Truth about Majors/ Fulmer Please???

[Capt Straight]

Foot note:
She was a big bitch, so I can only imagine what was said in her kitchen!

 

[LWSVOL]

Majors was getting screwed by UT. He was the dean of SEC coaches and the winningest coach in the league but was getting bottom of the league pay.

Phil wasn't tough on the team. Which would become a reoccurring theme for his squads if Cutcliffe wasn't policing things. Majors was tough on the players and many preferred it Phil's way, unsurprisingly.

While Johnny was sick Phil wasn't just playing Joe Johnson (end around on Dickey) he was also playing politics with the most influential boosters. That was another game Johnny didn't play well. He was like Saban in that regard.

The boosters really liked that ego stroke. Majors comes back for LSU, Phil goes back to OC and we can't score all of a sudden. Then the losses hit and we can't score. Fulmers agent rumored he was being pursued for other jobs. (This became a reoccurring theme. He was never approached for jobs by the Carolina Panthers, Clemson etc etc as was rumored over the years)

Phil had built the political capital playing the game behind the scenes that allowed a coach that had won multiple SEC titles, a Sugar Bowl and had 2 top 10 finishes in the prior three years, to be fired. Not just any coach. A bona-fide UT legend. For younger fans, imagine Peyton Manning winning a national title, coming back here to coach after, rebuilding the program, getting a couple of SEC titles and then firing him for having a 3 loss season.

Then Phil had the gall to throw the biggest fit he could for years on end because he got fired after two losing seasons in 4 years and no SEC championships in a decade. Phil knew how he got the job and never hired an assistant capable of becoming a head coach. I'm surprised he even retained Cutcliffe.

Johnny had a fitting nickname for Fulmer, "Judas Brutus".

Phil ushered in the era of dysfunctional boosters with more influence than they ever should have over day to day decisions. Fulmer sold his soul to them to get the job. It was the same boosters that finally approved his firing. Mike Hamilton had done to him what he'd done to Majors years before.

actually, Johnny coached and got credit for winning the Cincinnati game. He coached from the press box. He was in the office Sunday after the Florida game working for first time since his surgery..

 

[Sarms58]

Pretty sure that most felt that Majors would never get us to that mythical “next level” - just too inconsistent. Or primary consistency was in chocking to Bama. The ‘92 was a really good team but just 4 seasons prior we started 0-6 (in Majors 12th season). To start with such great wins and then have Johnny come back and lose to three inferior opponents reminded the powers to be of all the previous disappointments (like ‘88) so I’m sure they were in the mood to make a change if given the opportunity.

 

[YorkVol]

The Majors replacement and later on the Fulmer replacement are examples of the biggest flaw in college football. That is how do you effectively replace a hall of fame coach in a way that honors that coach while also giving you the best chance of continued success? Replacing Majors was the right move, but we did it in the worst possible way. Same with Fulmer. Both events split the fan base and the second resulted in decades of poor performance, coaching changes, player turmoil and so on. No school has been immune to this. Bama after Bear, USC, OSU, Penn State, etc have all gone thru rapid decline after losing their favorite coach. And the years of turmoil that follow cost schools millions in coaching searches, paying buyouts, loss of revenue and advertisers, so you would think schools would try something different.
My suggestion would be a succession clause in contracts after a certain level of success or years on the job. It would read something like “after 2 years of 5% decline in performance stats the succession plan kicks in. You get to hire and train your replacement, or designate someone on your staff as your heir apparent. At the end of the next year, you retire with a parade, pension, etc.” let them go out on top with dignity and applause.
Maybe I’m too naive, but this seems better than how it’s been done.

 

[plumbervol]

So no one else ever heard the story that CJM pissed (literally) on the shoes or leg of an important booster?
Probably not true but by god its my favorite story about that situation..

I bet this story has teeth. It was told by a deceased Booster/Surgeon who was into Real estate speculation in Blount Co. He always travelled with the BB team on those foreign junkets and never missed a football game home or away. He was at CCC when it was supposed to happen and saw it happen. I have heard others tell the story but did not see it actually happen only the aftermath.
The NCAA problems in 87 was always mentioned as a factor, IMO either to help justify what happened or as a reason UT did not compensate Majors in a way many thought UT should have, Run in's with staff, AD staff Boosters and officials, not to mention off the field behavior was said to be part of the reasons. I do know by 1992-93 many people were ready for him to go other than the "legions of the Miserable" Football was changing and SOS was at Florida changing the game and in my opinion many people had Spurrier Envy and wanted a young brash coach who had a wide open offense.

 

[Smokey19rt]

Yeah, good luck with this.

