Gun control debate (merged)

Horse pucky ... you don’t have to move entire households . Men and women from the south went to work in cities Detroit and Chicago in when the jobs were nonexistent. We watch men and women walk and catch rides for thousands of miles with nothing but what they can carry just to get to our southern border everyday . There’s always a way .
There is an economic reality in play when it comes to employment. We typically find those facts distasteful but it doesn't change them. When people can earn more money for easier work, they will take that employment. People back in the day found the work to be easier and more rewarding than tilling their own land. People in China who work for a few cents per hour find that employment to be favorable over working other places.

Of course, this assumes the people making those decisions are allowed to make their own decisions and not forced into labor by their government.
 
Joining a union isn’t a choice in some places if you want a job there. Which is the point.

Rail Road . One of the first things they will tell you is that they are a union company if you don’t want to be in the union this job isn’t for you . That was the Company saying it not the union . Lol
 
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Your opinion on giving people an excuse to not relocate and my opinion on people giving up their own self determination will never be resolved. I'm at peace with that reality.

Do you support legal recourse against union employees preventing, harassing, and harming other employees to work the jobs they are striking against?
No I don’t (except in the case of harm, that’s too far). You’re then, in my view, regulating a union and deregulating the business. If you truly believe in a deregulated market, an unfettered union is also part of deregulation. If that isn’t part of your idea of deregulation, then you are clearly just pro-employer.
 
No I don’t (except in the case of harm, that’s too far). You’re then, in my view, regulating a union and deregulating the business. If you truly believe in a deregulated market, an unfettered union is also part of deregulation. If that isn’t part of your idea of deregulation, then you are clearly just pro-employer.

Odd. You favor people having unfettered choice to unionize. But you do not favor non union employees unfettered access to the same employment. Seems like your "Unfettered Avenue" is a one way street. Your inconsistency is apparent but not surprising.
 
Side note, there must be some renewed interest in unionization because it is popping up "randomly" on other social media platforms. The marching orders have been given it seems.

What company or industry is trying desperately to unionize currently?
 
No I don’t (except in the case of harm, that’s too far). You’re then, in my view, regulating a union and deregulating the business. If you truly believe in a deregulated market, an unfettered union is also part of deregulation. If that isn’t part of your idea of deregulation, then you are clearly just pro-employer.
lol imagine being "anti-employer" in your twisted world.
 
Odd. You favor people having unfettered choice to unionize. But you do not favor non union employees unfettered access to the same employment. Seems like your "Unfettered Avenue" is a one way street. Your inconsistency is apparent but not surprising.
No, they can choose that employment absolutely, they just have to weigh the consequences of crossing the union to get that employment... it just seems that you prefer a union that can’t exercise it’s own powers.
 
No, they can choose that employment absolutely, they just have to weigh the consequences of crossing the union to get that employment... it just seems that you prefer a union that can’t exercise it’s own powers.

Is "weighing the consequences of crossing the union" unfettered?

Does a union of like-minded people have power outside of their own group? Do they possess power of other people who are not like minded?
 
Is "weighing the consequences of crossing the union" unfettered?

Does a union of like-minded people have power outside of their own group? Do they possess power of other people who are not like minded?
They do don’t possess power to control other’s actions if that’s what you’re asking. They do possess the power to create a situation that makes a decision to cross the picket line difficult.
 
They do don’t possess power to control other’s actions if that’s what you’re asking. They do possess the power to create a situation that makes a decision to cross the picket line difficult.
Is that how you define unfettered?
 
I am 2 generations removed from employer tyranny. As my family and everyone in their region experienced it (a coal mining region) 2-3 employers exercised a complete monopoly of the region. The employers controlled every available job, every consumer good, every logistical/transportation aspect, the entire real estate market, and the currency (company notes). This created a situation where the employee-employer agreement was not a choice. If you wanted to survive, you worked for the company in control (and most didn’t have the resources to relocate to find different employment opportunities).

This pressure cooker created the necessity for organized labor to fight off monopolistic tyranny. Now, today’s America is certainly not an industrial economy as it was in the 20th century, we are a post-industrial service based economy. The unions of last century also made a lot of headway in setting standards and getting labor laws passed that protect people from the conditions experienced previously, but that doesn’t make us immune from the crushing effects of monopolies and wealth is being consolidated into fewer and fewer hands just as it was back then. Corporations and the super wealthy, arguably, have more influence over elected officials today than any other time in American history, always threatening labor laws that have been put in place. Maintaining the power of unionization is the most effective tool that workers have to fend off potential tyranny from extremely large and powerful employers.

Unions aren’t perfect, just like any other organization, but their basic purpose still remains relevant.
Your scenario implies there is no other option. Either work in a coal mine or die. I assume the coal mines did not exist or were smaller scale when your people lived there, so surely there were other professions or subsistence farming before they came along. And if the mines cannot find labor they don't make money. People have more leverage than they give themselves credit for. It is always the assumption the corporation is an unstoppable behemoth you must submit to. As if coal companies or Walmart or Amazon are immortal monoliths that have existed before time began and are immune to market dynamics.
 
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Your scenario implies there is no other option. Either work in a coal mine or die. I assume the coal mines did not exist or were smaller scale when your people lived there, so surely there were other professions or subsistence farming before they came along. And if the mines cannot find labor they don't make money. People have more leverage than they give themselves credit for. It is always the assumption the corporation is an unstoppable behemoth you must submit to. As if coal companies or Walmart or Amazon are immortal monoliths that have existed before time began and are immune to market dynamics.
You must have missed the part where the companies controlled the real estate market (aka bought up all the farms for mineral rights and established company housing), controlled all transportation and logistics, the general stores and grocers, and paid their employees in company notes that could only be used at company stores (fixing prices for more profit and disallowing any kind of savings or wealth building opportunities).
 
Unfettered means unimpeded. If an employer can incentivize people to work for them during labor disputes then a union can disincentivize. It’s a simple concept.

A group of people discouraging others seeking lawful employment is "unfettered" by your definition?
 
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