Pruitt doing as well or better than Butch in recruiting already.

#51
#51
Hacksaw said:
The '13 and '18 classes were both in the 20-25 range, with so many varying circumstances that it's impossible to say that one is clearly better than the other. At best, you can make the argument that they're comparable. And whether people want to admit it now, or not, Butch was in a much more difficult situation. His 20-25 class was a lot more impressive than Pruitt's, IMO. The writer of this 2016 SI article would probably agree:Re-ranking-2013 College Football Recruiting Classes.

Keep in mind that the class you're giving Pruitt so much credit for was made-up mostly of Butch's recruits. Whatever you want to say about Butch, he proved that he could recruit Top 10 classes. Pruitt hasn't proven anything yet and that's just the plain truth.
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So logically that would mean 2013 was mostly Dooley's class. That would make sense because Butch didn't seem to get the most out of his that normally consisted of 25-30 players.
 
#52
#52
jasonvol18 said:
This is a messageboard not an essay for a final exam. When I'm getting graded or paid for it I'll put more emphasis on paragraphs. I'm not so sure your post would pass many writing classes either if you want everything in proper structure. You reading or not reading what I post, isn't gonna cause me to seek out depression counseling though. Just make sure next time you critique and seek out proper sentence structure and use of paragraphs correctly be sure yours is also correct.And I post and text similar to your post but if you want things in getting graded form, you should also do the same. Hypocrisy, Bro!
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Nobody is saying you have to write in essay form. He's just saying even a ****ing dimwit should understand spacing. You're demonstrating he's wrong.
 
#53
#53
Special Ed said:
"Pruitt doing as well or better than Butch in recruiting already."

My 10th-grade English teacher at Daniel Boone High, Miss Amy Hamilton, would have cracked her 12-inch ruler across your knuckles and made you correct your lead-in to read: "Pruitt is doing as well as Butch in recruiting, or better."

Class dismissed.
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I suggest you never listen to our new head coach when he speaks. You'll tear your hair out.
 
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#54
#54
musolfmj said:
Some solid stats to offset the naysayers.
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Naysayers won't quit saying nay regardless. Some are just idiots and others suffer from battered Vol syndrome, the latter I cut some slack for.

Pruitt may end up a dud, but there are some signs he's bringing more to the program than the last two. If so, there is reason to be optomistic. OP shines some light on some of those reasons. GBO
 
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#56
#56
First thing is seeing some height on the DL recruits, 6’2 and shorter won’t cut it in this league and it looks like CPJ knows that as he went after taller guys almost immediately
 
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#57
#57
TennesseeTarheel said:
I suggest you never listen to our new head coach when he speaks. You'll tear your hair out.
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If we were hiring a new English Prof., you may have a point; however, we hired a FOOTBALL coach-a real football coach, you don't have to listen to his pressers, just watch the games, and the score board. We just got out from under a con-artist, you know the life coaching, brick laying guy that took a lot of Tennessee's money, and ran our program into the ground, but, he did have a lot of clever little aphorisms, let's give a real coach a chance! :whistling:
 
