When do we go back to normal?

[hog88]

When you say our government forces us to work at a disadvantage it doesn’t come across that your vision is that the US should take our standards and encourage other nations rise to them by using trade as a bargaining chip. It sounds like you see the government’s regulations as a burden disadvantaging US companies relative to China.

They do put us at a disadvantage.

 

[TennTradition]

They do put us at a disadvantage.

I should have added to the burden sentence ‘that should be rolled away’.

Safe working standards, child labor laws, etc do make businesses less competitive against those who don’t employ them. But I wouldn’t think to discuss them with the tone of ‘well the government is disadvantaging is with these things’

 

[McDad]

Are you daft? We're doing business with China because they can manufacture goods much cheaper than we can. Same with Mexico and Latin America.

I'm especially fond of the elements they use in metallurgy. "Chinesium" TM, looks good but breaks at the worst possible moment. Maybe it's a smart metal???

 

[hog88]

I should have added to the burden sentence ‘that should be rolled away’.

Safe working standards, child labor laws, etc do make businesses less competitive against those who don’t employ them. But I wouldn’t think to discuss them with the tone of ‘well the government is disadvantaging is with these things’

My idea on "free trade" is we that have two choices, we can use pressure to have our partners raise standards to meet ours or lower ours to be competitive with them.

 

[TennTradition]

My idea on "free trade" is we that have two choices, we can use pressure to have our partners raise standards to meet ours or lower ours to be competitive with them.

It’s clear economies evolve. You are already seeing things like textiles flee China and head to places like Bangladesh. Standards tend to rise over time and prices either have to rise or the manufacturing will move to places where those standards are still considered acceptable vs the alternative. In some ways it lifts these societies and then it can oppress them. That evolution is an interesting thing.

I hear what you’re saying and it sounds good. Expensive, but good.

 

[Sandman 423]

I should have added to the burden sentence ‘that should be rolled away’.

Safe working standards, child labor laws, etc do make businesses less competitive against those who don’t employ them. But I wouldn’t think to discuss them with the tone of ‘well the government is disadvantaging is with these things’

Most people, who say the same things you are, don't hesitate to buy a ton of goods from people that don't follow any of that stuff. Go figure.

 

[GoDucks349]

If you, your wife, and your own self-quarantine, and everyone else go on about their business, she won't come into contact with everyone going about their business.

First, let me be clear, my wife is someone who is it very high risk should she contract COVID 19. She had many symptoms of COVID 19 and our primary care physician sent us to the ER as that was the only place that could at that time administer the COVID 19 test. They determined that she had bronchitis and sent her home. She does/did have bronchitis. Also, we have been self-quarantined for 2 weeks so far just to avoid the people potentially carrying the virus.

Turns out the same day we were at the ER another woman was admitted to that hospital through the ER she was not diagnosed with COVID 19, she was admitted with pneumonia. She died 4 days latter. They did a post mortem and COVID 19 test and she proved to be positive for COVID 19. She was the first death in our county.

To assume that others aren't carrying in this or any community is foolish in my opinion. Waiting till someone proves positive is a very big mistake.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Taking your example we never returned to normal after 9/11

I guess that depends on how you look at it, but fair point

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

My idea on "free trade" is we that have two choices, we can use pressure to have our partners raise standards to meet ours or lower ours to be competitive with them.

The left wants us to lower ours.

I know:

 

[hog88]

The left wants us to lower ours.

I know:

Actually they don’t. They want to keep putting our industry at a disadvantage by increasing regulation.

 

[Purple Tiger]

That is not exactly true. Our government forces us to work at a disadvantage. Level the playing field and see how much we outsource to other countries.

Not really. Average manufacturing wage in the US is $19.00. It is $3.60 in China. It is a matter of economics.

 

[Orange_Crush]

First, let me be clear, my wife is someone who is it very high risk should she contract COVID 19. She had many symptoms of COVID 19 and our primary care physician sent us to the ER as that was the only place that could at that time administer the COVID 19 test. They determined that she had bronchitis and sent her home. She does/did have bronchitis. Also, we have been self-quarantined for 2 weeks so far just to avoid the people potentially carrying the virus.

