Recruiting Forum Football Talk III

[JCVol00]

That’ll be enough out of you for the night

Sunday night drinking, ammi right

 

[fatdawg]

Imagine having all that talent and still finishing 10-2 every year.

I get your point but just for accuracy Kirby has never won 10 regular season games or 10 total games in one season at UGA. Regular season record in his five years at UGA.

2016 8-4
2017 11-1
2018 11-1
2019 11-1
2020 7-2

 

[UTProf]

Yeah - your last point is the biggest. We cannot get out of our own way.

I'd one day like to be firing a coach for the same reasons Auburn fired Malzahn - "he bored us because he made bowl games every year, recruited top 10 classes, pumped out NFL talent, won an SEC title or two, but only played for one national championship."

Pretty sure we are in this mess because we fired that guy already because like Malzahn he bored us. The difference between us and every other program appears to be that our money folks can’t be bothered to step away from their infighting long enough to fix things. Maybe we will get lucky this time around but I don’t think we will ever be functional as long as our power players are more interested in their schemes than having a successful program.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Unpopular opinion, but Tayven Jackson reminds me a lot of JG, look at his stats and tell me he is SEC caliber. His rank is what JGs should’ve been
View attachment 365765

#blocked

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

I get your point but just for accuracy Kirby has never won 10 regular season games or 10 total games in one season at UGA. Regular season record in his five years at UGA.

2016 8-4
2017 11-1
2018 11-1
2019 11-1
2020 7-2

Nobody cares

 

[unfrozencvmanvol]

A math and history lesson for those who seem, what is it?, too "dumb" to do math, and research history...Train calling ANYONE dumb drips of irony, and is downright laughable; but, I digress...a math lesson, along with some history...

First off, comparing UGA to UT right now doesn't even deserve a response. Saying we underachieve more, based on recruiting (still shaking my head at that one), shows a lack of knowing anything.

The last 10 years...
Recruiting ranking for UGA:
21:4
20:1
19:2
18:1
17:3
16:6
15:6
14:8
13:12
12:9

For those too "dumb" to average, that puts UGA at an average class of 5.2...Top 5 in recruiting...in the nation, in one of the top 4 talent rich states in the entire country.

For ALLLLLLL of that talent over the last 10 yrs, they have to show for it: 4 Eastern Division Championships...1, yes, 1, whole SEC Championship...and, as we all know and love ZERO National Championships.

Over those 10 years, they have averaged 10 wins a season, meaning they lose at least 2 games a year. Again...with ALLLLLLLLL THAT TALENT.

Train and frozen, you two deserve each other. Walk hand in hand to the first math class, then proceed to history.

Not sure why you're acting nasty about this. Comparing recruiting rankings to results has always been an interest of mine since I've followed recruiting from the mid-90's. The 247 talent composite is the best measure created to date for doing so since it takes transfers, dropouts, medical retirements, people kicked off teams for disciplinary reasons, etc. into account and thus gives you a more true picture of the talent currently on teams. It has been a project of mine for awhile now to map out teams performance over the history of the talent composite. I intend to post the whole thing when I get it completed and then update it annually so that we can track it.

Since you bring it up though, I would note that the 21' season has yet to be played. So you are tracking 10 recruiting classes against 9 seasons. As to UGA, using your recruiting rank numbers, there's a trend there. UGA's last 5 recruiting classes, per the numbers you cited, have an average ranking of 2.2. The 5 years before that they averaged 8.2. Tracking results versus those numbers, for the most recent 5 years of recruiting, which again encompasses only 4 seasons played at this point, UGA has 4 top 10's, 3 division championships, 1 SEC championship and 4 NY6 bowl games. In the previous 5 years before that, they had 2 top 10's, 1 division championship, zero SEC championships and zero NY6 bowl games. UGA has the same problem most of college football has, Bama. In the last 9 seasons you mentioned, Bama has recruited better than anyone. Bama finished #1 in recruiting on the composite 7 of those 9 years. UGA finished # 1 in 2018 and 2020, those are their rising senior and sophomore classes.