#58
#58
jasonvol18 said:
That's not true about this class being mostly Butch's recruits.JP got Banks,Carvin,Shrout,Harris,Anderson,
Allen,J.Johnson,Mincey,Gooden,Flowers,Tillman,Norwood,Davis,Garland and Peterson. I'll even count Taylor for Pruitt cause he recommitted to JP. Out of the 20 we signed plus Norwood and Davis JP had 16 guys committ to him. JP got 16 of our 22 to committ once he became HC That's 73% for JP and 27% for Butch.. Pruitt cut the majority of Butch's commits.
Anonutti,Brooks,Lane,Warren,Lawless and Emerson are the only ones who committed to Butch. There was nothing about Butch's situation coming in that was more difficult than what JP came into except there is more talent top to bottom on the roster. Butch didn't walk into one of the worst ran coaching search's in the history of HC hiring, JP is walking into an even worse previous season than Butch did, Butch didn't have to worry about the early signing period, Pruitt did. Butch had one of the best Oline's in the country returning(Richardson,Jackson,J.Stone,Z.Fulton,J.James and had Kerbyson,Crowder,Bullard backing them up. Butch had 2 veteran RB's returning in Lane and Neal,his returning receivers were garbage outside of Pig, so Pruitt has that better,Pruitt has better secondary guys returning than Butch had,Butch had the more proven DLine and LB's( Couch,Mccullers,J.Smith,M.Walls,
J.Williams,C. Miller,AJ Johnson,C.Maggitt,L.Lewis,C.Vereen for depth and Q.Sapp. Butch had a future NFL kicker in Palardy returning. Butch had 13 starters returning(5 offense and 8 on Defense. The schedules are close but I'll give Butch the harder schedule because of Oregon. Butch had also been a HC for many years before coming to TN, Pruitt hasn't. When you put all of it together Pruitt is walking into the more difficult situation. The early signing period and and an offensive line with Numerous future NFL players returning and Butch had the better and more experienced front 7 returning. JP is following a worse year than Butch was.. Barely though. Butch had 2 top 10 classes and both years he had to sign 30 and 32 to get that. That's not allowed anymore. The 3 years he couldn't sign 30+ his classes ranked 14,17 and 25. Even the #14 and #17 years he signed 27 then 28. Hell who could get a top 10 class when you sign 30 and 32 players. Butch got 12 of the 25 players in that class to committ to him, the other 13 committed to Dooley. Of Butch's 12 he got 2 *4 and 10 *3. Pruitt got 16 of the 22 to committ to him. 9 *4 and 7*3. Give that one to JP also. You're right JP hasn't proven anything yet as a HC but Butch did prove he couldn't develop players, couldn't recruit consistently at an elite level, didn't make good game decision's or adjustments, in 5 seasons he couldn't bring in anything close to the staff JP did in less than 2 months.I would trust Pruitt's player evaluations over Butch's any day. Butch recruited *2-*3 stars his whole career till he got to TN, Pruitt has recruited *4 and *5 guys since he became a college coach and the ability to find the talented, less recruited players. JP has a very reputation as an elite recruiter and player developer, is well respected and well known no matter what HS he walks in to to recruit. Butch has neither of those reputations.I have brought proof and facts to back up my side of this. Not sure how you can say Butch's was more impressive if you are basing it off it being reevaluated 5 years later. You couldn't make that case till this was was reevaluated in 2023. Only comparison is basing each class off where they finished and by who had the most highly ranked players. And that would be Pruitt's and he had 20 sign vs Butch's 25. Pruitt has the higher per player average to go along with it. Only someone hating on Pruitt and still defending Butch could argue for your side of this. I've shown proof and facts for my case and not the hating on Pruitt just to do it argument.
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I bet you talk really fast.
 
#60
#60
jasonvol18 said:
I respectfully disagree. Butch wasn't following the worst year in Vol Football history, didn't have the Currie debacle and the daily horrible publicity. Butch didn't have to be in scramble mode day 1 either because of the early signing period. JP does inherit a better overall roster than Butch but still lacks depth and the unknowns from all the guys recovering from injuries.
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Actually, I think the one and only way Pruitt inherited a better team is better overall team speed. And while Butch might have recruited slightly higher rated players, he negated it through injuries from unstable S&C and poor retention. I know everyone has transfers, but GOOD GRIEF!

Otherwise, I agree. Under the circumstances, I feel Pruitt has the harder path. And that is changing the program culture.
 
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#63
#63
Matt2496 said:
I do agree with the OP's sentiment, however, bear in mind that Butch inherited a significantly worse mess than Pruitt.
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You realize 2017 was the single worst year in the history of Tennessee football, right?

Edit: shoulda read all pages first. Several others already jumped on that statement.
 
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#64
#64
What do people not understand, it blows my damn mind. I've said this countless times about butchy and his recruiting abilities, he could get them but couldn't Keep them here. For crying out loud the man 34% of his recruits transfer over his tenor. 34%!!! I will not buy another thread talking about this or that about Pruitt vs coach #24s recruiting ability. There is alot more than just getting them here. It's getting them here, keeping them here, and developing.
 
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#65
#65
Jones was selling us hype since he arrived at Tennessee. He knew how to push fans buttons with how well we were recruiting. How strong we were getting in the off season and the wonderful depth we were building.
We finally got a look behind the curtain of what he was selling and it was nothing but hot air so here we are two losses in a row to Vandy. 0 and 8 in the SEC. We have no where to go but up so let's give the new guy a chance it may take him a while.
 
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#67
#67
Hacksaw said:
I like the optimism, but everything you said could be and was said about Butch (and then some). And I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss Butch's two Top Ten classes until Pruitt has proven he can sign one on his own.

