Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXX

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#2,702
#2,702
The only people who think Butch is on thin ice are the ones who were annoyed when we were 5-0 and the mouthbreathers on SEC Rant.
 
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#2,703
#2,703
volssam said:
I'm starting to get frustrated, ha. I'm trying to find a way to explain my point that may make it more understandae. But it keeps sounding rude. And that's not what I want. At all. So I'm just gonna let it go.

I guess you're not seeing my points. And Its ok. I don't want to bruin my point to death and just keep re-stating it. Ha. Moving on. Take care seanjean.
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Fair enough. I don't want to be rude or beat it to death either. I think I understand your point though, I just don't agree with it. It's all good. No hard feelings.
 
#2,704
#2,704
Aesius said:
Beat Vandy and win the bowl game.

Extend Butch's contract. Has to be done for recruiting and staff hiring purposes. 10-3 will make it easy to do so. 9-4 less so.

Fire any assistants who aren't performing. 4 years of evaluation is long enough to know whether guys are elite recruiters and coaches.

Whether it's Hart or Blackburn on the job, give Butch the green light and financial backing to make the best staff hires possible. And get away from the Central Michigan coaching bubble.
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Don't hamstring the new AD by giving Butch an extension. Let the new AD make that decision.
 
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#2,706
#2,706
If Butch had lost 2 of these last 3 he def would have been on thin ice. But as it stands he is not. Like it or not he has brought our program back to relevance. Is this the pinnacle that remains to be seem. He def is at a crossroads though.
 
#2,708
#2,708
When is Dave Hart supposed to retire? Seems like we have been searching for an AD for an eternity. I would hope we have a new AD soon after conference championships are done.
 
#2,709
#2,709
Pepe_Silvia said:
Don't hamstring the new AD by giving Butch an extension. Let the new AD make that decision.
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Sure, if you want another year with our current crop of assistants or replacements who are even worse. No contract extension and a new AD coming in will make guys very hesitant to move to Knoxville for what might be a year one gig.

Plus, failing to "reward' Butch for 10-3 and a possible Sugar Bowl appearance would be a bad look given where we were when he took over.
 
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#2,711
#2,711
AAVFL said:
When is Dave Hart supposed to retire? Seems like we have been searching for an AD for an eternity. I would hope we have a new AD soon after conference championships are done.
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Yeah, the timetable seemed onerously long, but I get not wanting to hire an AD before a chancellor, at least outwardly.
 
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#2,713
#2,713
Back to on-the-field discussions.

Based on this year's performance, I suggest Foreman is an underrated player on this team and Gaulden is overrated.

Foreman actually contests balls in the air and had a good score by one of those websites not too long ago (barring that last TD in the GA game).

Gaulden hits like a mad man, but he really allows quite a few completions. He also had a very bad score by that same website (don't recall the name).

I say this realizing I haven't reviewed every play this year, and I may be way off, but I was just wondering if anyone else had similar thoughts.
 
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#2,715
#2,715
volssam said:
Butch and the Vols lost a game to South Carolina they shouldn't have lost. This is true, but....

Dabo and Clemson lost to Pitt
The great Harbaugh and Michigan lost to Iowa
The great Urbs and OSU lost to Penn state
Gus and Auburn lost to a bad UGA team
Kirby and UGA lost to vandy
Freeze and Ole Miss lost to vandy
Sumlin and A&M lost to Mississippi state
Fuente and VA Tech lost to Syracuse
Jimbo and FSU lost to UNC
Gundy and OK State lost to Central Michigan
The great Herman and Houston lost to Navy and SMU
The great Dantonio and Sparty has lost to everybody

It happens to literally every single coach. Without exception. It doesn't happen often to Saban but it happens.

But some fans want Butch gone or at least his seat to be flaming hot. And then in such a toxic environment, Butch's coachspeak gets blown out of proportion.

And y'all wonder why some big time coaches are wary of coming here.
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It happens everywhere expectations are high. It's why Bob wants to leave Oklahoma. It's why Jimbo is shopping on Florida State. It's why Urbs left Florida.

Look what happened to Richt and Miles. All fans and media behave like this. It's not special to Tennessee.
 
#2,716
#2,716
Aesius said:
Sure, if you want another year with our current crop of assistants or replacements who are even worse. No contract extension and a new AD coming in will make guys very hesitant to move to Knoxville for what might be a year one gig.

