I think some of you seriously misunderstand Butch

#201
#201
Bballvol said:
Do you not realize that his 7.5 wpy is at a school who probably couldn't have beat Central Michigan when he took over?
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Give me a friggin break.

I don't discount the mess that Dooley made but if there was enough in the tank to take a top 10 GA team to the wire and enough to upset SC, then I think they would have been able to handle Central Michigan.
 
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#202
#202
99bubble said:
We know you don't like Butch. But on this subject, of the east being down, it is simply not true. You can say it all you want and listen to talking heads say it, but it isn't true. If you look at the thread DAJ had on overall talent, the SEC East has never been stronger. Recruiting at the lower tier schools has improved more than 100% in the rankings over the last decade. Where KY, VANDY, and SC used to be in the 50-100 range, they are all now much higher and have better teams than any of the teams Fulmer and Majors played in November. Bad mouth Jones if you want, put forth legitimate arguments, whatever you want. But please look at the true numbers and quit saying the east is weak and therefore Jones sucks. It simply isn't true.
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The east is weak and Butch Jones sucks.

Tennessee played outside of the state 3 times the entire year and two of those games were against first year head coaches.

Oh yeah, Butch Jones is the most senior head coach in the east. I nearly forgot that. But your telling me that those other programs are stronger because they turned their programs around faster?

You can talk about recruiting rankings all you want but you're the only person on earth claiming that the East was stronger than ever.
 
#203
#203
'Boro-vol said:
I don't doubt we can...And should. My answer was to those that think wanting more is unreasonable. My legitimate expectations are not unrealistic.
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I think every Vol fan wants more. But what I don't get is the delusional belief that this program is more than it is historically. Yes, eons ago, Neyland was a beast. But, outside of that, this program has been very good, but rarely great.

Think about this. Since the 1990 Sugar Bowl against Virginia (around 26 seasons), this program has played in 3 major bowl games (1997-99). That is it. Even during the four Manning seasons, it was only one.

And if you look at 1970-90, it probably wasn't much better.

Now, is Butch going to be able to get us over the hump that has existed for nearly 50 years? It doesn't look promising, but after hiring Shoop last year (a homerun hire even if it didn't show in his first season, and hopefully Helfrich this year, it shows that he sees where improvement is needed on his staff. he has at least earned another year or two based on where he has brought the program from IMO. I see no reason to make a knee jerk move now. If Chip Kelly was beating down our door, maybe. But, I doubt that is the case. Although hiring Helfrich might open that possibility in the future.
 
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#205
#205
99bubble said:
We know you don't like Butch. But on this subject, of the east being down, it is simply not true. You can say it all you want and listen to talking heads say it, but it isn't true. If you look at the thread DAJ had on overall talent, the SEC East has never been stronger. Recruiting at the lower tier schools has improved more than 100% in the rankings over the last decade. Where KY, VANDY, and SC used to be in the 50-100 range, they are all now much higher and have better teams than any of the teams Fulmer and Majors played in November. Bad mouth Jones if you want, put forth legitimate arguments, whatever you want. But please look at the true numbers and quit saying the east is weak and therefore Jones sucks. It simply isn't true.
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The team that won the division by 2 games lost 3 games outside the division (or to teams that had a pulse). Those 3 Ls were by an average margin of 26 points.

The bottom feeders are not the reason that the top is poor.
 
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#206
#206
Gandalf said:
It seems all I hear from the "supposed negavols" is that CBJ is happy with (or at least accepting of) mediocrity - good but not great - because he simply doesnt have the skills to get us to glory and likely never will. Thus he tries to convince the fanbase that 8-9 wins is "good enough" for where we are at and that you should continually blindly hope for the future, because hey, you never know.

You people are silly. Its not that CBJ accepts or is happy with anything less than a championship - its just that he didnt get there this year (for a lot of reasons, some his fault and others not), and he is trying to re-frame to the positive. "Always be thinking positive" is likely something he buys into. I have absolutely no inside info whatsoever but CBJ presents as someone whom is 100% bought into the whole shtick, full on Knute Rockne style. And I doubt he could sell it if he wasnt.

Vol fans need to understand, they are likely NEVER to see CBJ speak a negative word about his coaches, players or lack of success, in a game or a season - or anyone else's for that matter. Its just not his style. Steve Spurrier he is not and never will be. Get used to it.

A pretty much universally accepted fact is that Butch has done a good job of resurrecting UT from the dumpster fire we were in for almost a decade. Where it wasnt a question of winning the Bowl game or griping about not getting the one we wanted but IF we would even get one. Now we are back to where winning seasons are expected as a given and EVERYONE expects UT to compete for the East at a minimum and have a real shot of getting to the playoffs. That deserves a lot of respect because no, we dont have winning seasons, bowl games and recruit top 10 just because we are Tennessee. It takes a lot of work and talent over other people who are trying to do exactly the same thing, especially in the SEC.

That said, NOBODY is satisfied with where we are at (ending as merely a top 25 program 2nd year in a row) - and that MOST ESPECIALLY includes "Lyle" Butch Jones. The good news is that he is fairly young for coaching a top program so he has energy and time to learn. I think it can be said that he has made the adjustment from mid major to power 5 and even as a competitive coach in the SEC but it remains to be seen if he can make the leap to being an elite coach. Will he succeed? I dont know but he is making adjustments, including coaching changes, etc, so perhaps he can. Lets all hope so but dont expect to hear anything but relentless coach speak to ever leave his lips. That is how he is wired and he (righly) thinks that the only difference between being laughed at and derided for his aphorisms versus seeing everyone declare them as pearls of genius that Vol Nation will put as Holy Writ on posters on their walls... is just 2-3 more wins per season :thumbsup:
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Infinity likes.
 