 

[avolation]

I wonder what a doctor would say to me if I said I was a pirate and then asked to have my right leg sawed off and a peg leg installed in its place?

Arrr!

This sounds crazy but there’s actually a condition called body integrity identity disorder where people want to amputate heathy limbs. A lot of older psychologists think it’s similar to body dysmorphia but that’s not what they’re teaching in schools these days unfortunately.

 

[PlanetVolunteer]

Unpopular opinion, but Tayven Jackson reminds me a lot of JG, look at his stats and tell me he is SEC caliber. His rank is what JGs should’ve been
View attachment 365765

There's only one person who has ever played like JG and that's JG

He's a rare breed

To compare him to JG is to say that he will never complete a swing pass, constantly wet the bed in big moments with catastrophic turnover after catastrophic turnover for 4 straight years with zero development (kinda 5 years now because his first WSU pass was lobbed into triple coverage, five yards short and behind his receiver)

 

[Weezer]

Unpopular opinion, but Tayven Jackson reminds me a lot of JG, look at his stats and tell me he is SEC caliber. His rank is what JGs should’ve been
View attachment 365765

I feel like you're trying to make McGill's ignore list with this post.

 

[unfrozencvmanvol]

I feel like you're trying to make McGill's ignore list with this post.

Pretty easy to do, the fall of Pruitt must have hit McGill particularly hard since he had worked very tirelessly before that to stay in his protective bubble where everyone praised the Gump.

 

[Weezer]

Pretty easy to do, the fall of Pruitt must have hit McGill particularly hard since he had worked very tirelessly before that to stay in his protective bubble where everyone praised the Gump.

Spoken like someone already on the list.

 

[unfrozencvmanvol]

Spoken like someone already on the list.

Probably, he tended to blacklist anyone who didn't have his or her nose firmly planted up Beldar's rectum.

 

[SweetasSoda]

Are they our own fans tho?

I don't think they understand what the word "fan" means. Especially do not know what "Volunteer fan" means.

 

[SweetasSoda]

I get your point but just for accuracy Kirby has never won 10 regular season games or 10 total games in one season at UGA. Regular season record in his five years at UGA.

2016 8-4
2017 11-1
2018 11-1
2019 11-1
2020 7-2

Oh, look....he had to play AL during the regular season in 2020.

 

[SweetasSoda]

I feel like you're trying to make McGill's ignore list with this post.

There's been a few on here tonight fighting to be next.

 

[unfrozencvmanvol]

He pulled data to show how bad we suck and said we should not make fun of our rivals. I am always going to make fun of my rival teams. I am also going to call people out for holding their jocks.

I didn't tell anyone they couldn't make fun of anyone else. I prefer to rip other teams on things that are objectively true. The best thing to hammer UGA fans on is 1980. It's true, and they hate it. You can have a great deal of fun with it. I tell my law partners who are UGA grads that their cheerleaders from 1980 have been on Medicare for a decade, etc. Like I said, I've been pulling that data bit by bit for awhile now. When I complete the research, I am going to post it so we can track it on an annual basis.

 

[unfrozencvmanvol]

Just need to point out this falls under the old adage, “lies, damn lies, and statistics.” You fail to account for the fact that while we are 15th in the country, we are stil 6th or 7th in the SEC while UGA is 2nd. How many of our losses are to teams with a lower average team talent compared to UGA? That’s an infinitely better gauge of underachieving based on recruiting.
Here is a list of average recruiting ranking over the last 10 cycles.
Ranking the Best Average Recruiting Classes over the Last Decade

By my count 36 of our losses came to teams with a higher average team talent ranking. This doesn’t include losses to teams like Oregon or Ole Miss who had more talented teams (by recruiting ranking the years we played them). Since only Bama is ahead of UGA, only 5 of their 31 losses have come to teams with a higher average talent ranking.
Putting that together, we have lost 26 games to teams with lower average talent rankings over the last 10 years compared to UGA’s 26. I’d say that’s pretty even. Sure they have almost double the number of wins that we do against “less talented” teams but the talent gap is much larger between them and their average opponent than it is between us and our average opponent.

