Pruitt doing as well or better than Butch in recruiting already.

[Top Gun]

People forget how bad 2013 was. Or maybe they don't remember. The national perception then was that we were a spoiled and ungrateful fan base that ran-off a legend and then got jilted by his replacement after one season. They laughed at us and accused us of being a bunch of rioting rednecks, because one jackass burned a mattress. People said we would be lucky to get anyone to come and coach our team. And we proved them wrong by hiring Dooley. It was baaad.

Hacksaw you seem to want to hang onto the image of Butch as an improvement over Dooley, instead of realizing that he improved us but had reached his limit of improvement. He couldn't take us any closer to where we all want to be. That is back in the hunt for a SEC championship and beyond. Pruitt is our guy now, get on board with it.

 

[Special Ed]

Ed, your 10th grade English teacher sounds special.

She's dead now, but she was specialer than me in her way.
She set an example that I tried to follow, but I'm either too special or not special enough.
I haven't figured that one out yet.

 

[Hacksaw]

Hacksaw you seem to want to hang onto the image of Butch as an improvement over Dooley, instead of realizing that he improved us but had reached his limit of improvement. He couldn't take us any closer to where we all want to be. That is back in the hunt for a SEC championship and beyond. Pruitt is our guy now, get on board with it.

Butch led us to an 8-loss season. I supported the decision to fire him. This discussion is about Pruitt.

A statement was made that is just not true. It's the same kind of Pollyanna support that always comes with a new coach and I understand that. The exact same kinds of things were said about Kiffin, Dooley and Butch when they were new to the job.

I'll be optimistic when we see some actual results. Yesterday wasn't it for me.

 

[GBO25]

I do agree with the OP's sentiment, however, bear in mind that Butch inherited a significantly worse mess than Pruitt.

Pruitt inherited a worse mess. Remember, 2017 is the worst team in Tennessee history. 0-8 SEC. Nuff said..

 

[djohnnyg]

Bottom line: 1) Butch Jones is/was a joke. 2) Too many TN fans supported him waaaayyy too long. 3) Pruitt is completely an unknown quantity. 4) This recruiting class does not define his success, BUT it would have been nice to have had a good omen, and closed the class better than he did.

Heres the thing though. The reason butch was supported was because mid-late 2016 we were ranked 9th in the country and that season had already beat the Florida curse and Butch was coming off his 2nd year in a row beating big bad Georgia. We forget this. Almost beat a really good A n M team on the road ...finally breaking one of the nations longest active win streaks. It woulda made more sense to build a statue for him than fire him. Then...we wrapped up the season taking our injury riddled team and winning our bowl game in impressive fashion. It was only until the disaster of 2017 season that serious doubts about Butch emerged. And we promptly fired him in season. We forget how good we actually were for awhile under butch. Made no sense to fire him...until we actually did.

 

[orange parmejohn]

Pruitt isn't competing against Butch Jones. He is competing against Kirby Smart and Nick Saban. He can't build Rome in a day, but fair or not, those are the men that stand between success and failure.

 

[kmkemp11]

Pruitt inherited a worse mess. Remember, 2017 is the worst team in Tennessee history. 0-8 SEC. Nuff said..

Y'all have a short memory. Butch inherited a roster in shambles. Our current roster is filled with players that other SEC teams wanted.

"as good as Butch" isn't quite the bar we need to set here. I do think it's a good sign that even while flopping on NSD, our class wasn't a disaster.

 

[jasonvol18]

The '13 and '18 classes were both in the 20-25 range, with so many varying circumstances that it's impossible to say that one is clearly better than the other. At best, you can make the argument that they're comparable. And whether people want to admit it now, or not, Butch was in a much more difficult situation. His 20-25 class was a lot more impressive than Pruitt's, IMO. The writer of this 2016 SI article would probably agree:Re-ranking-2013 College Football Recruiting Classes.

Keep in mind that the class you're giving Pruitt so much credit for was made-up mostly of Butch's recruits. Whatever you want to say about Butch, he proved that he could recruit Top 10 classes. Pruitt hasn't proven anything yet and that's just the plain truth.