When Butch came to UT, he had coached some great players (i.e., Antonio Brown and Eric Fisher). He had respected coaches and college football analysts singing his praises. And unlike Pruitt, he actually had a record as a head coach -- and not a bad one at that.
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"""He had respected coaches and college football analysts singing his praises""". He also had a lot of experts that weren't so high on him, add-he had a lot of UT Football fans (me included) that said from day one, "WTF-this guy is a joke".
Let's be real, there are still a lot of jones fan-boys singing his praises! It did not make him a good coach, not even a fair coach, in fact, I'm not sure he is actually a coach at all.
The best way to compare the two HCs, IMHO, will be the W and Ls, if we win five games next year-we will have increased our wins over jones 5th year by 25%!!
facts are facts:hi:
 
#68
#68
jasonvol18 said:
That's not true about this class being mostly Butch's recruits.JP got Banks,Carvin,Shrout,Harris,Anderson,
Allen,J.Johnson,Mincey,Gooden,Flowers,Tillman,Norwood,Davis,Garland and Peterson. I'll even count Taylor for Pruitt cause he recommitted to JP. Out of the 20 we signed plus Norwood and Davis JP had 16 guys committ to him. JP got 16 of our 22 to committ once he became HC That's 73% for JP and 27% for Butch.. Pruitt cut the majority of Butch's commits.
Anonutti,Brooks,Lane,Warren,Lawless and Emerson are the only ones who committed to Butch. There was nothing about Butch's situation coming in that was more difficult than what JP came into except there is more talent top to bottom on the roster. Butch didn't walk into one of the worst ran coaching search's in the history of HC hiring, JP is walking into an even worse previous season than Butch did, Butch didn't have to worry about the early signing period, Pruitt did. Butch had one of the best Oline's in the country returning(Richardson,Jackson,J.Stone,Z.Fulton,J.James and had Kerbyson,Crowder,Bullard backing them up. Butch had 2 veteran RB's returning in Lane and Neal,his returning receivers were garbage outside of Pig, so Pruitt has that better,Pruitt has better secondary guys returning than Butch had,Butch had the more proven DLine and LB's( Couch,Mccullers,J.Smith,M.Walls,
J.Williams,C. Miller,AJ Johnson,C.Maggitt,L.Lewis,C.Vereen for depth and Q.Sapp. Butch had a future NFL kicker in Palardy returning. Butch had 13 starters returning(5 offense and 8 on Defense. The schedules are close but I'll give Butch the harder schedule because of Oregon. Butch had also been a HC for many years before coming to TN, Pruitt hasn't. When you put all of it together Pruitt is walking into the more difficult situation. The early signing period and and an offensive line with Numerous future NFL players returning and Butch had the better and more experienced front 7 returning. JP is following a worse year than Butch was.. Barely though. Butch had 2 top 10 classes and both years he had to sign 30 and 32 to get that. That's not allowed anymore. The 3 years he couldn't sign 30+ his classes ranked 14,17 and 25. Even the #14 and #17 years he signed 27 then 28. Hell who could get a top 10 class when you sign 30 and 32 players. Butch got 12 of the 25 players in that class to committ to him, the other 13 committed to Dooley. Of Butch's 12 he got 2 *4 and 10 *3. Pruitt got 16 of the 22 to committ to him. 9 *4 and 7*3. Give that one to JP also. You're right JP hasn't proven anything yet as a HC but Butch did prove he couldn't develop players, couldn't recruit consistently at an elite level, didn't make good game decision's or adjustments, in 5 seasons he couldn't bring in anything close to the staff JP did in less than 2 months.I would trust Pruitt's player evaluations over Butch's any day. Butch recruited *2-*3 stars his whole career till he got to TN, Pruitt has recruited *4 and *5 guys since he became a college coach and the ability to find the talented, less recruited players. JP has a very reputation as an elite recruiter and player developer, is well respected and well known no matter what HS he walks in to to recruit. Butch has neither of those reputations.I have brought proof and facts to back up my side of this. Not sure how you can say Butch's was more impressive if you are basing it off it being reevaluated 5 years later. You couldn't make that case till this was was reevaluated in 2023. Only comparison is basing each class off where they finished and by who had the most highly ranked players. And that would be Pruitt's and he had 20 sign vs Butch's 25. Pruitt has the higher per player average to go along with it. Only someone hating on Pruitt and still defending Butch could argue for your side of this. I've shown proof and facts for my case and not the hating on Pruitt just to do it argument.
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He also has a reputation of coming in 2nd on big time guys, just like this year. The Cali guys were a stretch, but how did UT miss on Walker? Had his lead recruiter from Bama and UGA on staff, offering a much friendly depth chart and came in 2nd, like he does way too often to be considered an elite recruiter.
 