I'll die believing Some of both are true, but anyway you slice it Phil wasn't innocent. Always had a black cloud over Phil's head from that time on in my eyes. Never hated on Phil but never was a huge fan either.

RIP CJM.

You’ll die wrong, Majors cut his own throat with his antics and his parchment for whiskey. Coach Fuller just reaped the rewards for his loyalty to UT, period.

 

[Cormock Mac]

Pretty sure that most felt that Majors would never get us to that mythical “next level” - just too inconsistent. Or primary consistency was in chocking to Bama. The ‘92 was a really good team but just 4 seasons prior we started 0-6 (in Majors 12th season). To start with such great wins and then have Johnny come back and lose to three inferior opponents reminded the powers to be of all the previous disappointments (like ‘88) so I’m sure they were in the mood to make a change if given the opportunity.

It's obvious you're incapable of recognizing and/or acknowledging a good coach. Instead of reading the accounts of LWS or Roy Exum(they both have real insider knowledge of what transpired), you come here spouting your half baked opinions.

 

[Evergrenevol]

I have always heard that Majors demanded to be the highest paid coach in The SEC and Dickey told him no. Majors threw an office supply object at Dickey and then Majors was fired the very next day.

This tells me all I need to know about you

 

[alvinkamara]

You’ll die wrong, Majors cut his own throat with his antics and his parchment for whiskey. Coach Fuller just reaped the rewards for his loyalty to UT, period.

Who the he!! is coach "Fuller?" How does one drink "parchment?" Acquaint yourself with the language before posting. We would all consider it a great favor.

 

[Behr]

You’ll die wrong, Majors cut his own throat with his antics and his parchment for whiskey. Coach Fuller just reaped the rewards for his loyalty to UT, period.

Lol.

 

[tennesseeduke]

I was enrolled at UT in 1992. I always hear two different stories bout what went on and I would like those that were around back then with me to share your thoughts. I remember these specific things to be 100% true. Majors had a quadruple bypass before the season began. Fulmer was named interim. Fulmer went on the road and beat #14 Georgia. The Vols then beat #4 UF and others and ended up the #4 ranked team. Majors comes back and loses to a God awful Arkansas team that was earlier beat up by the Citadel. We then lay an egg at home and lose to Bama 17-10, for our 7th consecutive loss vs the tide. Next week we go to SC and get beat by another awful team. This is the time we hear that Majors will retire and Phil is to take over.

I have heard different people vociferously push two different stories about why this came to pass.

1. Fulmer was THE hot coaching candidate that year. He made it clear to the powers that be that if they didn't hire him he would bolt for Texas. Fulmer worked behind the scenes and planted the knife in Majors back.

2. Majors had demanded a large pay raise before the season and continued to push the issue with then President Joe Johnson. Johnson had lost all faith in Majors as a coach, but more so, questioned his metal stability. The on-field debacles were the last straw for Johnson. Johnson decided it was time for the change and did just that.

Which is True? Some of both? None at all? I know we have a very knowledgeable community here and I would really like to hear what others have to say. Thank you in advance.

Truth is it was as much the fans fault as it was allegedly Fulmer fault! He’s 4-0 with a Gator blowout. Majors come back and loses 3 straight. I was at the 3rd game in Columbia. Lost when we didn’t make extra 2 Pt conversion. I believe with replay we win s as I think Phillips scored! Anyway the rumors later was Fulmer as OC was downplaying the offense so We couldn’t score and get coach Majors fired. Fans were all over Majors for the 3 straight losses and his age. Next thing you know it’s announced that Majors would step down. Majors for a fact was drinking heavily and it was affecting recruiting also. My buddy Brandon Bennett told me a great story about it. Yes that Brandon that played at USCe and with Bengals for several years was all Vol until a visit with coach Majors who was drunk when he was on his visit!

 

[Cormock Mac]

I bet this story has teeth. It was told by a deceased Booster/Surgeon who was into Real estate speculation in Blount Co. He always travelled with the BB team on those foreign junkets and never missed a football game home or away. He was at CCC when it was supposed to happen and saw it happen. I have heard others tell the story but did not see it actually happen only the aftermath.
The NCAA problems in 87 was always mentioned as a factor, IMO either to help justify what happened or as a reason UT did not compensate Majors in a way many thought UT should have, Run in's with staff, AD staff Boosters and officials, not to mention off the field behavior was said to be part of the reasons. I do know by 1992-93 many people were ready for him to go other than the "legions of the Miserable" Football was changing and SOS was at Florida changing the game and in my opinion many people had Spurrier Envy and wanted a young brash coach who had a wide open offense.

"I bet this story has teeth". Were you there? Please read the accounts of Roy Exum and LWSVOL. Both were real insiders. When you hitched your wagon to Fulmer, the die was cast for the present state of Tennessee football.