That's not true about this class being mostly Butch's recruits.JP got Banks,Carvin,Shrout,Harris,Anderson,
Allen,J.Johnson,Mincey,Gooden,Flowers,Tillman,Norwood,Davis,Garland and Peterson. I'll even count Taylor for Pruitt cause he recommitted to JP. Out of the 20 we signed plus Norwood and Davis JP had 16 guys committ to him. JP got 16 of our 22 to committ once he became HC That's 73% for JP and 27% for Butch.. Pruitt cut the majority of Butch's commits.
Anonutti,Brooks,Lane,Warren,Lawless and Emerson are the only ones who committed to Butch. There was nothing about Butch's situation coming in that was more difficult than what JP came into except there is more talent top to bottom on the roster. Butch didn't walk into one of the worst ran coaching search's in the history of HC hiring, JP is walking into an even worse previous season than Butch did, Butch didn't have to worry about the early signing period, Pruitt did. Butch had one of the best Oline's in the country returning(Richardson,Jackson,J.Stone,Z.Fulton,J.James and had Kerbyson,Crowder,Bullard backing them up. Butch had 2 veteran RB's returning in Lane and Neal,his returning receivers were garbage outside of Pig, so Pruitt has that better,Pruitt has better secondary guys returning than Butch had,Butch had the more proven DLine and LB's( Couch,Mccullers,J.Smith,M.Walls,
J.Williams,C. Miller,AJ Johnson,C.Maggitt,L.Lewis,C.Vereen for depth and Q.Sapp. Butch had a future NFL kicker in Palardy returning. Butch had 13 starters returning(5 offense and 8 on Defense. The schedules are close but I'll give Butch the harder schedule because of Oregon. Butch had also been a HC for many years before coming to TN, Pruitt hasn't. When you put all of it together Pruitt is walking into the more difficult situation. The early signing period and and an offensive line with Numerous future NFL players returning and Butch had the better and more experienced front 7 returning. JP is following a worse year than Butch was.. Barely though. Butch had 2 top 10 classes and both years he had to sign 30 and 32 to get that. That's not allowed anymore. The 3 years he couldn't sign 30+ his classes ranked 14,17 and 25. Even the #14 and #17 years he signed 27 then 28. Hell who could get a top 10 class when you sign 30 and 32 players. Butch got 12 of the 25 players in that class to committ to him, the other 13 committed to Dooley. Of Butch's 12 he got 2 *4 and 10 *3. Pruitt got 16 of the 22 to committ to him. 9 *4 and 7*3. Give that one to JP also. You're right JP hasn't proven anything yet as a HC but Butch did prove he couldn't develop players, couldn't recruit consistently at an elite level, didn't make good game decision's or adjustments, in 5 seasons he couldn't bring in anything close to the staff JP did in less than 2 months.I would trust Pruitt's player evaluations over Butch's any day. Butch recruited *2-*3 stars his whole career till he got to TN, Pruitt has recruited *4 and *5 guys since he became a college coach and the ability to find the talented, less recruited players. JP has a very reputation as an elite recruiter and player developer, is well respected and well known no matter what HS he walks in to to recruit. Butch has neither of those reputations.I have brought proof and facts to back up my side of this. Not sure how you can say Butch's was more impressive if you are basing it off it being reevaluated 5 years later. You couldn't make that case till this was was reevaluated in 2023. Only comparison is basing each class off where they finished and by who had the most highly ranked players. And that would be Pruitt's and he had 20 sign vs Butch's 25. Pruitt has the higher per player average to go along with it. Only someone hating on Pruitt and still defending Butch could argue for your side of this. I've shown proof and facts for my case and not the hating on Pruitt just to do it argument.

 

[UT_Dutchman]

"Pruitt doing as well or better than Butch in recruiting already."

My 10th-grade English teacher at Daniel Boone High, Miss Amy Hamilton, would have cracked her 12-inch ruler across your knuckles and made you correct your lead-in to read: "Pruitt is doing as well as Butch in recruiting, or better."

Class dismissed.

You went to DB, that explains a lot.

 

[jasonvol18]

Y'all have a short memory. Butch inherited a roster in shambles. Our current roster is filled with players that other SEC teams wanted.

"as good as Butch" isn't quite the bar we need to set here. I do think it's a good sign that even while flopping on NSD, our class wasn't a disaster.

