Game Thread: Tennessee (17-11, 10-6 SEC) 5 Seed vs Kentucky (12-19, 4-12 SEC) 12 Seed --- 3/7/24 approx 2:15 pm ET (SEC Network)

#303
#303
knoxvol52 said:
Apples to Oranges comparison.

The two should never be compared.
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It amazes me how people try to compare men's basketball with 1 elite 8 appearance in program history to the women's program with 8 national titles. The more time that passes the more convinced I am that some people are ok with just making the NCAA "most" years moving forward for women's basketball.
 
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#304
#304
Volfaninfl2 said:
I can totally understand her Mom feeling that way, and agree under normal circumstances, but we were able to pull out the win, and now, hopefully, Rickea will be super charged to play today, and the next, and the next.
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I saw the tweet as well and it’s posted here. Since the tweet came this morning, well after the game, I’m not certain that she was speaking directly about the KY game. However it’s likely. While I think Coach could “talk up” Rickea a bit more, yesterday was about as ideal as it could get. We already would have to play 3 games in 3 days to make the finals, including a tough AL team and an unstoppable SC. Rickea only having to log 17 minutes in game one is best case scenario for this team! I imagine if the game was getting out of hand, we would have seen Rickea back in earlier than she did.
 
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#305
#305
UTtoDC said:
I saw the tweet as well and it’s posted here. Since the tweet came this morning, well after the game, I’m not certain that she was speaking directly about the KY game. However it’s likely. While I think Coach could “talk up” Rickea a bit more, yesterday was about as ideal as it could get. We already would have to play and 3 games in 3 days to make the finals, inclsuong a tough AL team and and unstoppable SC. Rickea only having to log 17 minutes in game one is best case scenario for this team! I imagine if the game was getting out of hand, we would have seen Rickea back in.
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Actually, Rickea did come back in, and the refs kept calling bogus fouls on her. I’m glad she’s fresh for today, we’re going to need her!
 
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#306
#306
Volstylexx said:
It amazes me how people try to compare men's basketball with 1 elite 8 appearance in program history to the women's program with 8 national titles. The more time that passes the more convinced I am that some people are ok with just making the NCAA "most" years moving forward for women's basketball.
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It's free to spin it ever how they see fit.
Question though the years the men's team absolutely were horrible was the men's coach compared to Pat?
 
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#307
#307
More proof Moms should stay off social media. Everyone was frustrated but KJH handled it correctly. As long as we were fairly comfortably ahead we needed to save RJ in case it got close late or even went into OT.

Also, RJ immediately got in more foul trouble when she went back in. Interesting to see how she handles things today. Needs to be a big grown up girl
LVBGOTN said:
Anyone see the tweet by Kea’s mom this morning? Seems like she wanted Kellie to “trust” Kea yesterday while in foul trouble. I look at it as it allowed others to step up and Kea getting some rest for today’s game.
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#309
#309
Deebowbear said:
Don’t think you can compare Kellie to Barnes by any means he’s a very good coach, can recruit, beat rank teams beat teams wasn’t suppose to win , has won everywhere he’s been. Big difference between those two
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So Rick Barnes has gotten Tennessee to the Sweet 16 once since Kellie arrived. As an administrator you would have to compare the two coaching a similar sport before terminating one or the other. If you look at the head-to-head over the last five years, Kellie Harper has had more success than Rick barnes. Kelly has never finished below 4th in the SEC, and has had three first round draft picks over the last 3 years and is one of seven schools nationally to make the sweet 16 over the last 2 years. The year before being hired at Tennessee got her mid major program to the Sweet 16. So yes you would have to compare those records. So as a very good coach, why isn't Rick Barnes record in the NCAA tournament as good as Kellie Harper's over the last 5 years?
 
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#310
#310
Volfaninfl2 said:
Actually, we finished in the top 3 the first 4 years.

Also, in the 2020-21 year, 5 games were cancelled.

2019–20Tennessee21–1010–6T–3rdPostseason not held due to COVID-19
2020–21Tennessee17–89–43rdNCAA Second Round
2021–22Tennessee25–911–53rdNCAA Sweet Sixteen
2022–23Tennessee25–1213–33rdNCAA Sweet Sixteen
2023–24Tennessee18–1111–6T–4th
Tennessee:106–50 (.679)55–24 (.696)
Total:391–258 (.602)
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Volfaninfl2 said:
Actually, we finished in the top 3 the first 4 years.

Also, in the 2020-21 year, 5 games were cancelled.