#69
#69
Butch could recruit well he just couldn't put a staff together to coach up the talent, this time last year Butch had a top 3 class going, recruiting wasn't the problem coaching was.
 
#70
#70
Secfan18 said:
He also has a reputation of coming in 2nd on big time guys, just like this year. The Cali guys were a stretch, but how did UT miss on Walker? Had his lead recruiter from Bama and UGA on staff, offering a much friendly depth chart and came in 2nd, like he does way too often to be considered an elite recruiter.
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4 and 8 and looking at 2 more 5 and 7 season's or 6 and 6 seasons and at the Dawgs he has a chance to win a NC that is what did it.:eek:hmy:I hate the Dawgs but Kirby has them rolling and they will be elite for several years to come, we just going to step up, i give JP a pass this year, he did have a very good early signing period other than Walker i dont think he really missed on anyone the kids out West just came here to enjoy a weekend.
 
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#71
#71
I40flyer said:
"""He had respected coaches and college football analysts singing his praises""". He also had a lot of experts that weren't so high on him, add-he had a lot of UT Football fans (me included) that said from day one, "WTF-this guy is a joke".
Let's be real, there are still a lot of jones fan-boys singing his praises! It did not make him a good coach, not even a fair coach, in fact, I'm not sure he is actually a coach at all.
The best way to compare the two HCs, IMHO, will be the W and Ls, if we win five games next year-we will have increased our wins over jones 5th year by 25%!!
facts are facts:hi:
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Here’s a FACT. You can’t quote a poster praising Butch as a COACH post UMass game...much less “still”. You’re obsessed with this “Butch fanboy” crutch. Another FACT: Brent Schaeffer SUCKED. :)
 
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#72
#72
Secfan18 said:
He also has a reputation of coming in 2nd on big time guys, just like this year. The Cali guys were a stretch, but how did UT miss on Walker? Had his lead recruiter from Bama and UGA on staff, offering a much friendly depth chart and came in 2nd, like he does way too often to be considered an elite recruiter.
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You only got THIS year. Name some valid examples prior. :boredom:
 
#73
#73
butchna said:
Here’s a FACT. You can’t quote a poster praising Butch as a COACH post UMass game...much less “still”. You’re obsessed with this “Butch fanboy” crutch. Another FACT: Brent Schaeffer SUCKED. :)
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Wow! What a ridiculous post! Those that actually care about UT football, saw that butch sucked as a coach for a LONG time before the Umass game!!! Those that waited until UMass to have their eyes opened, are sorry fans-they just couldn't let go of their hero! It pains these idiots to admit they were wrong-it pains these idiots to admit others were correct, year after year-they just aren't man enough. What else would you expect from a little fan boy?
 
#74
#74
I40flyer said:
Wow! What a ridiculous post! Those that actually care about UT football, saw that butch sucked as a coach for a LONG time before the Umass game!!! Those that waited until UMass to have their eyes opened, are sorry fans-they just couldn't let go of their hero! It pains these idiots to admit they were wrong-it pains these idiots to admit others were correct, year after year-they just aren't man enough. What else would you expect from a little fan boy?
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Your wildly misguided opinion. :) I back my coach and am currently doing that. I MOVED ON. You still bisch about coaching moves that FULMER made! You have an agenda that blinds you from faithfully supporting the program. I’m such a better fan than you because you’re a sad pathetic FANBOY of your sour bitter putrid hate. :yu:
 
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#75
#75
butchna said:
Your wildly misguided opinion. :) I back my coach and am currently doing that. I MOVED ON. You still bisch about coaching moves that FULMER made! You have an agenda that blinds you from faithfully supporting the program. I’m such a better fan than you because you’re a sad pathetic FANBOY of your sour bitter putrid hate. :yu:
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Your mother must be helping you write this crap! I have never *****ed about a single coaching move made by Coach Fulmer, you need to put down that crack pipe! Perhaps, if you admitted you're are wrong, not just about you love for butch, but for pulling crap out of thin air (as is the custom for a Hilary supporter) when you have nothing else to support your idiocy, you may start to get better...good luck.
 
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