Plus, failing to "reward' Butch for 10-3 and a possible Sugar Bowl appearance would be a bad look given where we were when he took over.
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If we hire an AD within the next month or so that gives the new AD plenty of time between then and Feb to get an extension done and set the groundwork for assistant pool
 
#2,721
#2,721
It's Thanksgiving week. I am thankful for Butch Jones. He took a program that was in the tank, couldn't even make it to a bowl game, was the laughing stock of college football and he has made us relevant again. We may even go to the sugar bowl and will have a chance to win 10 games for the first time since Fulmer. Thanks Butch!
 
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#2,722
#2,722
AAVFL said:
If we hire an AD within the next month or so that gives the new AD plenty of time between then and Feb to get an extension done and set the groundwork for assistant pool
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Yes, with the chancellor hire we will hopefully have Blackburn on the job by the time any decisions need to be made.
 
#2,723
#2,723
I'm gonna add some of my own thoughts to this discussion -- not that anyone cares.

My expectation for this season was 10-2. We've fallen short of that. But if someone had told me the extent of the injuries we'd suffer through just the third game, I would have revised my expectation to 8-4 or 7-5. If, on the other hand someone told me we'd beat Florida and Georgia and enter the last game of the season talking about the Sugar Bowl, I'd have been ecstatic.

None of that is meant to excuse the mistakes and the negatives. Those are real concerns. I said myself after the South Carolina game that Butch had earned his way onto the hot seat. Now I didn't mean that to suggest we'd fire him this year; that was never going to happen, nor should it. But the honeymoon is over and he's going to get a more skeptical eye now, and he DID earn it. Even with all the injuries, with a bit more ball discipline we beat South Carolina and TAMU. The performance against South Carolina especially, after a bye week and with division title implications, is simply not going to cut it here long term.

But Butch Jones DID take us to our first 5-0 start since 1998. He DID end an 11-game losing streak to Florida. He DID lead the team to a 7-1 finish after starting 2-3 last year. He DID make Tennessee a nationally relevant program again. All those things matter too.

So as frustrated as I am that we pissed away the division, Jones has earned an honest opportunity to fix it even in spite of the mistakes. He's showed a willingness to change -- he went and got Bob Shoop when he realized the defense needed work. Now Shoop hasn't worked out exactly as we hoped he would -- but he didn't suddenly get stupid and forget how to coach. The defensive performance, even with the injuries, isn't going to cut it long term. But Shoop has ALSO earned an honest opportunity to fix it.

I'm not saying we can't be critical. I'm not saying Butch can do no wrong -- he's done plenty wrong and I have my serious doubts that he is the long term answer. But he's rescued our program from the gutter and has us in position for our biggest bowl appearance in almost two decades, and I think he deserves just a little bit of slack. If we keep getting games like South Carolina, we'll cut him loose. It will come when he's earned it. But I don't think he has yet.

It honestly reminds me of how I felt during halftime of the Florida game this year. I'd driven 6 hours just to see us down 21-3 at the end of two quarters. But I thought to myself that I needed to give the Vols a chance to turn it around. I'd seen them do it before, and it's not like there weren't flashes of greatness -- there was just a drop here, a missed tackle there. Maybe I oughta see what the coaches can do at halftime.

In that case, my patience was rewarded. I could have given up all hope or belief in the coaches/players, but all it would have done was made me miserable. I only get a few months of football in any year. I'm going to do my best to enjoy it and be appreciative for how far we've come, even while recognizing that this won't be good enough for where Tennessee wants to be long-term. But I'm going to give it a chance to get better.
 
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#2,724
#2,724
AAVFL said:
When is Dave Hart supposed to retire? Seems like we have been searching for an AD for an eternity. I would hope we have a new AD soon after conference championships are done.
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The Chancellor search took longer than expected. They're going to get her on board before hiring the AD. The BoTs had hoped to have it finalized by mid-December, but that's unlikely to happen. Hart will hang around a while-- part of his deal.
 
#2,725
#2,725
Bruce Wayne said:
We also have some awful local media including too many people that were handed media positions when they're under qualified and are glorified amateur podcasters...
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Unfortunately there appears to be far too many pseudo-journalists in E. TN whose primary goal is landing (or creating) clickbait.

And far too many fans quickly fall into the headline trap and overreact.
 
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