Turns out the same day we were at the ER another woman was admitted to that hospital through the ER she was not diagnosed with COVID 19, she was admitted with pneumonia. She died 4 days latter. They did a post mortem and COVID 19 test and she proved to be positive for COVID 19. She was the first death in our county.

To assume that others aren't carrying in this or any community is foolish in my opinion. Waiting till someone proves positive is a very big mistake.

I'm not sure your response answered my question.

If you, your wife, and your household self-quarantine, your wife doesn't come into contact with those who decided not to self-quarantine.

 

[ETV]

Yes Biden will take away your guns. Just like:

Woodrow Wilson will keep us out of WWI
Lyndon Johnson will not send our boys to that Asian war
Nixon has a secret plan to end the war
Carter will put on a gas tax
HW Bush "read my lips"
Clinton will get everyone healthcare
Bush will privatize social security and reduce govt spending
Obama is going to make immigration a top priority

Biden has no interest in dong away with one of their biggest smokescreens. Even if he did he couldn't do it. Trump can't get a border wall built that just a few years ago Obama himself supported. Biden and Beto are clowns and their combined efforts couldn't punch their way of a wet paper bag let alone do away with an amendment. Your opinion of a crazy 77 year old's political prowess is much higher than mine.

Also, I know some lobbyists that will tell you that your fears are unfounded. In their private, liquored up moments most will admit that all this stuff is just "talking points"

Fair points until you included the lobbyist reference.

 

[ETV]

I'm especially fond of the elements they use in metallurgy. "Chinesium" TM, looks good but breaks at the worst possible moment. Maybe it's a smart metal???

In my field, we have had some less than pleasant experiences with casted or machined chinese parts. Their idea of a quality casting is far different from our standards here in the states.

At first, the accounting department loved the idea and basically forced our hand. Once the maintenance costs associated with these products came due, their opinion changed quickly.

 

[FLVOL_79]

It's capitalism.

Its globalism dude.

But keep thinking a socialism/communism is the way...I'm sure there is some historical context to prove you right...

 

[utvolpj]

$2T says we never go back

 

[GoDucks349]

I'm not sure your response answered my question.

If you, your wife, and your household self-quarantine, your wife doesn't come into contact with those who decided not to self-quarantine.

We do venture out occasionally for supplies, we glove up, face masks and sanitize credit cards as we use them. Those that aren't taking precautions are putting more people at risk. Take a look at the number of diagnosed cases in a couple states that were/are slow to implement safety measures. FL and TX are #7 and #12 respectively. Others, Tenn #14, Ohio #16, GA #10.

This isn't just about protecting my wife this is about protecting Americans.

 

[Orange_Crush]

We do venture out occasionally for supplies, we glove up, face masks and sanitize credit cards as we use them. Those that aren't taking precautions are putting more people at risk. Take a look at the number of diagnosed cases in a couple states that were/are slow to implement safety measures. FL and TX are #7 and #12 respectively. Others, Tenn #14, Ohio #16, GA #10.

This isn't just about protecting my wife this is about protecting Americans.

I guess the point remains that any American that is worried can self-quarantine and not come into contact with those who choose to go on about life. That sounds like taking personal responsibility without intruding on the rights of others. And the numbers of others catching it due to their own decisions isn't as much your concern. I don't feel that I need you making decisions for me, and I won't hold you responsible for the outcomes of my decisions. And again... If you self-quarantine, you won't be affected by my decisions to go about my business.

 

[GoDucks349]

I guess the point remains that any American that is worried can self-quarantine and not come into contact with those who choose to go on about life. That sounds like taking personal responsibility without intruding on the rights of others. And the numbers of others catching it due to their own decisions isn't as much your concern. I don't feel that I need you making decisions for me, and I won't hold you responsible for the outcomes of my decisions. And again... If you self-quarantine, you won't be affected by my decisions to go about my business.

So if you get COVID 19 you won't go to the hospital and use up resources that otherwise would be available to people you may have infected as a COVID 19 carrier, is that correct? You won't beg for a ventilator or other help... right?

You are, I'm assuming, OK with me holding you responsible if you use up supplies and human support that could have helped those you may infect.

Takes about a minute, here's a link worth a look.