2019–20Tennessee21–1010–6T–3rdPostseason not held due to COVID-19
2020–21Tennessee17–89–43rdNCAA Second Round
2021–22Tennessee25–911–53rdNCAA Sweet Sixteen
2022–23Tennessee25–1213–33rdNCAA Sweet Sixteen
2023–24Tennessee18–1111–6T–4th
Tennessee:106–50 (.679)55–24 (.696)
Total:391–258 (.602)
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So if they win today
Mudcat gives Lady Vols basketball 90% chance of winning twenty games
Meaning Kellie Lady Vols basketball team wouldn't have finished below twenty wins in a full season
 
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#311
#311
Dak1219 said:
So Rick Barnes has gotten Tennessee to the Sweet 16 once since Kellie arrived. As an administrator you would have to compare the two coaching a similar sport before terminating one or the other. If you look at the head-to-head over the last five years, Kellie Harper has had more success than Rick barnes. Kelly has never finished below 4th in the SEC, and has had three first round draft picks over the last 3 years and is one of seven schools nationally to make the sweet 16 over the last 2 years. The year before being hired at Tennessee got her mid major program to the Sweet 16. So yes you would have to compare those records. So as a very good coach, why isn't Rick Barnes record in the NCAA tournament as good as Kellie Harper's over the last 5 years?
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So which men's HC did was Holly Warlick compared to when everyone was on board to fire her?
Counzo Martin, Donnie Tyndall or Rick Barnes ?.
 
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#313
#313
Memvol44 said:
It's hate...
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Maybe hate in some cases. I think for most, it is an irrational belief that the LVs should magically return to the level of CPS's glory days, which actually ended in 2008 when CP3 and her cohort graduated. That was our last NC and FF. CPS did not recruit well for that transition bringing in an all freshman replacement group in 2008 (compounded by the tragic injury to Vicki Baugh). Out of that group. only Glory Johnson proved to be close to a blue chipper. Of course, CPS illness kicked in during those final years but her recruiting for 2009 all happened prior to her decline. Of course, that team had the notorious first round loss to Ball St. in the NCAAS. The "baby vols" went to to have some success, winning a few SEC titles but never got past the elite 8, even when the path was greased by Louisville upsetting Baylor.

Holly maintained that level of play for her first 3 seasons and then things started to slip. So, Kellie inherited a team that had not been a real contender for over a decade and that had just about gone off the rails in Holly's last two seasons. So, why did Kellie just not come in and win an NC in her first year?

The LV brand just is not the magic force that many on this board want to believe. Legacy effects don't mean that much to new recruits who want to be in the spotlight now and of course better NIL deals. Over the last three seasons, Kellie has done exceptionally well in the transfer portal. It is unfortunate the Pissott did not work out because she was a top 10 recruit and had she lived up to the bulling would have been the missing piece.

Kellie has been at the helm in a very tumultuous period. First, she was hired in the Spring and had no chance to recruit (other than keeping Jordan Horston in the fold, which was a big deal). then came the Covid restrictions. Now, some carping critics say that everyone faced the same restrictions but that overlooks that Kellie was a new coach who had no history of relationships to fall back on. She could not even build relationships. Honestly, it is unreasonable to expect that she would be killing HS recruiting from the start (except for the misplaced faith in the the magic draw of the LV brand".) Next season, we have Boyd (who may turn out to be very good) and Cooper plus whoever else arrives via the portal (I am betting Kellie kills it again).

But first, it is time to beat Bama...
 
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#314
#314
knoxvol52 said:
So which men's HC did was Holly Warlick compared to when everyone was on board to fire her?
Counzo Martin, Donnie Tyndall or Rick Barnes ?.
Click to expand...
Holly had lost to a horrible Vanderbilt team on our home court that season finished 8th in the SEC which was on the bottom half of the SEC and lost in the first round of the NCAA tournament for only the second time in school history after being at the helm 7 years. The program had been in free fall for about 3 years at that point. There was nothing to compare to that awful season. I think we were picked to finish to pick 7th or 8th Kellies first year as head coach and managed third and the NCAa tournament was cancelled due to Covid.
 
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#316
#316
Dak1219 said:
Holly had lost to a horrible Vanderbilt team on our home court that season finished 8th in the SEC which was on the bottom half of the SEC and lost in the first round of the NCAA tournament for only the second time in school history after being at the helm 7 years. The program had been in free fall for about 3 years at that point. There was nothing to compare to that awful season. I think we were finished to pick 7th or 8th Kellies first year as head coach and managed third and the NCAa tournament was cancelled due to Covid.
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But we should compare now? Okay. Moving on to the Alabama game..
 
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#317
#317
madtownvol said:
Maybe hate in some cases. I think for most, it is an irrational belief that the LVs should magically return to the level of CPS's glory days, which actually ended in 2008 when CP3 and her cohort graduated. That was our last NC an FF. CPS did not recruit well for that transition bringing in an all freshman replacement group in 2008 (compounded by the tragic injury to Vicki Baugh). Out of that group. only Glory Johnson proved to be close to a blue chipper. Of course, CPS illness kicked in during those final years but her recruiting for 2009 all happened prior to her decline. Of course, that team had the notorious first round loss to Ball St. in the NCAAS. The "baby vols" went to to have some success, winning a few SEC titles but never got past the elite 8, even when the path was greased by Louisville upsetting Baylor.

