The House voted 229-191 to pass H.R. 1422; EPA related

#26
#26
mrorange211 said:
A little bit? This is the most damning thing to free market capitalism, imo. Had TR and John Muir not come around, those redwoods in Cali would be some beautiful home decor by this point.
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To be fair, if humans had cut down all of the existing giant and coastal redwoods, it would have only amounted to a fraction of a percent of what mother nature did to them millenia ago. If you are upset about the lack of redwoods, you need to blame glaciers.
 
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#29
#29
#VFL__ said:
So some states can lets say have less restrictions than others? Industrial Pollution is okay in Kentucky because they want to attract industry, but not okay in Tennessee because we have a more robust economy? Something along those lines?
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States should come to an agreement on basic terms and from there adjust accordingly. Like in the military they should be able to make things more difficult, not lax.
 
#30
#30
SamRebel35 said:
To be fair, if humans had cut down all of the existing giant and coastal redwoods, it would have only amounted to a fraction of a percent of what mother nature did to them millenia ago. If you are upset about the lack of redwoods, you need to blame glaciers.
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F'ing ice and snow and rain! Mother nature :bad:
 
#32
#32
Any organization that has the power to declare your backyard a "wetland" because rain puddles on it, and thus prevent you from building on it or improving your property in any way has officially attained too much power.

The closest non-government equivalent I can think of is the RIAA.
 
#34
#34
SamRebel35 said:
To be fair, if humans had cut down all of the existing giant and coastal redwoods, it would have only amounted to a fraction of a percent of what mother nature did to them millenia ago. If you are upset about the lack of redwoods, you need to blame glaciers.
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And to be fair, had John Muir and TR not come around there would be no redwoods left period. I don't understand how we conflict here.
 
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#35
#35
mrorange211 said:
And to be fair, had John Muir and TR not come around there would be no redwoods left period. I don't understand how we conflict here.
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the EPA and the National Park Service are two completely different things.
 
#36
#36
Agreed. I never said they were. I was responding to a poster that said the biggest weakness in free market capitalism was how it destroys the environment, which would have occurred here without TR.
 
#37
#37
mrorange211 said:
Agreed. I never said they were. I was responding to a poster that said the biggest weakness in free market capitalism was how it destroys the environment, which would have occurred here without TR.
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At one time this was true but not within the last 30-40 years. After the Cuyahoga fire no business wanted to be associated with pollution.
 
#38
#38
Mtntrout said:
How do we keep pollution within the state that makes it?
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This is my argument to those against Keystone. Except my argument is more global. What difference does it make where a disaster occurs, it affects us all.
 
#39
#39
mrorange211 said:
And to be fair, had John Muir and TR not come around there would be no redwoods left period. I don't understand how we conflict here.
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Yeah, you said that already. I was just pointing out that humans can do damage to the environment, but mother nature can completely maul and transform multiple environments simultaneously. We should do our best to minimize our footprint, but ultimately it is like peeing in the ocean. Nature gon nature.
 
#40
#40
Years ago I was a chemist with an environmental consulting firm. Some of you guys would be shocked by the crap in the ground and some of the locations of it.
 
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#41
#41
SamRebel35 said:
Yeah, you said that already. I was just pointing out that humans can do damage to the environment, but mother nature can completely maul and transform multiple environments simultaneously. We should do our best to minimize our footprint, but ultimately it is like peeing in the ocean. Nature gon nature.
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Yep - all sorts of wildlife destroys the habitat of other wildlife. Evolution depends on it. It seems funny to me at times that man tries to stop nature from being nature to preserve nature.
 
#42
#42
Carl Pickens said:
Years ago I was a chemist with an environmental consulting firm. Some of you guys would be shocked by the crap in the ground and some of the locations of it.
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I worked at ORNL for a while and regularly drove around the grounds at K-25.

There is no telling what all is out in those woods.
 
#43
#43
volinbham said:
I worked at ORNL for a while and regularly drove around the grounds at K-25.

There is no telling what all is out in those woods.
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So, you're saying that the government pollutes? I thought pollution was the exclusive result of capitalism.

Liberal heads are going to 'splode.
 
#46
#46
mrorange211 said:
Please tell. I'm curious
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I've seen sites where the ground was saturated with pesticides, herbicides, PCBs, cyanide, heavy metals.....you name it. back before the EPA companies would bury anything and everything in the ground and it didn't matter to them if it got into the ground water or ran off into streams and rivers.
 
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#47
#47
Carl Pickens said:
I've seen sites where the ground was saturated with pesticides, herbicides, PCBs, cyanide, heavy metals.....you name it. back before the EPA companies would bury anything and everything in the ground and it didn't matter to them if it got into the ground water or ran off into streams and rivers.
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I hear ya and have witnessed the same. Still the EPA on the Federal level has outlived its usefulness. State agencies can fill the void.
 
#48
#48
hog88 said:
Disputes between states can be settled in court.

Or are you under the impression the Fed EPA could prevent pollution migration?
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That would be after the pollution has already caused harm in some way...

I am not under that impression. I gave no reason for you to believe I am under that impression. It does seem to give a common denominator as to what is acceptable that keeps states down river or downwind from getting crapped on. No need to be a jackass.
 
#49
#49
Mtntrout said:
That would be after the pollution has already caused harm in some way...

I am not under that impression. I gave no reason for you to believe I am under that impression. It does seem to give a common denominator as to what is acceptable that keeps states down river or downwind from getting crapped on. No need to be a jackass.
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Like the pigeon river?
 
#50
#50
volinbham said:
I worked at ORNL for a while and regularly drove around the grounds at K-25.

There is no telling what all is out in those woods.
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There is a place on Eglin AFB that is named "Agent Orange Pond."

It didn't get the name by mistake. And you don't eat the fish that come out of it.
 
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