'18 FL WR Elijah Moore

#79
#79
Glitch said:
I don't think Saban is an effective mentor. If he was, the CFB world would be full of great HCs that learned from Saban. That was my point. You are right though. Elite is the wrong word. How about great? Or even good? Jumbo and..... I can't think of any others. I just don't think he wants to let loose of his formula.
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I won't dispute that he's a good to great HC but I think he's more of a great recruiting HC, and it's that initial success on the trail and results on the field that have started a cycle of "to the victors go the spoils." Since arriving at Bama he's never had to play with the less talented roster on the field, save for his first year. The sign of a great HC, to me, is what you do with the talent you have. There's at least a handful of coaches, IMO, who could switch rosters with Saban and beat him more handily than he beats them.
 
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#80
#80
Kristy* said:
Kirby is not having the success he had last year, especially in-state. Right now, they're sitting at 45, 13 in the SEC. They are still Georgia and aren't going to finish that low, the same way we didn't fall off the map with Dooley at the helm.
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Only thing that's not "success" is the total numbers. Their avg star ranking is good for 7th in the country right now.
 
#81
#81
bowlinggreenvol said:
I won't dispute that he's a good to great HC but I think he's more of a great recruiting HC, and it's that initial success on the trail and results on the field that have started a cycle of "to the victors go the spoils." Since arriving at Bama he's never had to play with the less talented roster on the field, save for his first year. The sign of a great HC, to me, is what you do with the talent you have. There's at least a handful of coaches, IMO, who could switch rosters with Saban and beat him more handily than he beats them.
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Saban is a great HC because he is able to sustain year after year. It makes me sick to be taking this stand but there it is. Yes, there may be a handful of coaches that are better game day coaches but nobody knows how to build and maintain a program like Saban has done. Those other great coaches have a couple good years then step back for a couple. Saban has built a machine and he knows how to keep it properly fueled. Other coaches don't keep topping off the tank like Nicky.

Now I am going to go shower with steel wool because I just feel terribly dirty and sick to my stomach.
 
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#84
#84
Glitch said:
Saban is a great HC because he is able to sustain year after year. It makes me sick to be taking this stand but there it is. Yes, there may be a handful of coaches that are better game day coaches but nobody knows how to build and maintain a program like Saban has done. Those other great coaches have a couple good years then step back for a couple. Saban has built a machine and he knows how to keep it properly fueled. Other coaches don't keep topping off the tank like Nicky.

Now I am going to go shower with steel wool because I just feel terribly dirty and sick to my stomach.
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But he got it that way after the initial success that some never get due to resources. He was average at MSU and had two really good years at LSU. He's taken it to another level at Bama and I believe that's due to resources that less than a handful of schools have.
 
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#85
#85
bowlinggreenvol said:
Only thing that's not "success" is the total numbers. Their avg star ranking is good for 7th in the country right now.
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I know you like to defend other schools, but here goes nothing:

Their average ranking on the composite would have them at 21 right now. 7th?

Georgia's class last year was huge because of the instate success. Their highest current recruit from Georgia is 34th in the state. They finished with 12 of the top 20 in-state last year. With exactly half of the top 20 already committed to other schools, they'll have 8 total if they miraculously close out with everybody still on the board this year. Instate recruiting is not a success.

I've already said they'll finish strong, but they won't have the same caliber class they had last year.
 
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#86
#86
bowlinggreenvol said:
But he got it that way after the initial success that some never get due to resources. He was average at MSU and had two really good years at LSU. He's taken it to another level at Bama and I believe that's due to resources that less than a handful of schools have.
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True, as a matter of fact, Saban never had back to back 10 win seasons till 2009. Another stat of note, Saban has only had one undefeated season. So, people say coach so and so always loses a game they shouldn't, that includes the mighty Saban as he has more talent as anyone.

I still contend, he is the best CEO of a coach and an above avg gameday coach.
 
#87
#87
Kristy* said:
I know you like to defend other schools, but here goes nothing:

Their average ranking on the composite would have them at 21 right now. 7th?

Georgia's class last year was huge because of the instate success. Their highest current recruit from Georgia is 34th in the state. They finished with 12 of the top 20 in-state last year. With exactly half of the top 20 already committed to other schools, they'll have 8 total if they miraculously close out with everybody still on the board this year. Instate recruiting is not a success.

I've already said they'll finish strong, but they won't have the same caliber class they had last year.
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They will be up to #22 in 3 days. UGA is doing OOS recruiting more this year. Zamir White, James Cook, the WR they got yesterday from FL. But, add in just the UGA leans, Hill, Salyer, Cook, Anderson, and possibly Fields and they could reach top 5 by NSD. Still think Fields ends up at FSU although I hear otherwise. I just don't see him at UGA.
 
