The Official New York Knicks Thread.

#151
#151
nbakerld said:
Scouts rely on film and in case you haven't noticed, scouts are wrong about their talent assessments quite a bit.
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That must be why so many NBA all-stars are stuck in the D-League, those crappy scouts just won't look at the stats and give them a shot.
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#152
#152
nbakerld said:
Scouts rely on film and in case you haven't noticed, scouts are wrong about their talent assessments quite a bit.
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I'm sure this would help. The Bulls would be so much better if they had gone with the stats and taken Michael Beasley.
 
#153
#153
Nice win against an improving team. Typical crappy game from Melo again. What a waste of money he is.
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#154
#154
bamacheats said:
Nice win against an improving team. Typical crappy game from Melo again. What a waste of money he is.
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Everyone has good games. It's about what he does on average. It's a good thing he made the shot because it was his careless foul that tied it up.
 
#155
#155
bamacheats said:
That must be why so many NBA all-stars are stuck in the D-League, those crappy scouts just won't look at the stats and give them a shot.
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How do you know there aren't guys that are good in the D-league if they haven't been given a chance? Lofton? Also, how many horrible players got drafted before Carlos Boozer? There's a lot of examples like Boozer, too.
 
#156
#156
nbakerld said:
How do you know there aren't guys that are good in the D-league if they haven't been given a chance? Lofton? Also, how many horrible players got drafted before Carlos Boozer? There's a lot of examples like Boozer, too.
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You're reaching now. Loften is not an NBA player. The NBA is already watered down, there are already D-League players on rosters that don't belong.
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#157
#157
bamacheats said:
You're reaching now. Loften is not an NBA player. The NBA is already watered down, there are already D-League players on rosters that don't belong.
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If Redick (who is considered by NBA analysts to be productive) is an NBA player, why isn't LoftOn? Lofton was shooting 43% from 3 pt in D league while Redick is shooting 39%. Sure Redick has 2" on him, but why does that matter if they are set shooters and neither plays D? Lofton is a better ballhandler, too.
 
#158
#158
nbakerld said:
If Redick (who is considered by NBA analysts to be productive) is an NBA player, why isn't LoftOn? Lofton was shooting 43% from 3 pt in D league while Redick is shooting 39%. Sure Redick has 2" on him, but why does that matter if they are set shooters and neither plays D? Lofton is a better ballhandler, too.
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Neither belong. What part of "the NBA is watered down" don't you understand?
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#159
#159
nbakerld said:
If Redick (who is considered by NBA analysts to be productive) is an NBA player, why isn't LoftOn? Lofton was shooting 43% from 3 pt in D league while Redick is shooting 39%. Sure Redick has 2" on him, but why does that matter if they are set shooters and neither plays D? Lofton is a better ballhandler, too.
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Redick shoots better, passes better, and plays better D than Lofton.
 
#160
#160
nbakerld said:
Well because Memphis makes their shots more frequently. Did you really just ask that question?
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Their paces aren't very different at all...and I love how you ignored the actual details of why Love sucks on D because there aren't any stats to dispute it.
 
#161
#161
bamacheats said:
Neither belong. What part of "the NBA is watered down" don't you understand?
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You say it, but it isn't true. Unfortunately competitive balance has never been very good in the NBA. Statistics and research backs this up. Your opinion is merely your opinion. It's also just your opinion that Redick doesn't belong. Hmmm...this doesn't really make sense. If these scouts know so much why is he there?
 
#162
#162
VKAman said:
Their paces aren't very different at all...and I love how you ignored the actual details of why Love sucks on D because there aren't any stats to dispute it.
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Honestly, I don't really have anything else to say to you. Bamacheats is barely worth arguing with, but you don't make the cut.

There are stats that support Love is good at D. 10 defensive rebounds per game is an enormous contribution and 2 fouls per game is good efficiency. If you can come up with stats that show me Love surrenders more points and a higher FG% than the average PF, I'll believe you. You can't. All you can do is offer an opinion that Love can't stay in front of his man, and that he leaves his man to pad his stats.
 
#163
#163
nbakerld said:
Honestly, I don't really have anything else to say to you. Bamacheats is barely worth arguing with, but you don't make the cut.

There are stats that support Love is good at D. 10 defensive rebounds per game is an enormous contribution and 2 fouls per game is good efficiency. If you can come up with stats that show me Love surrenders more points and a higher FG% than the average PF, I'll believe you. You can't. All you can do is offer an opinion that Love can't stay in front of his man, and that he leaves his man to pad his stats.
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Pretty difficult to foul when you're not playing defense. I'm literally telling you what he does and why he's a bad defender (feel free to ask any knowledgeable T-Wolves fan you know; they'll agree) and your response is, "I haven't actually watched him, but he rebounds so he's a good defender."

The fact that there's no stat for individual FG defense would seem to be a failure of the stats you're endlessly touting, not a fault of mine, and it proves my point: stats can't tell you much, especially on defense. Sorry if that strikes a nerve, Mr. Statistician, but if you're honestly trying to tell me that scouts should replace film with numbers, you really can't say anything about who's "worth arguing with."
 
#164
#164
I thought the common wisdom in hoops was that lazy defense leads to fouls?

Bottom line is there are very few players in the NBA that are paid for their on-the-ball defense. And most of them aren't paid much at all. What does that tell you about the importance of defense?

I didn't say replace film. You need film for the draft because college stats aren't totally reliable because they aren't earned against NBA players. There is no need to scout established players like Melo. You can look at his NBA stats and know what you are going to get from him.