Holly maintained that level of play for her first 3 seasons and then things started to slip. So, Kellie inherited a team that had not been a real contender for over a decade and that had just about gone of the rails in Holly's last two seasons. So, why did Kellie just not come in and win an NC in her first year?

The LV brand just is not the magic force that many on this board want to believe, Legacy effects don't mean that much to new recruits who want to be in the spotlight now and of course better NIL deals. Over the last three seasons, Kellie has done exceptionally well in the transfer portal. It is unfortunate the Pissott did not work out because she was a top 10 recruit and had she lived up to the bulling would have been the missing piece.

Kellie has been at the helm in a very tumultuous period. First, she was hired in the Spring and had no change to recruit (other than keeping Jordan Horston in the fold, which was a big deal). then came the Covid restrictions. Now, some carping critics say that everyone faced the same restrictions but that overlooks that Kellie was a new coach who had no history of relationships to fall back on. She could not even build relationships. Honestly, it is unreasonable to expect that she would be killing HS recruiting from the start (except for the misplaced faith in the themagic draw of the LV brand". Next season, we have Boyd (who may turn out to be very good) and Cooper plus whoever else arrives via the portal (I am betting Kellie kills it again).

But first, it is time to beat Bama...
Click to expand...
I can agree that it has been a diminishing brand and expecting national championships out of the gate is unrealistic, but I am wondering with our resources why we have had trouble staying in the top 25 the last few years. I’m not sure if that is an unrealistic expectation or not, but we have to start somewhere again. I get that Kellie has had some bad luck sometimes with Covid, injuries, lack of NIL, but imo, I would think expecting to stay in the top 25 all season is not too much of an ask.
 
#319
#319
spojo13 said:
I can agree that it has been a diminishing brand and expecting national championships out of the gate is unrealistic, but I am wondering with our resources why we have had trouble staying in the top 25 the last few years. I’m not sure if that is an unrealistic expectation or not, but we have to start somewhere again. I get that Kellie has had some bad luck sometimes with Covid, injuries, lack of NIL, but imo, I would think expecting to stay in the top 25 all season is not too much of an ask.
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We have made the S!6 in the last two seasons so I think in the end, we de facto finished in the top 25. These last two seasons have been injury plaged. People forget that the Kellie had the LVs in the top ten during much of her third season and then came the injuries to Green and Horston and then things fell apart.

But, yes the failure to stay in the top 25 in these last two seasons is a legitimate blemish. I don't believe for a minute that Kellie gets fired this year but her seat is getting warm because of this very issue. Next season is going to be pivotal. Hopefully Key decides to take her Covid year and will come back 100% (if she wants to play in the pros that move makes sense particularly with NIL) and we get some good additions in the portal. We need another option at PG at minimum.
 
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#320
#320
madtownvol said:
We have made the S!6 in the last two seasons so I think in the end, we de facto finished in the top 25. These last two seasons have been injury plaged. People forget that the Kellie had the LVs in the top ten during much of her third season and then came the injuries to Green and Horston and then things fell apart.

But, yes the failure to stay in the top 25 in these last two seasons is a legitimate blemish. I don't believe for a minute that Kellie gets fired this year but her seat is getting warm because of this very issue. Next season is going to be pivotal. Hopefully Key decides to take her Covid year and will come back 100% (if she wants to play in the pros that move makes sense particularly with NIL) and we get some good additions in the portal. We need another option at PG at minimum.
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Yeah, agreed. Where you finish matters more than where you are during the season and has definitely taken the sting out of blemishes during the season. I remember being number 5 and thinking that we were finally back, but fate had some other plans.

I agree with the second part too. It’s a no brainer that having a better season also sets you up for better finishes in the tournament and where she has to take the next step forward next season. I hate it that things have turned out that way so far because my memories of Kellie, the tough as nails PG, is how I want to remember her, not as someone who just couldn’t get it done.
 
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#321
#321
LVBGOTN said:
Anyone see the tweet by Kea’s mom this morning? Seems like she wanted Kellie to “trust” Kea yesterday while in foul trouble. I look at it as it allowed others to step up and Kea getting some rest for today’s game.
Click to expand...

I was assured yesterday though, called nasty names even, by posters here who said I was “ridiculous” for saying there “are behind the scene frustrations between players and coaches”.

I’ve been here a long time, and the one thing I don’t do is lie.
 
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#324
#324
Volstylexx said:
I was assured yesterday though, called nasty names even, by posters here who said I was “ridiculous” for saying there “are behind the scene frustrations between players and coaches”.

I’ve been here a long time, and the one thing I don’t do is lie.
Click to expand...

Yeah, they seemed at each other's throat today
 
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