"Average recruiting ranking" is not a static number over a 10 year period though, the talent on any given team fluctuates from year to year, that's why the 247 talent composite is the best measure to use for making the kind of comparisons you want to make, it takes into account transfers, dropouts, non-qualifiers, medical retirements, people removed for disciplinary reasons, etc. on a yearly basis.

For example, let's look at LSU over the last 4 seasons, and you'll see what I'm talking about, statistics are a source of "lies" when people don't compare apples to apples.

2017 (LSU's composite talent rank # 6, the composite ranking of all the other teams for that particular year are ranked below)

BYU, W, # 52
Chattanooga, W, NR
Miss State, L, # 25
Syracuse, W, # 62
Troy, L, # 116
Florida, W, # 17
Auburn, W, # 8
Ole Miss, W, # 18
Alabama, L, # 1
Arkansas, W, # 22
Tennessee, W, # 12
Texas A&M, W, # 15
Notre Dame, L, # 10

If you go by pure numbers, assuming for example that # 6 should always beat # 7 and so forth, which we all know it's never that simple, but assuming it is, LSU should have gone 12-1 against this schedule in 2017, but went 9-4.

2018 (LSU's composite talent rank # 7)

Miami, W, # 17
SE Louisiana, W, # 134
Auburn, W, # 14
Louisiana Tech, W
Ole Miss, W, # 22
Florida, L, # 12
Georgia, W, # 3
Mississippi State, W, # 23
Alabama, L, # 2
Arkansas, W, # 27
Rice, W, # 106
Texas A&M, L, # 16
UCF, W, # 56

If you go by pure numbers, which again, has flaws such as not taking into account home and away or differences in QB play, which can make a big difference among closely matched teams, LSU should have gone, 11-2 against this schedule, but went 10-3.

2019 (LSU's composite talent rank # 5)

Georgia Southern, W, # 102
Texas, W, # 7
NW State, W, NR
Vanderbilt, W, # 52
Utah State, W, # 97
Florida, W, # 15
Mississippi State, W, # 23
Auburn, W, # 13
Alabama, W, # 1
Ole Miss, W, # 25
Arkansas, W, # 26
Texas A&M, W, # 12
Georgia, W, # 3
Oklahoma, W, # 8
Clemson, W, # 9

Going strictly by numbers, LSU should have gone 13-2 against this slate, but went 15-0.

2020 (LSU's composite talent rank # 6)

Miss State, L, # 23
Vandy, W, # 54
Missouri, L, # 50
South Carolina, W, # 21
Auburn, L, # 14
Arkansas, W, # 25
Texas A&M, L, # 11
Alabama, L, # 2
Florida, W, # 7
Ole Miss, W, # 29

Going strictly by numbers, LSU should have gone 9-1 against this schedule but actually went 5-5.

So over a 4 year period, going by their talent composite numbers, LSU is underachieving by 6 games. I'm not breaking down Tennessee or Bama or Georgia or Florida at this time, but as you can see, teams fluctuate in talent from year to year, and if you break those teams or any others down this way, by talent composite, by year, going strictly by the rankings, that would be comparing apples to apples.

 

[UTProf]

Wtf is this? Is there any context?

 

[UTProf]

Farrell just destroyed himself and continued to double down when called out. Dat boy is dumb as dirt.

What did his tweet say? I gather that It was negative with regards to Trey but no one has ever knocked Trey’s playing. Is he seriously acting like Smith was just over rated rather than a guy who got hit with a serious medical condition and still became an All American?