Certain position groups were in shambles like the secondary, the Receivers, very few playmakers on offense and no proven QB. But Butch inherited one of the best offensive lines in college football and a much better and proven front 7. This current roster has the better receiver's and better secondary players. There's more highly rated players on our current roster than what Butch inherited. But it evens out when you compare the OLine,dline and LB's. Butch had the better,more proven and more depth than we currently have. Both QB situations are pretty much even. Our TN talent is better but Butch had the more proven RB combo in Neal and Lane. But as a group and for depth our current It's are the more talented group. Butch walked into issues at WR,DB and QB but OL,DL and LB Butch had a huge advantage over our current roster. A lot of those players he only had for a year but neither line of scrimmage was an issue when he took over. And we all know the SEC is a line of scrimmage league and always has been.

 

[bristolbigorangef]

Anyone can look this up--- Pruitt wasn't the failure that so many want to believe, the early signing period has thrown people off..(and Georgia success)

Rivals we are ranked #20 with 9 four stars. (if you care about stars)

Butch Jones: 2017: ranked 15, 9 four stars

Butch Jones 2016 #15 1 five star (Kongbo) 10 four stars

Ranked number 22 his first year with 5 four stars.


247: we are ranked number 20 with 8 four stars.

Butch Jones (2017) Ranked number 17 with four four stars and 1 five star (Trey)
Butch Jones (2016) ranked #14 10 four stars
Butch Jones first year (2013) ranked #25, four four star..

So, not a failure and pretty good when you compare to Butch which everyone says was a great recruiter) We did have top 5 classes in 2014 and 2015, but Pruitt has just started (only been here two months) and already doing better or as well as Butch his first year and the last two years

Also, I'm assuming Jeremy Pruitt is a much better coach --some Bama kids say he was the beset coach they ever had. So, we have a guy who might even coach them up.

Why mention BJ.....is that a measuring stick....

 

[RavinDave]

Never was good at English, aight?

I thought you done pretty good with that there post aight?

 

[RavinDave]

She's dead now, but she was specialer than me in her way.
She set an example that I tried to follow, but I'm either too special or not special enough.
I haven't figured that one out yet.

You are way special IMHO. You had me thinking about my 7th grade teacher at Mooreland Heights, Miss Vesser, who could swing a mean ruler her own self. Was that 1967 or 68? ... and Mrs. Rogers, our no-nonsense, excellent math teacher at Young High (also the ex-mayor's wife, and the "class" of the faculty) who took me aside the start of my Sr year and suggested I seek early admission to UT... and the rest, as they say, is History.

 

[JCP201]

Why mention BJ.....is that a measuring stick....

I was talking recruiting classes-- most everyone has said that Butch Jones was a great recruiter, while many, including the press were whining about this year's class. When you compare CJP's class, his was better first year..

Also, when you get away from recruiting there is this..
[twitter]961679955590606849[/twitter]

My point is I think we have a lot to be optimistic about right now.

 

[KB5252]

I respectfully disagree. Butch wasn't following the worst year in Vol Football history, didn't have the Currie debacle and the daily horrible publicity. Butch didn't have to be in scramble mode day 1 either because of the early signing period. JP does inherit a better overall roster than Butch but still lacks depth and the unknowns from all the guys recovering from injuries.

The roster that Pruitt has to start with is much better. The program prestige is much lower though

 

[jasonvol18]

The roster that Pruitt has to start with is much better. The program prestige is much lower though

Agree 100%. Atleast at most positions. Both lines were much better Butch's first year. But everywhere else the roster is better now. Upside being prestige and program perception can be fixed very quickly.

 

[VolArmy74]

Are people really serious about the program supposedly being in worse shape now than when Butch took over???

Tennessee had 3 consecutive losing seasons under Dooley. He went 1-7 in the SEC his final year. It's the worst 3 year stretch in school history both in the SEC and overall. He angered almost every high school coach in-state. He signed an entire recruiting class with 0 offensive linemen. The losing culture was much worse, the talent on the roster was much worse, the program was much worse overall. I'm no Butch fan and didn't want him hired, but he walked into the worst situation in school history and if nothing else, left the roster in better shape and the last 3 year record is 22-16, Dooley was 16-21.

