The Official Rick Barnes discussion thread

#626
#626
IMHO, Barnes is a great coach and will be the Tennessee coach as long as he wants. And I think the program is in a very good place because of his work here.

The lesson I have learned from him is this: when you are the leader of a group of people who care passionately about a 'cause' or 'program', whatever, you NEVER indicate that you are not committed to that cause and are instead a mercenary. It may be true, and with limited circumstances where a coach is coaching his/her alma mater, almost always IS the case that coaches don't internalize their fan base's passion. And the fans, deep in their heart, know that. BUT, you NEVER wave that in their face. That is almost an unrecoverable transgression to a lot of fans.

In Barnes' case, he isn't passionate about Tennessee, and it makes sense he wouldn't be. He didn't attend the school, he isn't from Tennessee, and didn't grow up a fan. He is loyal to Tennessee because his paycheck comes from here and he tends to build solid relationships with the players he recruits and coaches. And that's fine, and is the same case with 95% of coaches out there. What he did was broadcast that fact with the UCLA fiasco. Waved it in the fans' faces. It's emotional immaturity and a COMPLETE self-focused failure to read the room on his part. Barnes strikes me as fairly arrogant, but he strikes me as a savvy, ethical and honest person. I have no doubt he would walk that back if he could.

For a decent chunk of fans, Barnes will never recover from that, and unless he wins a NC will never be allowed back into the fold. For me? I'm happy with his results here, I hope he stays for a while and makes a FF, and I hope and pray our AD uses the incredible momentum Barnes has built to make an eventual replacement home-run hire (to mix sports metaphors).

What would be SOOOO VERY TENNESSEE would be to take a step backwards and hire an 'up and comer' mid-major who flames out. For all the folks who want Barnes gone tomorrow, remember the history here, and be VERY careful what you wish for.
 
#628
#628
From ESPN:

The only thing worse than losing back-to-back Elite Eight games is never getting that far. Before Rick Barnes, that was the case in every Tennessee season but one (2010).

Like Alabama, this season's Vols had the profile of a 1-seed. And also like their SEC rivals, the Vols were taken out by an incredibly strong top seed (in their case Houston). Sometimes you just have to tip your cap to the other team.

Popular or not, Barnes has been the most successful men's basketball coach in Tennessee's history. He hasn't won the most games overall, but he has won the most games that mattered. And the Vols aren't done knocking on the door of the school's first Final Four.
 
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#629
#629
BernardKingGOAT said:
He's a HOF coach. There's not a caveat to it all. There isn't an asterisk with a note at the bottom.
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Never put an asterisk but all coaches have things they are good at and not so good at. Developing offensive players isn't on his playlist. He has had a couple but they were what they were. KD was KD DK was DK and Lanier was Lanier. Outside of those three there are no others. Even Grant was a defensive player (and still is) that can score. At UT he has had exactly 2 20 point scorers. DK and Punter.. both inherited. The only 2 others on the list that averaged over 14 were Williams at19 one season and 15 the other and Lanier at 18. Every other leading scorer has been 12-14 points. It's hard to develop offense on a team that averages 60 points a game.
 
#630
#630
OrangeInKy said:
And he says it’s the young ones that don’t understand the Tennessee standard. Im old enough to remember when making the tournament was monumental, but Im apparently too young to remember our countless final four trips and championships. This is like a Kentucky football fan saying making the playoff isn’t up to the Kentucky standard. This is the best we’ve ever had it.
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Same here...grew up on Devoe and Wade. I've tasted garbage basketball. If people can't appreciate this season of life, they need a major reality check.
 
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#631
#631
cncchris33 said:
Same here...grew up on Devoe and Wade. I've tasted garbage basketball. If people can't appreciate this season of life, they need a major reality check.
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Sounds like we are about the same age. Those older than us got to see some fun stuff with Ernie and Bernie, but my first 20 years of Vol bball fandom was almost all just misery. I’d like for have someone to have told me back in the early 90’s that one day I would read that back to back Elite 8’s isn’t up to the “Tennessee standard”. One of the most ignorant statements I’ve read in a while.

I also think it’s ridiculous that people can’t grasp that we can be crushed to fall short of a final 4 again and still appreciative of what we’ve got going right now. Im not satisfied with losing in the Elite 8, nor is anyone in that team or staff, but Im also excited about the program we have and the people who are leading it.
 
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#632
#632
It's hilarious how folks say I'm being silly when they can give no evidence to refute it. Its not a knock on Barnes its a product of his system. He focuses on defense above all else. There is not a lot of room, or energy for a ton of offensive variety. Not once have I said Barnes is a bad or less-than-great coach. That's you dweebs inferring that because this is the world we live in everything is polarized and its either drink the Kool-Aid or you're the enemy. There is this thing called truth. you may ignore it but it still exists. Two opposing things can be true at once,. Luka Doncic is a better player than Anthony Davis...way better. Trading for him made the Lakers worse. Because it amplified one of their greatest weaknesses and doubled down on their greatest strength. Luka and Lebron play similar roles in slightly different ways both of them on the court together makes them both less. As a Lakers fan that's hard for me to say but it's true. It directly boned DK because after finally creating space at his position by trading Russel and Christie now there is Luka in the way... But playing with Luka will be good for DK. See two things opposed being true.
 