Take care, man.
 
#165
#165
nbakerld said:
Bottom line is there are very few players in the NBA that are paid for their on-the-ball defense. And most of them aren't paid much at all. What does that tell you about the importance of defense?
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How did Wesley Matthews go from an undrafted rookie free agent to a guy with a $35 million contract in one year?

Why did OKC go out and get Kendrick Perkins?

How did Rajon Rondo become a starter? Why wouldn't Boston trade a rookie Rondo for KG?

Why is Ron Artest still in the NBA?

Why does James Harden come off the bench?

Etc.
 
#166
#166
nbakerld said:
You say it, but it isn't true. Unfortunately competitive balance has never been very good in the NBA. Statistics and research backs this up. Your opinion is merely your opinion. It's also just your opinion that Redick doesn't belong. Hmmm...this doesn't really make sense. If these scouts know so much why is he there?
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The more you post the dumber you're sounding. He's in the league because its watered down.
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#167
#167
VKAman said:
How did Wesley Matthews go from an undrafted rookie free agent to a guy with a $35 million contract in one year?

Why did OKC go out and get Kendrick Perkins?

How did Rajon Rondo become a starter? Why wouldn't Boston trade a rookie Rondo for KG?

Why is Ron Artest still in the NBA?

Why does James Harden come off the bench?

Etc.
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So you can name 5 guys that play defense? Congrats. I told you there were a few. Also, KG is much more valuable defender than Rondo, so if defense is the key why wouldn't they trade Rondo for KG? Also, I'd argue Rondo is primarily paid for his offense.

BTW, OKC got better offensively and defensively in that trade. Green isn't a good player. OKC made the trade because it was an all around steal.
 
#168
#168
bamacheats said:
The more you post the dumber you're sounding. He's in the league because its watered down.
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Yet, from all over the world, we have more people playing basketball than ever before. We have the largest talent pool the NBA has ever been able to choose from. Not to mention training and coaching from Boys Club to NCAA is improving as well. But I guess since you say the league talent is watered down, it must be true.
 
#169
#169
nbakerld said:
Yet, from all over the world, we have more people playing basketball than ever before. We have the largest talent pool the NBA has ever been able to choose from. Not to mention training and coaching from Boys Club to NCAA is improving as well. But I guess since you say the league talent is watered down, it must be true.
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The fact that you think Lofton belongs in the NBA, amidst this vast talent pool of worldwide talent, proves to me that even you realize its watered down, you've just dug too deep of a hole with your pride and can't own up to it.
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#170
#170
bamacheats said:
The fact that you think Lofton belongs in the NBA, amidst this vast talent pool of worldwide talent, proves to me that even you realize its watered down, you've just dug too deep of a hole with your pride and can't own up to it.
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According to my opinion of what indicates a good basketball player (statistical efficiency), Lofton is VERY productive, and would be productive in any era. If I didn't think this, I would have never brought up Lofton. 43% from 3 pt when league average is 35%, and efficient shooting starts at 33%. I'd say he's good enough to be an NBA sharpshooter.
 
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#171
#171
nbakerld said:
According to my opinion of what indicates a good basketball player (statistical efficiency), Lofton is VERY productive, and would be productive in any era. If I didn't think this, I would have never brought up Lofton. 43% from 3 pt when league average is 35%, and efficient shooting starts at 33%. I'd say he's good enough to be an NBA sharpshooter.
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He would never shoot above 35% in the NBA.
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#173
#173
nbakerld said:
According to my opinion of what indicates a good basketball player (statistical efficiency), Lofton is VERY productive, and would be productive in any era. If I didn't think this, I would have never brought up Lofton. 43% from 3 pt when league average is 35%, and efficient shooting starts at 33%. I'd say he's good enough to be an NBA sharpshooter.
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Hey remember when you said "college stats aren't totally reliable because they aren't earned against NBA players?" Because you said it about 5 minutes before you started quoting other stats that weren't earned against NBA players...
 
#174
#174
VKAman said:
Hey remember when you said "college stats aren't totally reliable because they aren't earned against NBA players?" Because you said it about 5 minutes before you started quoting other stats that weren't earned against NBA players...
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D-league players are on the cusp of being NBA players. The large majority of college players aren't good enough to make the D-league. If they were NBA stats they would be more reliable, but the 3 point line is the same distance, perimeter defense is close in quality, I don't know why it wouldn't translate. He is not going to be a guy that comes into the NBA and creates a shot 10 times a night. He's going to come off screens and get open looks when others are double teamed. What makes you clowns think he'll suddenly start missing shots just because he's in the NBA?
 
#175
#175
nbakerld said:
So you can name 5 guys that play defense? Congrats. I told you there were a few. Also, KG is much more valuable defender than Rondo, so if defense is the key why wouldn't they trade Rondo for KG? Also, I'd argue Rondo is primarily paid for his offense.

BTW, OKC got better offensively and defensively in that trade. Green isn't a good player. OKC made the trade because it was an all around steal.
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You're telling me the league doesn't value it while the league is simultaneously giving out $35 million contracts to undrafted rookies because of their defense. While Boston absolutely refuses to give up Rondo because of his defense. While OKC leaves their lottery pick on the bench so they can start defense, and then makes a trade to acquire interior defense. Keep telling me GMs don't care about it. They're too busy telling each other how Kevin Love is the next Dwight Howard.
 
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