 

[Hacksaw]

Are people really serious about the program supposedly being in worse shape now than when Butch took over???

Tennessee had 3 consecutive losing seasons under Dooley. He went 1-7 in the SEC his final year. It's the worst 3 year stretch in school history both in the SEC and overall. He angered almost every high school coach in-state. He signed an entire recruiting class with 0 offensive linemen. The losing culture was much worse, the talent on the roster was much worse, the program was much worse overall. I'm no Butch fan and didn't want him hired, but he walked into the worst situation in school history and if nothing else, left the roster in better shape and the last 3 year record is 22-16, Dooley was 16-21.

It's so obvious, but some people just want to deny reality. I don't know why that is. They must get something out of it.

 

[Hacksaw]

That's not true about this class being mostly Butch's recruits.JP got Banks,Carvin,Shrout,Harris,Anderson,
Allen,J.Johnson,Mincey,Gooden,Flowers,Tillman,Norwood,Davis,Garland and Peterson. I'll even count Taylor for Pruitt cause he recommitted to JP. Out of the 20 we signed plus Norwood and Davis JP had 16 guys committ to him. JP got 16 of our 22 to committ once he became HC That's 73% for JP and 27% for Butch.. Pruitt cut the majority of Butch's commits.
Anonutti,Brooks,Lane,Warren,Lawless and Emerson are the only ones who committed to Butch. There was nothing about Butch's situation coming in that was more difficult than what JP came into except there is more talent top to bottom on the roster. Butch didn't walk into one of the worst ran coaching search's in the history of HC hiring, JP is walking into an even worse previous season than Butch did, Butch didn't have to worry about the early signing period, Pruitt did. Butch had one of the best Oline's in the country returning(Richardson,Jackson,J.Stone,Z.Fulton,J.James and had Kerbyson,Crowder,Bullard backing them up. Butch had 2 veteran RB's returning in Lane and Neal,his returning receivers were garbage outside of Pig, so Pruitt has that better,Pruitt has better secondary guys returning than Butch had,Butch had the more proven DLine and LB's( Couch,Mccullers,J.Smith,M.Walls,
J.Williams,C. Miller,AJ Johnson,C.Maggitt,L.Lewis,C.Vereen for depth and Q.Sapp. Butch had a future NFL kicker in Palardy returning. Butch had 13 starters returning(5 offense and 8 on Defense. The schedules are close but I'll give Butch the harder schedule because of Oregon. Butch had also been a HC for many years before coming to TN, Pruitt hasn't. When you put all of it together Pruitt is walking into the more difficult situation. The early signing period and and an offensive line with Numerous future NFL players returning and Butch had the better and more experienced front 7 returning. JP is following a worse year than Butch was.. Barely though. Butch had 2 top 10 classes and both years he had to sign 30 and 32 to get that. That's not allowed anymore. The 3 years he couldn't sign 30+ his classes ranked 14,17 and 25. Even the #14 and #17 years he signed 27 then 28. Hell who could get a top 10 class when you sign 30 and 32 players. Butch got 12 of the 25 players in that class to committ to him, the other 13 committed to Dooley. Of Butch's 12 he got 2 *4 and 10 *3. Pruitt got 16 of the 22 to committ to him. 9 *4 and 7*3. Give that one to JP also. You're right JP hasn't proven anything yet as a HC but Butch did prove he couldn't develop players, couldn't recruit consistently at an elite level, didn't make good game decision's or adjustments, in 5 seasons he couldn't bring in anything close to the staff JP did in less than 2 months.I would trust Pruitt's player evaluations over Butch's any day. Butch recruited *2-*3 stars his whole career till he got to TN, Pruitt has recruited *4 and *5 guys since he became a college coach and the ability to find the talented, less recruited players. JP has a very reputation as an elite recruiter and player developer, is well respected and well known no matter what HS he walks in to to recruit. Butch has neither of those reputations.I have brought proof and facts to back up my side of this. Not sure how you can say Butch's was more impressive if you are basing it off it being reevaluated 5 years later. You couldn't make that case till this was was reevaluated in 2023. Only comparison is basing each class off where they finished and by who had the most highly ranked players. And that would be Pruitt's and he had 20 sign vs Butch's 25. Pruitt has the higher per player average to go along with it. Only someone hating on Pruitt and still defending Butch could argue for your side of this. I've shown proof and facts for my case and not the hating on Pruitt just to do it argument.