 

[unfrozencvmanvol]

Wtf is this? Is there any context?

Mike Farrell was way wrong to say what he did about Trey, but that's textbook libel right there if it's a misrepresentation. Get out ya checkbook.

 

[UTProf]

For those that always lose their s**t about recruiting all State kids

6 total players from the state of Tennessee were drafted last night.

Trey Smith
Amari Rodgers
Jacoby Stevens
Quentin Bohanna
Sadarius Hutcherson
Patrick Johnson (2 star that was on no ones radar)


The state of Georgia had 6.. in the 1st round alone. 31 total. Florida had 48, the Carolinas had 13,

10.62 million
21.48 million
15 million 636k (the Carolinas combined)

Vs
6.82 million

We’ve never made our bones by staying local but you’re making a very skewed comparison when you don’t factor in the population of a state. TN HS football is getting better and will continue to grow along with our population boom. In the meantime output is good whereas it had been underperforming in years prior. Mississippi is the oddity in that its output greatly outpaces its population. Tennessee needs to be closer to the output you see from Louisiana and has been on an upward climb but barring a dramatic population shift Florida and Georgia are always going to produce more

 

[UTMVol76]

What did his tweet say? I gather that It was negative with regards to Trey but no one has ever knocked Trey’s playing. Is he seriously acting like Smith was just over rated rather than a guy who got hit with a serious medical condition and still became an All American?

 

[Weezer]

What's painful is when you look at the prospects in TN and see most of the really good ones are leaving the state to play college ball. Walter Nolen, leaving the state (and I'm gonna cry when he does).Ty Simpson, going to Bama. Jordan James, going to Georgia. Keaten Wade, freakin' Kentucky. We're battling Ohio State to get Dallan Hayden, and he's a legacy. Those are the top 5 players in the state according to 247 and we might get one of them. Tennessee kids have zero loyalty to UT. And why should they? We're on our 5th HC since Fulmer and these kids have only ever seen us as a train wreck. We've got to change that if we ever hope to be relevant again. If you can't get the best players from your own state, how do you entice the best players from other states to come? Other than paying them like Pruitt, that is.

This staff is in a pickle because they're gonna have to be spot on with evaluations to build us back toward relevance. The only way we get the top kids to look our way again is to win. We have to win all the games we're supposed to and get to the point we can pull off upsets. We have to make these kids notice us again. We definitely have to become a destination for the in-state talent. I just hope we finally have the right coaches to pull this off.

 

[UTMVol76]

What's painful is when you look at the prospects in TN and see most of the really good ones are leaving the state to play college ball. Walter Nolen, leaving the state (and I'm gonna cry when he does).Ty Simpson, going to Bama. Jordan James, going to Georgia. Keaten Wade, freakin' Kentucky. We're battling Ohio State to get Dallan Hayden, and he's a legacy. Those are the top 5 players in the state according to 247 and we might get one of them. Tennessee kids have zero loyalty to UT. And why should they? We're on our 5th HC since Fulmer and these kids have only ever seen us as a train wreck. We've got to change that if we ever hope to be relevant again. If you can't get the best players from your own state, how do you entice the best players from other states to come? Other than paying them like Pruitt, that is.

This staff is in a pickle because they're gonna have to be spot on with evaluations to build us back toward relevance. The only way we get the top kids to look our way again is to win. We have to win all the games we're supposed to and get to the point we can pull off upsets. We have to make these kids notice us again. We definitely have to become a destination for the in-state talent. I just hope we finally have the right coaches to pull this off.

The positive is that since CJH is an offensive guy, if he gets that going, and Quickly!, that alone will start attracting kids. Kids will want to play in a high octane, exciting offense more than anything.

 

[rekinhavoc]

There were dudes in here defending this lunacy the other day. Put your daughter in the cage with a man dressed up like a woman. Go ahead

I can tell you having taught young people martial arts there is a certain point you have to start keeping a close eye on girls and boys sparring.