#207
#207
volfannbama said:
The main issue here is that there is no middle ground, either you are a sunshine pumper telling everyone to shut up and color or your are negavol that wants Butch fired.
Just because you are always thinking positive doesn't mean you are always right. Most reasonable people can be happy about the wins and things CBJ has done with the program and can also express the opinion of doubt that he will take the vols any further, while providing logical thinking to back it up. And they should be able to do so without begin called silly, stupid, and having their character and fanhood questioned.
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But the anti-Butch crowd doesn'the do the same.
 
#209
#209
MWAVolfan said:
The east is weak and Butch Jones sucks.

Tennessee played outside of the state 3 times the entire year and two of those games were against first year head coaches.

Oh yeah, Butch Jones is the most senior head coach in the east. I nearly forgot that. But your telling me that those other programs are stronger because they turned their programs around faster?

You can talk about recruiting rankings all you want but you're the only person on earth claiming that the East was stronger than ever.
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you suck
 
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#211
#211
welcome to volnation... where we regularly eat our own and are perpetually never happy with anything. where we have just set records on the offensive side of the ball and won our 3rd straight bowl game yet many posts on this thread alone of "butch sucks" "butch hired debord who both sucks" "will never win anything here". this idea of burning the place down every 4 years is so insane, i can't believe yall think any kind of continued success would be possible doing that. if ut keeps firing coaches like many of yall want, once the really big time hire comes around he won't touch ut with a 10ft pole. he won't because of the lack of support and loyalty shown by the administration who's trigger happy firing coaches due to delusional fans.

and then corey vereen's dad comes on here the other day and claims he's been a long time lurker of this site and just wanted to say thanks. all fine and dandy until you think of all the crap threads like this one that are just filled with so much hate and void of logic and constantly bashing players (dobbs can't hit broad side of barn) and coaches (butch sucks and will never win crap). and yall wanna tell me players and players parents aren't coming on here and seeing this sh*t? man, this site has gone full retard mode
 
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#212
#212
The east was a joke this year and it was gift wrapped for us until we blew it against USCjr and Vandy. There's no excuse for that. If it's not alarming to you that this is a trend for Butch, blowing games that is I'm not sure what to tell you. The talent level will drop off this season, while everyone else in the east is going to improve. And with the way we're recruiting it's going to get worse before it gets better
 
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#213
#213
Guys, from a bowl perspective we just beat an unranked Nebraska...last year it was an over ranked NW or was that Iowa...I forget. That's got me positive.
 
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#214
#214
Brasszilla said:
welcome to volnation... where we regularly eat our own and are perpetually never happy with anything. where we have just set records on the offensive side of the ball and won our 3rd straight bowl game yet many posts on this thread alone of "butch sucks" "butch hired debord who both sucks" "will never win anything here". this idea of burning the place down every 4 years is so insane, i can't believe yall think any kind of continued success would be possible doing that. if ut keeps firing coaches like many of yall want, once the really big time hire comes around he won't touch ut with a 10ft pole. he won't because of the lack of support and loyalty shown by the administration who's trigger happy firing coaches due to delusional fans.

and then corey vereen's dad comes on here the other day and claims he's been a long time lurker of this site and just wanted to say thanks. all fine and dandy until you think of all the crap threads like this one that are just filled with so much hate and void of logic and constantly bashing players (dobbs can't hit broad side of barn) and coaches (butch sucks and will never win crap). and yall wanna tell me players and players parents aren't coming on here and seeing this sh*t? man, this site has gone full retard mode
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You're right, UT a top 10 program should just be happy with breaking records on offense and beating crappy teams in bowl games. Who needs SEC east titles or SEC titles let's just be OK with 8-9 win seasons and blowing games we have no business losing
 
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#220
#220
JonGrudensAgent said:
Historically, we haven't owned Nebraska and now we do. Leave Buzzcut Jesus alone, he is doing miracles for the Vols. Miracles I say!!
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Lol...Buzzcut Jesus.

Thanks a lot...I just spit coffee out on my desk at work. People are staring now.
 
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#222
#222
Brasszilla said:
welcome to volnation... where we regularly eat our own and are perpetually never happy with anything. where we have just set records on the offensive side of the ball and won our 3rd straight bowl game yet many posts on this thread alone of "butch sucks" "butch hired debord who both sucks" "will never win anything here". this idea of burning the place down every 4 years is so insane, i can't believe yall think any kind of continued success would be possible doing that. if ut keeps firing coaches like many of yall want, once the really big time hire comes around he won't touch ut with a 10ft pole. he won't because of the lack of support and loyalty shown by the administration who's trigger happy firing coaches due to delusional fans.

and then corey vereen's dad comes on here the other day and claims he's been a long time lurker of this site and just wanted to say thanks. all fine and dandy until you think of all the crap threads like this one that are just filled with so much hate and void of logic and constantly bashing players (dobbs can't hit broad side of barn) and coaches (butch sucks and will never win crap). and yall wanna tell me players and players parents aren't coming on here and seeing this sh*t? man, this site has gone full retard mode
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Truth
 
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