 

[Cormock Mac]

actually, Johnny coached and got credit for winning the Cincinnati game. He coached from the press box. He was in the office Sunday after the Florida game working for first time since his surgery..

Yep. he knew what Phil was up to behind his back. Majors never pulled Tennessee as low as Phil has pulled it now.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

Yep. he knew what Phil was up to behind his back. Majors never pulled Tennessee as low as Phil has pulled it now.

Yep, Fulmer was trying to win games and posture himself for a HC gig somewhere. He was among the rising stars as OC like Elliot is today. His trial run as interim only increased his value. I believe the accounts that say he would have taken several other coaches with him due to Majors I think OVERBEARING personality. He had a good eye but my memory was he lost lots of guys to lateral moves for a reason. He was who he was but did not adapt to changing times in dealing with staff and players. Most appreciated his orange to the core heart, but there are limits.

I am sure when the ball started rolling CPF signaled he would stay if Majors was cut loose. I don’t think either would ever try to cost UT a yard much less a game as conspiracy theorists put out there Just not in most coaches DNA. Especially at their home school. They each had their flaws but nothing else either did would support them purposely undercutting UT.

I appreciated both when they were in the lead, but both put their jobs in play and paid the price.

In large part CPF was good at using GOOD assistants but did not have the eye of JM, and two hires ended both his tenures. Clawson and Pruitt for very different reasons turned out badly. One did not fit and one is the poster child for the Peter principle.

 

[Tman44]

Roy Exum: The Vols’ Darkest Days

A lot of this squares with what my father related to me. In Mr. Exum’s version he leaves out a story I’ve been told about The Peabody Hotel, but he clearly states in this piece he was not there, he was covering another game.

Tifwiw .

This article from Exum is a great account of CJM's side of the story. I can see how CJM honestly believed this story explains how things were. Missing from this narrative were the numerous and very significant problems caused by CJM. When you look at both sides of the story, they fit perfectly well together. I see CJM had a legitimate grievance with the UT brass in regards to his salary. CJM did himself a great disservice in the manner he carried himself and this alone was enough for the UT brass. The very unfortunate circumstances of loosing a great friend, then having your own heart attack had to devastate CJM. Then the remarkable work by the CPF lead Vols had to weigh heavily on a less than clearly thinking CJM. Was CJM delusional about CPF or not? I don't think that is relevant in the end. UT brass had already had enough and CJM sealed his own fate by returning to coach the Vols when he never should have. Sad story in the end.

 

[ArdentVol]

That's a very accurate timeline IMO. The only other thing I remember is that after Fulmer started 4-0 and Majors just showed back up out of the blue, the coaching staff was in turmoil with guys literally ready to walk away at halftime against LSU. Majors was never easy to deal with but apparently became unpredictable and just mean after the surgery. I'm sure it was in part due to all the pain, rehab etc that he was dealing with. I think everybody from administration to the coaching staff just eventually had enough and we finally lost enough games that a move was made.

agree w/ both
Was living in bama at the time,and the backstabbing talk increased as Fulmer passed the Tide. Dont believe anybody from Tennessee was trashed more than Phil. Peyton was up there, and I never heard any Bama-based media member (dunno about Finebaum) who voted Peyton No. 1 in Heisman race

 

[VOLINVONORE]

The Majors replacement and later on the Fulmer replacement are examples of the biggest flaw in college football. That is how do you effectively replace a hall of fame coach in a way that honors that coach while also giving you the best chance of continued success? Replacing Majors was the right move, but we did it in the worst possible way. Same with Fulmer. Both events split the fan base and the second resulted in decades of poor performance, coaching changes, player turmoil and so on. No school has been immune to this. Bama after Bear, USC, OSU, Penn State, etc have all gone thru rapid decline after losing their favorite coach. And the years of turmoil that follow cost schools millions in coaching searches, paying buyouts, loss of revenue and advertisers, so you would think schools would try something different.
My suggestion would be a succession clause in contracts after a certain level of success or years on the job. It would read something like “after 2 years of 5% decline in performance stats the succession plan kicks in. You get to hire and train your replacement, or designate someone on your staff as your heir apparent. At the end of the next year, you retire with a parade, pension, etc.” let them go out on top with dignity and applause.
Maybe I’m too naive, but this seems better than how it’s been done.

This fans base has grown into two different segments, those who criticize everything and those who praise everything. I doubt that they will ever come together. Sometimes it appears that when fans see a positive post, they have to look for something negative to offset the positive. On the other hand, when someone post a negative statement, some will go overboard in trying to over react with something their response. It is almost like politics. the more we we exchange comments the farther the extremes become. I don't think it is healthy for either our sports or politics. There is always three side to any topic; your ideas, my ideas, and the truth which is usually some where in the middle. Most of us are guilty and , I will try to look more toward the middle.