I didn't read, because dude...paragraphs. Do you swallow your food without chewing?

 

[jasonvol18]

Are people really serious about the program supposedly being in worse shape now than when Butch took over???

Tennessee had 3 consecutive losing seasons under Dooley. He went 1-7 in the SEC his final year. It's the worst 3 year stretch in school history both in the SEC and overall. He angered almost every high school coach in-state. He signed an entire recruiting class with 0 offensive linemen. The losing culture was much worse, the talent on the roster was much worse, the program was much worse overall. I'm no Butch fan and didn't want him hired, but he walked into the worst situation in school history and if nothing else, left the roster in better shape and the last 3 year record is 22-16, Dooley was 16-21.

I haven't seen anyone say that. The overall roster is better now compared to what Butch walked into except on both sides of the ball and LB. But as far as who had the hardest first class to recruit to and who's was better it was obviously Pruitt. Only 6 of our signee's committed to Butch, 16 for Pruitt. The majority of Butch's first were holdovers From Dooley committs. Butch didn't have the early signing period and have to be in scramble mode from day one. Public perception was both for both to walk into but the last month before Pruitt was hired was worse than anything that happened before Butch got hired. You are right the last 3 years Dooley had a worst record and had burned some recruiting bridges. And Butch recruited better than Dooley but he just couldn't keep them here. But Dooley also didn't have all the bad character accusations and favoritism stuff that Butch had. Player fights happen but not to the extent of last year and the attempt to cover it up. Then you have the bullying stuff from a beloved VFL and Employee and parents and former players accusations against Butch. Throw in Kamara talking about how bad it was under Butch and perception was pretty bad. Not to mention the public embarrassment of Schiano, Curry and the coaching search under him. Lastly after we started 5-0 in '16 we went 8-12 the next 20 and 2-12 in the SEC. Under Dooley our last 20 was 7-13 and also 2-12 in conference. When you really dig deeper it was pretty evenly bad. Butch's last year he undid all the good he had done.Just compare the last year for Butch and Dooley and take everything that happened into account till the hire date who would you say walked into the worse situation? The last 3 years yea Dooley's was much worse. But the last year including the recruiting wrinkle with early signing it was incredible what he was able to bring in and finish top 20.

 

[jasonvol18]

I didn't read, because dude...paragraphs. Do you swallow your food without chewing?

This is a messageboard not an essay for a final exam. When I'm getting graded or paid for it I'll put more emphasis on paragraphs. I'm not so sure your post would pass many writing classes either if you want everything in proper structure. You reading or not reading what I post, isn't gonna cause me to seek out depression counseling though. Just make sure next time you critique and seek out proper sentence structure and use of paragraphs correctly be sure yours is also correct.And I post and text similar to your post but if you want things in getting graded form, you should also do the same. Hypocrisy, Bro!

 

[Behr]

Jeremy gets it.

 

[Hacksaw]

This is a messageboard not an essay for a final exam. When I'm getting graded or paid for it I'll put more emphasis on paragraphs. I'm not so sure your post would pass many writing classes either if you want everything in proper structure. You reading or not reading what I post, isn't gonna cause me to seek out depression counseling though. Just make sure next time you critique and seek out proper sentence structure and use of paragraphs correctly be sure yours is also correct.And I post and text similar to your post but if you want things in getting graded form, you should also do the same. Hypocrisy, Bro!

Aw...someone needs a hug.

 

[TNnative]

"Pruitt doing as well or better than Butch in recruiting already."

My 10th-grade English teacher at Daniel Boone High, Miss Amy Hamilton, would have cracked her 12-inch ruler across your knuckles and made you correct your lead-in to read: "Pruitt is doing as well as Butch in recruiting, or better."

Class dismissed.

Did she stay a Miss?

And you comment about a 12 inch ruler reminds me of a joke about why Diana divorced Charles.

 

[FiremedicVOL127]

She's dead now, but she was specialer than me in her way.
She set an example that I tried to follow, but I'm either too special or not special enough.
I haven't figured that one out yet.

Hello fellow Blazer.... class of '96 here, refreshing to see others from my neck of the woods.