Sec and the coaches........

#29
#29
TuskALoosa said:
Nick and Rick will form the Alabama Empire and together they will rule the SEC forever!!!
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A little slump in the schedule has you guys ready to hang Mark Gottfried??

Same thing happened to the Gators during conference play last year.
 
#32
#32
Rick Pitino in Bama would be like Tony Soprano running the mob in Pigeon Forge.
 
#33
#33
lawgator1 said:
Meyer (current national champion)
Donovan (current national champion)

The others you can argue about. But I don't see how you can say that head-coaching wise there is anyone more deserving than the two Florida coaches given that they hold the top prize possible for their respective sports.
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I do not think Meyer could win 7 games a year at SC. I have to go with Spurrier.
 
#35
#35
I love how everyone is allowing one season to completely rewrite history. Tubby Smith has used Billy Donovan as a pinata for the better part of a decade. Donovan wins one title, something Smith had already done, and suddenly he is the new Naismith. How good a job did Donovan do in '04-'05? He has had more seasons of underachievement than excellence in his tenure.
 
#36
#36
lawgator1 said:
Meyer (current national champion)
Donovan (current national champion)

The others you can argue about. But I don't see how you can say that head-coaching wise there is anyone more deserving than the two Florida coaches given that they hold the top prize possible for their respective sports.
Click to expand...

This quickly turned into a gator circle jerk thread....
 
#38
#38
hatvol96 said:
I love how everyone is allowing one season to completely rewrite history. Tubby Smith has used Billy Donovan as a pinata for the better part of a decade. Donovan wins one title, something Smith had already done, and suddenly he is the new Naismith. How good a job did Donovan do in '04-'05? He has had more seasons of underachievement than excellence in his tenure.
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I agree with your comment ONLY in the sense that Donovan for his first ten years recruited in his own image. Up through the time of Mike Miller, et.al., he recruited guards and short forwards that he converted to guards. He did not pay enough attention to big men underneath. Obviously, wiht the likes of Horford, Chris Richards, and Noah, he has come to realize that inside dominance is the key to deep NCAA tournament runs.

Gone are the days of 40 minutes of full court pressure. Here to stay are the days of total domination of the glass. Donovan has really matured a lot.

To the extent the question is, who is the best coach right now, its Donovan, by a mile. Yes, if you want to compare overall accomplishments, he's got some making up to do. But I think that now that he knows he needs some 7 footers in there to compete with UNC, Kansas, OSU, and the like, he'll catch up fast.
 
#40
#40
lawgator1 said:
I agree with your comment ONLY in the sense that Donovan for his first ten years recruited in his own image. Up through the time of Mike Miller, et.al., he recruited guards and short forwards that he converted to guards. He did not pay enough attention to big men underneath. Obviously, wiht the likes of Horford, Chris Richards, and Noah, he has come to realize that inside dominance is the key to deep NCAA tournament runs.

Gone are the days of 40 minutes of full court pressure. Here to stay are the days of total domination of the glass. Donovan has really matured a lot.

To the extent the question is, who is the best coach right now, its Donovan, by a mile. Yes, if you want to compare overall accomplishments, he's got some making up to do. But I think that now that he knows he needs some 7 footers in there to compete with UNC, Kansas, OSU, and the like, he'll catch up fast.
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As I've said before, the last 10 National Champions do not bear your theory out. College basketball is a guard's game. Plenty of teams have won without seven footers. Nobody has won without competent guard play. Without Taurean Green, Florida would be hard pressed to stay in the top 15.
 
#41
#41
Look at Bama right now. With Steele suffering to keep up with the other PGs of the SEC because of his bum ankle, they are struggling to stay afloat now. Suffice to say that SEC lacks the level of coaching in basketball that the football teams have.

If one has to choose it is a toss up between Tubby and Donovan, but each has a series of great seasons to match their down years. Right now the hotter coach is Billy D- he's in his upswing, and Tubby is sliding.
 
