception). And is now trying to defend a claim that GT=highly recruited.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I know that I am a day behind, but maybe, just maybe jumping to conclusions and crucifying the defense and team isn’t the best course of action. Considering that this is all based on rumor, conjecture and speculation…

I cannot fathom any group of players not playing their hardest in a game of this magnitude.

In the uga game, the offense flopped. The defense rose to the occasion especially in the second half. Everyone cut the offense slack. The defense was definitely not on the same page Saturday. Maybe, just maybe usc threw so many unseen wrinkles at the defense that they were unable to adjust. The offense didn’t keep up with usc. They were ready for Tennessee. And our team didn’t answer the bell.

11-2 is still possible as a final record for this year’s football team. I’m rooting for them to rise to the occasion, I will always support the Volunteers.

I am not nearly as upset by the loss of the game or the loss of a chance at getting a playoff berth as I am about Hendon Hooker tearing his ACL. I’m extremely sad that Saturday’s game is his last time to play as a Tennessee Volunteer. This young man is truly a VFL and he deserved a better ending to a phenomenal season.

Uhmm...the offense was going against the best and most talented defense in CFB...The defense was going against one of the worst offenses in the SEC...not a fair comparison.

Plus...it looks like 4-5 defensive guys are just jogging around trying not to get involved on a ton of plays when you watch replays...maybe it was confusion because SC was doing things they have not done all season..I don't know for sure, but the lack of effort is on film and it is plain to see.

I have thought it was on purpose...but maybe not..whatever was the cause, it was bad.

 

[csprig9]

The question is...do you think Willie has done enough on the recruiting trail to give him another season?

2022 class:
Dee Williams - 7th ranked JuCo player 2nd best JuCo CB
Jourdan Thomas - 854th ranked player in class 70th ranked safety
Christian Harrison - outside top 1k in class, 108th ranked CB in class

2023 class:
Jordan Matthews - 151st ranked player in class 17th ranked CB in class
Sylvester Smith - 222nd ranked player in class 15th ranked S in class
Rickey Gibson - 411th ranked player in class 41st ranked CB in class
Cristian Conyer - 520th ranked player in class 50th ranked CB in class
John Slaughter - 651st ranked player in class 59th ranked S in class
Jack Luttrell - 876th ranked player in class 73rd ranked S in class

2024 class:
Kaleb Beasley - 143rd ranked player in class 14th ranked CB in class


I mean, that's a lot of priority to the secondary in the 2023 class...so I'm kind of curious what next year will look like. Jordan Matthews will likely start he's got the size (6'1" 185) and he's a 10.66 100m guy so he should have the speed (that's a faster 100m than Squirrel btw). He finished top 5 in 5A in Louisiana for the 100m and 200m as a Junior.

Get Florida’s secondary coach and recruiting will be fine

 

[volbeast33]

The question is...do you think Willie has done enough on the recruiting trail to give him another season?

2022 class:
Dee Williams - 7th ranked JuCo player 2nd best JuCo CB
Jourdan Thomas - 854th ranked player in class 70th ranked safety
Christian Harrison - outside top 1k in class, 108th ranked CB in class

2023 class:
Jordan Matthews - 151st ranked player in class 17th ranked CB in class
Sylvester Smith - 222nd ranked player in class 15th ranked S in class
Rickey Gibson - 411th ranked player in class 41st ranked CB in class
Cristian Conyer - 520th ranked player in class 50th ranked CB in class
John Slaughter - 651st ranked player in class 59th ranked S in class
Jack Luttrell - 876th ranked player in class 73rd ranked S in class

2024 class:
Kaleb Beasley - 143rd ranked player in class 14th ranked CB in class


I mean, that's a lot of priority to the secondary in the 2023 class...so I'm kind of curious what next year will look like. Jordan Matthews will likely start he's got the size (6'1" 185) and he's a 10.66 100m guy so he should have the speed (that's a faster 100m than Squirrel btw). He finished top 5 in 5A in Louisiana for the 100m and 200m as a Junior.

Gibson is a 4.3 guy as well….. DB recruiting could definitely improve though.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I had no idea you were so dainty.

Not that I'm judging.

Lol...I am a lot of things...dainty ain't one of them.