#88
#88
Kristy* said:
I know you like to defend other schools, but here goes nothing:

Their average ranking on the composite would have them at 21 right now. 7th?

Georgia's class last year was huge because of the instate success. Their highest current recruit from Georgia is 34th in the state. They finished with 12 of the top 20 in-state last year. With exactly half of the top 20 already committed to other schools, they'll have 8 total if they miraculously close out with everybody still on the board this year. Instate recruiting is not a success.

I've already said they'll finish strong, but they won't have the same caliber class they had last year.
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I was using rivals star average and who cares where the kids come from? If they miss in GA and pick up 4-5* elsewhere it counts the same.

If defending schools is what you call pointing out logic then so be it. I guess I just don't see a school as "struggling" in recruiting when 80% of their class is ranked as "elite" by the industry's standard bearer service.
 
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#89
#89
bowlinggreenvol said:
I was using rivals star average and who cares where the kids come from? If they miss in GA and pick up 4-5* elsewhere it counts the same.

If defending schools is what you call pointing out logic then so be it. I guess I just don't see a school as "struggling" in recruiting when 80% of their class is ranked as "elite" by the industry's standard bearer service.
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80%? See, there you go again. By Rivals, they have 4 3*s to their 6 4(+)*s. So, even if you count all 6 "elite," then that would be 60%. And 4 of those are ranked 5.8, just above the 3* cut-off. By my count that would be 20% "elite" at best. All based on the rankings you are using by the way. :)

I care where the recruits come from. You said all aspects of their recruiting outside of total numbers is a success right now, after I pointed out that instate recruiting is not a success. Instate recruiting is an aspect. I've already said they'll finish strong, so I don't understand the point of this argument.
 
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#90
#90
Kristy* said:
80%? See, there you go again. By Rivals, they have 4 3*s to their 6 4(+)*s. So, even if you count all 6 "elite," then that would be 60%. And 4 of those are ranked 5.8, just above the 3* cut-off. By my count that would be 20% "elite" at best. All based on the rankings you are using by the way. :)

I care where the recruits come from. You said all aspects of their recruiting outside of total numbers is a success right now, after I pointed out that instate recruiting is not a success. Instate recruiting is an aspect. I've already said they'll finish strong, so I don't understand the point of this argument.
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My mistake on the 80%, that was Bama I looked at; 60% for UGA with a star avg of 3.7. I'm considering 4* recruits elite since that's the "minimum" number most fans like to see and sort of the standard. If they'll finish strong then what's the point of saying they're struggling? Their numbers are low but filled with well above avg talent from places other than GA at this point. When almost half of the 4* in GA (according to Rivals) haven't committed, it's hard for me to say they're tstruggling in state at this point.
 
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#92
#92
Meh I don't follow Georgia recruiting enough to give a damn about past performance in ratings. I do know this kid looked really good at WR. Of course with Chaney and Smart, I doubt it will matter.
 
#94
#94
SobeVol said:
If he couldn't do it at USC with their recruiting power, I doubt it.
Time will tell
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He was battling the sanctions and lack of depth because of it. He never got the chance to coach there with a full roster and typical USC loaded depth chart. He didn't his one year at TN either he was having to take chances on some guys he was bringing in that he normally wouldn't have had to take. His character and immaturity has held him back from being a really,really good HC. What he did with Crompton and his one year here was nothing short of incredible. And he should have beaten UCLA and Ala. Monte struggled with the uptemp,spread teams on our schedule that year because he had never faced that and didn't have a clue how to stop it. That coaching staff Lane had was probably the best or atleast one of the best top to bottom staff's ever assembled in Knoxville. He had some of the best recruiter's in the country including himself and Coach's who were well respected player developer's. If he would have stayed the possibility of being on probation would have been high but if that could have been avoided we would have gotten to the SEC Championship a few times at the very least. Say what you want but the job's he has done with average QB's like Crompton at TN and Sims and Coker at Ala was amazing. I'm in the minority but I don't think Jalen Hurts is more than an average QB and Lane had him playing great at times. I could only imagine would he could do with Dormady,JG,Sam Darnold and some of the other young crop of QB's that coming up now. If/When he matures he is gonna win a lot of games somewhere as a HC in College Football.
 
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#95
#95
Glitch said:
I don't think we've questioned his recruiting. It's been stated that the money is flow from UGA. Recruiting won't be and isn't Kirby's problem. It's his ability to be a head coach that will hinder him.
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I still don't see why people are writing him off because his first year. If he flops this year I Will jump on board.
 
#97
#97
MADISONGAVOL said:
I still don't see why people are writing him off because his first year. If he flops this year I Will jump on board.
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Why would he be a flop after just 2 years? I thought coaching takes time? Its not like Smart has had multiple HC positions before. This is his first HC job.
 
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