#634
#634
cncchris33 said:
Same here...grew up on Devoe and Wade. I've tasted garbage basketball. If people can't appreciate this season of life, they need a major reality check.
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Don't forget Kevin O'Neil, we had some pretty lousy seasons with his dynamite offenses. I was unlucky enough to be a student during his tenure.
 
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#636
#636
General Jack said:
Don't forget Kevin O'Neil, we had some pretty lousy seasons with his dynamite offenses. I was unlucky enough to be a student during his tenure.
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We could never forget him.
I saw him at West Town mall shortly after he was hired and he was just as warm and fuzzy as he appeared on TV. I could hear that dude cussing from my seat at TBA. In his time, that place was like a museum but not as loud.
 
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#637
#637
Sometime in the '90s we were in the cellar in the east and TBA was dead enough that someone picked up an opponent's "get that weak (stuff) out" on mic. Mississippi State maybe? They were really good for a minute when they had Erick Dampier, or maybe it was a Nolan Richardson hogs team. Anyway we're 73-8 at home over the past five years. Nothing wrong with wanting to push a little further every year, but add me to the grateful for where we are group.
 
#639
#639
VolInNW said:
In Barnes' case, he isn't passionate about Tennessee, and it makes sense he wouldn't be. He didn't attend the school, he isn't from Tennessee, and didn't grow up a fan. He is loyal to Tennessee because his paycheck comes from here and he tends to build solid relationships with the players he recruits and coaches. And that's fine, and is the same case with 95% of coaches out there. What he did was broadcast that fact with the UCLA fiasco. Waved it in the fans' faces. It's emotional immaturity and a COMPLETE self-focused failure to read the room on his part. Barnes strikes me as fairly arrogant, but he strikes me as a savvy, ethical and honest person. I have no doubt he would walk that back if he could.
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Wow...a ton of conjecture and assumptions in here. Where do you get that he isn't passionate about Tennessee? The UCLA thing....he didn't wave it in fans' faces, he waved it in Fulmer's face. You know...the AD at the time who apparently wasn't taking him seriously. And even still you seem to have a VERY dated view of how things work now, and your definition of passionate is a very narrow one that again doesn't exist anymore.

I don't know....he looks pretty passionate about Tennessee here:
1743439984376.png
 
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#640
#640
VolInNW said:
IMHO, Barnes is a great coach and will be the Tennessee coach as long as he wants. And I think the program is in a very good place because of his work here.

The lesson I have learned from him is this: when you are the leader of a group of people who care passionately about a 'cause' or 'program', whatever, you NEVER indicate that you are not committed to that cause and are instead a mercenary. It may be true, and with limited circumstances where a coach is coaching his/her alma mater, almost always IS the case that coaches don't internalize their fan base's passion. And the fans, deep in their heart, know that. BUT, you NEVER wave that in their face. That is almost an unrecoverable transgression to a lot of fans.

In Barnes' case, he isn't passionate about Tennessee, and it makes sense he wouldn't be. He didn't attend the school, he isn't from Tennessee, and didn't grow up a fan. He is loyal to Tennessee because his paycheck comes from here and he tends to build solid relationships with the players he recruits and coaches. And that's fine, and is the same case with 95% of coaches out there. What he did was broadcast that fact with the UCLA fiasco. Waved it in the fans' faces. It's emotional immaturity and a COMPLETE self-focused failure to read the room on his part. Barnes strikes me as fairly arrogant, but he strikes me as a savvy, ethical and honest person. I have no doubt he would walk that back if he could.

For a decent chunk of fans, Barnes will never recover from that, and unless he wins a NC will never be allowed back into the fold. For me? I'm happy with his results here, I hope he stays for a while and makes a FF, and I hope and pray our AD uses the incredible momentum Barnes has built to make an eventual replacement home-run hire (to mix sports metaphors).

What would be SOOOO VERY TENNESSEE would be to take a step backwards and hire an 'up and comer' mid-major who flames out. For all the folks who want Barnes gone tomorrow, remember the history here, and be VERY careful what you wish for.
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What in the world? I should never be surprised at things posted on here...but strange after a historical run.

Rick Barnes is just brutally honest- whether it's good or bad. He just doesn't sugar coat anything. I would bet that he doesn't regret saying one thing about the UCLA job, even though it ruffled some fans' feathers. You aren't arrogant when almost every peer of yours praises your moral compass and way of handling yourself. You aren't arrogant when you text daily prayers for people who are sick. In fact, it's the opposite of arrogance- it's showing compassion for others. You aren't arrogant when you openly support and are glowing about other coaches on campus, with at least one being more successful then him.