#42
#42
hatvol96 said:
As I've said before, the last 10 National Champions do not bear your theory out. College basketball is a guard's game. Plenty of teams have won without seven footers. Nobody has won without competent guard play. Without Taurean Green, Florida would be hard pressed to stay in the top 15.
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You can probably point to individual championship games where guard play and perimeter shooting in particular made all the difference. But I think if you take a wholistic view, the teams that tend to get the farthest are the teams that can bang it around down deep -- if for no other reason than that at some point during the first four games your shooters are bound to have an off night and you need to be able to score in the 50's just to win one and advance.

Last year's Final Four: Florida, LSU, UCLA, George Mason, were all teams very much dependent on big men, rebounding, and defense inside the paint. Gone were the Villanovas.

Like I say, you may be right that guards can win particular games for you, but I maintain that ordinarily you need a very strong inside presence to weather those tournament games when it just isn't going in from 18 feet.
 
#44
#44
Villanova didn't have Curtis Sumpter, had they had him, it would have been a totally different story. He was a superb rebounding guard and was one of the toughest guys in NCAA basketball.
 
#46
#46
Other than a Duke team here or there, I really cannot think of many (in fact any) guard-dominant teams that consistently made it to the Final Four.

Now you start talking the old days with the Big East and Georgetown or Uconn, or some of the Big Ten teams over the years, like Michigan, or go west and talk Kansas....

Big Bigger Biggest

Biggest wins.
 
#47
#47
lawgator1 said:
Other than a Duke team here or there, I really cannot think of many (in fact any) guard-dominant teams that consistently made it to the Final Four.

Now you start talking the old days with the Big East and Georgetown or Uconn, or some of the Big Ten teams over the years, like Michigan, or go west and talk Kansas....

Big Bigger Biggest

Biggest wins.
Click to expand...

Sorry, Michigan State, I mean.
 
#48
#48
lawgator1 said:
You can probably point to individual championship games where guard play and perimeter shooting in particular made all the difference. But I think if you take a wholistic view, the teams that tend to get the farthest are the teams that can bang it around down deep -- if for no other reason than that at some point during the first four games your shooters are bound to have an off night and you need to be able to score in the 50's just to win one and advance.

Last year's Final Four: Florida, LSU, UCLA, George Mason, were all teams very much dependent on big men, rebounding, and defense inside the paint. Gone were the Villanovas.

Like I say, you may be right that guards can win particular games for you, but I maintain that ordinarily you need a very strong inside presence to weather those tournament games when it just isn't going in from 18 feet.
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Exactly who are the dominant big men who played for UCLA and George Mason? How many dominant seven footers were on the floor for the final between Carolina and Illinois? I guess you have just ignored the decade long run by Michigan State, built on guard play. You must have never seen the Arizona team that won in '97. The first UCONN title team must have escaped your view. The Arkansas and Kentucky championship teams must have been blacked out in your region. I guess you consider Craig Forth a key member of the Syracuse title team. Look at the last 10 National Champions, there is a common thread. It is not dominant inside play.
 
#49
#49
lawgator1 said:
Other than a Duke team here or there, I really cannot think of many (in fact any) guard-dominant teams that consistently made it to the Final Four.

Now you start talking the old days with the Big East and Georgetown or Uconn, or some of the Big Ten teams over the years, like Michigan, or go west and talk Kansas....

Big Bigger Biggest


Biggest wins.
Click to expand...
I am truly beginning to wonder if you watched any college basketball before last March. You even referenced a school that destroys your argument, Georgetown. When they had Ewing, they also had guys like Sleepy Floyd, Michael Jackson, David Wingate, Reggie Williams in the backcourt. Those teams went to three finals games in four years. A few years later, the Hoyas had Alonzo Mourning and Diekembe Mutombo. They had horrible guards. They appeared in exactly zero Final Fours.
 
#50
#50
Man only if I gave a damn about College Basketball outside of Tennessee I could be all up in this debate but I don't at all.

I really wish I could get into College Basketball but I'll turn it on TV and watch the first 5 minutes of Duke vs. Clemson and just get bored, but I can watch a D-2 Football National Championship game from start to finnish, and be all into the game.

I watch baseball more intently than basketball and I hate watching baseball even though I play it.

EDIT: Pro Basketball and Hockey are about on the same level with me could care less if they stopped playing their respected sports because when the high lights come on SC I turn thre channel. The time between the Super Bowl and Spring Training is going to be long.
 
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