 

[Big Orange Hoss]

You’ll die wrong, Majors cut his own throat with his antics and his parchment for whiskey. Coach Fuller just reaped the rewards for his loyalty to UT, period.

I couldn't have said it any better.

 

[Cormock Mac]

This article from Exum is a great account of CJM's side of the story. I can see how CJM honestly believed this story explains how things were. Missing from this narrative were the numerous and very significant problems caused by CJM. When you look at both sides of the story, they fit perfectly well together. I see CJM had a legitimate grievance with the UT brass in regards to his salary. CJM did himself a great disservice in the manner he carried himself and this alone was enough for the UT brass. The very unfortunate circumstances of loosing a great friend, then having your own heart attack had to devastate CJM. Then the remarkable work by the CPF lead Vols had to weigh heavily on a less than clearly thinking CJM. Was CJM delusional about CPF or not? I don't think that is relevant in the end. UT brass had already had enough and CJM sealed his own fate when he returned to coach the Vols when he never should have. Sad story in the end.

Exum was there. You weren't. A lot of truth in your post; well written, but with respect to the "numerous and very significant problems caused by CJM", most all of the stories told of his bad behavior are hearsay. I'll agree that he made a mistake in returning too soon from his heart surgery, but a lot of the other negative tales are mostly based on rumor and exaggeration. I'm sure he drank some, but a good question is how much did he drink? Was his drinking a big, big problem? I don't know and I've not seen or come across any conclusive evidence that it was a big problem. If his drinking was a problem, I might drink too if Fulmer did to me what he did to CJM. It would probably be fair to say that a reasonably large percentage of football coaches use alcohol. My view of this is just as relevant as most of this other hearsay. Somewhere in this thread LWSVOL has some good info that pretty much supports CJM's views. LWS has always had some good inside info. I'll trust his take on CJM before I'll give credence to the likes of "I have a good friend whose sister's boyfriend worked in the Athletic Dept." kind of tales. I'd advise that his take along with Exum's be read before making judgements about CJM. Whatever Coach John Majors did or didn't do, he never drug the Tennessee football program to the depths that Fulmer's leadership has caused.

 

[VolArmy74]

Truth is it was as much the fans fault as it was allegedly Fulmer fault! He’s 4-0 with a Gator blowout. Majors come back and loses 3 straight. I was at the 3rd game in Columbia. Lost when we didn’t make extra 2 Pt conversion. I believe with replay we win s as I think Phillips scored! Anyway the rumors later was Fulmer as OC was downplaying the offense so We couldn’t score and get coach Majors fired. Fans were all over Majors for the 3 straight losses and his age. Next thing you know it’s announced that Majors would step down. Majors for a fact was drinking heavily and it was affecting recruiting also. My buddy Brandon Bennett told me a great story about it. Yes that Brandon that played at USCe and with Bengals for several years was all Vol until a visit with coach Majors who was drunk when he was on his visit!

When Majors was fired recruiting was incredible. His last 3 teams were loaded to the gills with NFL players and he left Fulmer with a massive stockpile of talent. Johnny was a great recruiter and anyone who ever spent 5 minutes around him would feel like they've known him for 10 years.

 

[BanditVol]

Who the he!! is coach "Fuller?" How does one drink "parchment?" Acquaint yourself with the language before posting. We would all consider it a great favor.

I think he meant "partation". Or maybe "parchness". Hm.

 

[snappervol]

When Majors was fired recruiting was incredible. His last 3 teams were loaded to the gills with NFL players and he left Fulmer with a massive stockpile of talent. Johnny was a great recruiter and anyone who ever spent 5 minutes around him would feel like they've known him for 10 years.

The way I remember things, Phillip was a really strong recruiter during this timeframe

 

[Tman44]

I think he meant "partation". Or maybe "parchness". Hm.

I guess the poster may have been thinking of "penchant"

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

When Majors was fired recruiting was incredible. His last 3 teams were loaded to the gills with NFL players and he left Fulmer with a massive stockpile of talent. Johnny was a great recruiter and anyone who ever spent 5 minutes around him would feel like they've known him for 10 years.

Who served as Major’s recruiting coordinators the last few years? Memory lapse!

 

[Pruitt18]

I do know that even to this day there is still a dickey majors feud. I think it was basically Johnny had demanded a raise and there was supplosely a hiring freeze at the time that prevented that and when he said publicly he'd quit if he didn't get his raise and that made dickey mad. Then you had phil winning games and majors come back and loses. Makes a simple decision for a administrator. I'd say if majors had kept his mouth shut he would have survived a little longer