 

[Orange_Crush]

So if you get COVID 19 you won't go to the hospital and use up resources that otherwise would be available to people you may have infected as a COVID 19 carrier, is that correct? You won't beg for a ventilator or other help... right?

You are, I'm assuming, OK with me holding you responsible if you use up supplies and human support that could have helped those you may infect.

Takes about a minute, here's a link worth a look.

If there are no resources to help me, I will take personal responsibility for my decisions and live with the consequences. If there are others sick, it will be due to their decisions. If you self-quarantined, you won't be infected or in the hospital.

Why does it keep going from your wife's safety to you needing to save the world against our will? You're talking to a libertarian. I see freedom and responsibility for my actions as incredibly important, and generally the answer to most supposed dilemmas.

 

[Matt2496]

I voted 9+ weeks because things will never go back to normal.

 

[GoDucks349]

If there are no resources to help me, I will take personal responsibility for my decisions and live with the consequences. If there are others sick, it will be due to their decisions. If you self-quarantined, you won't be infected or in the hospital.

Why does it keep going from your wife's safety to you needing to save the world against our will? You're talking to a libertarian. I see freedom and responsibility for my actions as incredibly important, and generally the answer to most supposed dilemmas.

I'm starting to like you in a very perverse way..... LOL

A few of the tenants of being a Libertarian are, freedom of choice, voluntary association and individual judgement. I choose to self quarantine (choice), I choose to limit voluntary association and my individual judgement tells me that its important share information that may help others. These are libertarian values. Please consider them.

In 1972 I was working as a millwright, I was the only guy in the lunchroom reading the Wall Street Journal. This guy who sat across from me was a libertarian. We got into a conversation and I lost a bet to him. My side of the bet was that I'd read "Fountainhead" and 'Atlas Shrugged". We had some pretty intense discussions.

 

[RollinVol]

Now schools are saying not to start back until the 27th. I think schools are done for the year. As i wrote in another post. I live in Missouri. It seems here that every time someone in a county gets it, the whole county goes on a stay at home order

 

[theFallGuy]

First it's comical that ANYONE would think things will be back to normal in anything LESS than 10 weeks is a joke. If things are back to some version of normal in 9 MONTHS I'll be happy. I've had a lot of great exchanges with people on Volnation and it saddens me that Tennessee is so slow to implement restrictions necessary to slow COVID 19. I wish all of you well.

My wife and I are 72, my wife has been ill for about 3 weeks with what the local emergency room diagnosed as bronchitis. They said they only give COVID 19 tests to those that they admit to the hospital (March 8th). At that time they said the nearest lab for processing tests was Atlanta (assuming this to be the CDC) they said turn around time was 4 days to get results. My wife has Celiac Disease and last fall she went from 126# to 102# in 6 weeks. She's extremely vulnerable to COVID 19, she's had pneumonia 3 times. When we went to the emergency room she had a temp of 100.9 F. I could go on... NOTE: when we started in the ER none of the nurses or doctors were wearing masks and eye protection. By the time that they sent us home all the nurses and md's that met with us were wearing masks and eye guards. Tell me that is comforting. It's like they are sending the old guys home to fend for themselves or die....

Yes, I'm pissed.... OK, so Tennessee thinks they don't have a problem with COVID19? Do the Vols think that they should receive federal help when COVID 19 hits them and they haven't acted to help themselves?

Sorry if this is a bit preachy, but I like you guys and I wish you well.

there is no way they will keep the country on lockdown for 9 months. Virus or no virus. That won't happen

 

[Orange_Crush]

I'm starting to like you in a very perverse way..... LOL

A few of the tenants of being a Libertarian are, freedom of choice, voluntary association and individual judgement. I choose to self quarantine (choice), I choose to limit voluntary association and my individual judgement tells me that its important share information that may help others. These are libertarian values. Please consider them.

Does this mean that we're in agreement?

I apologize if I misinterpreted that you were advocating a mandatory quarantine. By your last post, it seems I was wrong. So, I apologize.

FWIW, if I chose not to self quarantine, and you and your family were my neighbors, I'd bring you provisions, disinfect them, and leave them on your porch so that you'd be able to self quarantine and remain safe. I'm a huge advocate of selfless, actionable love and volunteerism. I'm not just a selfish ___hole.