In the last few years, he has openly appreciated what UT means to him and how great of fans that we have. If you think he's honest, then those are his words and feelings.
 
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#641
#641
Jaxon_Vol2017 said:
So you're happy with just making the elite 8? That's not good enough for the Tennessee standard. Without even knowing your age, I can tell you're young. The everyone gets a trophy generation.
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I am happy with two straight EEs, great players, great culture and great kids with a staff that does things the right way. While I hope to get beyond the EE soon, I have no problem keeping Barnes. What is this "standard" of which you speak? Have you bothered to review our basketball history? You are the one that sounds young.
And I will wager I am older than you.
 
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#642
#642
Jaxon_Vol2017 said:
So you're happy with just making the elite 8? That's not good enough for the Tennessee standard. Without even knowing your age, I can tell you're young. The everyone gets a trophy generation.
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😂😂😂😂😂 what, are we a Tobacco Road program now or something?

Also, you do realize your generation is the one giving the current generation these “participation trophies” right
 
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#643
#643
HeuperDrive said:
😂😂😂😂😂 what, are we a Tobacco Road program now or something?

Also, you do realize your generation is the one giving the current generation these “participation trophies” right
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It kills me, I was given my first participation trophy when I was like 6 for soccer and I threw it away right after. I didn't ask for it and I knew then for me it was worthless. Other kids liked them and that's cool too, whatever floats your boat. But we didn't ask for them, parents did.
 
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#645
#645
VolInNW said:
IMHO, Barnes is a great coach and will be the Tennessee coach as long as he wants. And I think the program is in a very good place because of his work here.

The lesson I have learned from him is this: when you are the leader of a group of people who care passionately about a 'cause' or 'program', whatever, you NEVER indicate that you are not committed to that cause and are instead a mercenary. It may be true, and with limited circumstances where a coach is coaching his/her alma mater, almost always IS the case that coaches don't internalize their fan base's passion. And the fans, deep in their heart, know that. BUT, you NEVER wave that in their face. That is almost an unrecoverable transgression to a lot of fans.

In Barnes' case, he isn't passionate about Tennessee, and it makes sense he wouldn't be. He didn't attend the school, he isn't from Tennessee, and didn't grow up a fan. He is loyal to Tennessee because his paycheck comes from here and he tends to build solid relationships with the players he recruits and coaches. And that's fine, and is the same case with 95% of coaches out there. What he did was broadcast that fact with the UCLA fiasco. Waved it in the fans' faces. It's emotional immaturity and a COMPLETE self-focused failure to read the room on his part. Barnes strikes me as fairly arrogant, but he strikes me as a savvy, ethical and honest person. I have no doubt he would walk that back if he could.

For a decent chunk of fans, Barnes will never recover from that, and unless he wins a NC will never be allowed back into the fold. For me? I'm happy with his results here, I hope he stays for a while and makes a FF, and I hope and pray our AD uses the incredible momentum Barnes has built to make an eventual replacement home-run hire (to mix sports metaphors).

What would be SOOOO VERY TENNESSEE would be to take a step backwards and hire an 'up and comer' mid-major who flames out. For all the folks who want Barnes gone tomorrow, remember the history here, and be VERY careful what you wish for.
Click to expand...
Thinking Barnes isn't passionate about UT is crazy. That remark is pretty far off the mark
 
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#646
#646
VolsSportsFan said:
It's funny, his types whine about "pariticipation trophy" mentality but honestly the "number 1 or nothing" mentality is WAYYYY more damaging imo. Like if you don't finish first everything is worthless?
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Agree. The “number one or nothing” mentality is how you end up with a boat full of sports programs at a university that aren’t any good. Two Elite Eights in a row but no national championship? Gotta run the coach out of town. The only coach you can hire after pulling a stunt like that is one who is desperate, probably unemployed or on the verge of being unemployed with nothing to lose.

Hopefully we never end up with a leadership team that views things through such a foolish lens.
 
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#649
#649
VolsSportsFan said:
It's funny, his types whine about "pariticipation trophy" mentality but honestly the "number 1 or nothing" mentality is WAYYYY more damaging imo. Like if you don't finish first everything is worthless?
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Couldn’t agree more. Every time a Cinderella ends up inevitably losing in March, you’ll see an army of people mocking them for celebrating their achievement because “you didn’t win it all, who cares?”

They do. Their fans care. When the players are old and gray they’ll tell their grandkids about that time they upset the 2 seed.

This tournament is hard. Making back to back E8's is hard. Getting past the first weekend is hard, for Christs sake. The fact we’ve managed it two years straight is a hell of an achievement, and if getting to back to back E8's isn’t “good enough” for you, then you’re never gonna be pleased.
 
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